How do I fill in this form about ‘gender identity’?

[53rdWay]

Have to complete a form for work. One of the questions is this:

Gender identity
1)
a) I live and work in the same gender role to that assigned to me at birth
b) I live and work in the opposite gender role to that assigned at my birth
c) prefer not to say.

a) my gender identity is the same as that assigned to me at birth
b) my gender identity is the opposite to that assigned to me at birth
c) prefer not to say.

This is a web form. One of the answers must be ticked, & there is no space for comments. So I could tick box c) for both - but I would indeed prefer to say exactly what my problem is with these questions!

Am thinking of refusing to do it and sending back a brief explanation of what my problem is with this (not least that we’re in an area that has had big problems with recruiting/promoting women - thank heavens for all those women who battled their way through rather than working in the gender roles assigned to them! FFS.)

What would you say?

And trans women loose jobs because they get outed and the bosses are bigots.

That may be so, but it's a different thing to the main reasons which in reality cause women's pay to lag. There is probably a combination of factors, some of which are 'gender' but you cannot deny the reality many of us have experienced, that our pay ends up lower purely because we are biologically female 'Of or denoting the sex that can bear offspring...'.

Transwomen are over represented in STEM compared to the general population.
Women are vastly underrepresented in STEM compared to the general population.

These transwomen in STEM enable the company to tick the "gender inclusive" box without needing to employ those pesky pregnant-getting-people.

Transwomen by virtue of being male have an advantage over women in almost all situations, the the same as males do.

Orange can I point out my questions too? Education apparently badly needed.

And trans women loose jobs because they get outed and the bosses are bigots.

Do please sign post me too to the newspaper articles, the wrongful dismissal cases and the whopping payouts that must have been involved, because wow. How has that not been all over the media? Where were Stonewall and the BBC, Question Time, The Guardian, The Independent, pretty much every male radio presenter alive.....? Surely they'd have been all over publicising that?! The names and faces would be at the front of every TRA campaign.

I think Pippa Bunce would have a problem filling out that form. There is no space for how many days a week you are either gender.

Anyone that start starts chucking bigot into posts is shutting down the conversation. The reason for every point of view you don't understand or like is NOT bigotry.

And trans women loose jobs because they get outed and the bosses are bigots.

How does one loose a job? Set it free to roam in the wild?

No, they don't. They might not get jobs they apply for because of covert discrimination. They might feel pressured to resign from jobs because of a discriminatory and hostile work environment. Both these things are wrong. That's why we already have laws protecting trans people from this.

They don't get directly sacked because bosses find out they're trans: 1) this is illegal and the bosses would be liable in court, 2) nobody gets outed because trans people almost never pass so everybody knows perfectly they well they are trans from day one.

Hear, hear!

54,000 females each YEAR in the UK are forced out of their jobs because of pregnancy and maternity discrimination:

www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/culture/culture-news/a19397215/charity-maternity-action-pregnancy-discrimination-workplace-mothers-day/

jellyfrizz is infuriating - I hate these forms they just erase forms. I can only imagine they are really helpful to business getting out of equal opportunity obligations.

It totally concerns me that HR departments which are often headed by women are sending out this bullshit.

54,000! That is a mind blowing number of women.

For the purposes stated, surely all they need to know is which protected characteristics apply to employees. In relation to gender reassignment, they could supply a definition and a tick box if this applies to any given employee.
Anything further than that seems disproportionate and therefore problematic in relation to data protection

I've done many 100s, actually almost certainly into 1000s, of baby checks. I have never assigned a gender role. I have identified the biological sex. As a usually very minor part of the baby check. It is incredibly difficult for the parents when it is not an easy and minor part of the baby check.

I find the terminology in the questionnaire quite offensive impugning motives to the paediatric team (and, increasingly, midwives) that are not there.

orangepie

Gender is how we are judged not our sex organ that people and see when applying and working a job.

Yep, come back when you are 60 and tell us how that worked out for you.

Thankfully there is plans already to update the birth certs to change the word sex to gender with our more reasoned understanding of gender now.

WTF!

My sex is female, my gender is that imposed on me by societal norms related to my sex and a history of oppression.

How would you observe 'gender' in babies anyway? "Okay newborn, do you like the high heels or the steel-toed boots?"

I’ve lost a job, promotion, pension contributions as a result of my biological sex - I had three babies.

Out of interest - that is a badly written form and I’m a bit confused.

It is about gender roles -so how does a biological women who is a firearms commander/riot cop identity? She is performing a traditionally male gendered role? So is she ‘performing masculinity’ while st work? Blonde highlights and lipstick too?

our more reasoned understanding of gender now

I have a new nickname for anyone who talks this pomo-addled nonsense. Mimi. In honour of the character in Jo Brand's Damned, played brilliantly by Lolly Adefope.

Dear Mimi - you don't have a more reasoned understanding of gender now. You are mistaking material reality (sex) with an oppressive social system that privileges the penis (gender) and your understanding of gender is, at best, Victorian. HTH.

I'd have thought you could only do it in cases where the parents had had a 'gender scan' precisely so that they knew from the off which colour babygro to put on their newborn.

'Gender' may indeed start to be assigned, not by the medics but by the families. Whereas the sex of a baby can be observed even before birth - before s/he has the first glimmerings of sentience or 'feeling'. You can tell the sex of an embryo. I knew the sex of my baby before birth from a drop of amniotic fluid.

Gender is how we are judged not our sex organ that people and see when applying and working a job.

You try getting a job or going for promotion when six months pregnant. You take a year maternity leave and see how far you get promoted in that time.

It is so disingenuous to claim that biology has no relevance and thst gender is the thing that matters when it comes to equality.

The transgender woman will never get pregnant and will be able to climb the corporate ladder unhindered by all the messiness that comes along with being a biological woman. And that will be regarded as a triumph for womanhood all the while biological women are getting on with it, trying to ‘have it all.’

If you are a young woman applying for a job with a small company the owner will be wondering if you are going to get pregnant and how much it will cost them.

Women are still discriminated at the starting gate and in consideration for career advancement because of the 'she might get pregnant' thought.

40% of managers avoid hiring younger women to get around maternity leave:

www.theguardian.com/money/2014/aug/12/managers-avoid-hiring-younger-women-maternity-leave

Gender is how we are judged because of our sex organs, rather than as individuals.

There is no 'reasoned understanding of gender' at the moment. Gender seems to mean whatever the hell someone wants it to, yet bizarrely its being reified while the fundamental importance of actual biological reality is being dismissed.

There is no 'reasoned understanding of gender' at the moment. Gender seems to mean whatever the hell someone wants it to, yet bizarrely its being reified while the fundamental importance of actual biological reality is being dismissed.

That's exactly it. It's so absurd that I suspect an agenda not only driven by the TRAs but an attempt to weaken women's legal position in the workplace overall. As with the attack on AWS which provides grounds for getting rid of them altogether.

Orange There was no doctor at the birth of my three children - all born within a decade. Just midwives. The consultants came in at the birth of my first child to perform expiration because baby did a poo and it showed up when my waters broke. Thankfully, all was fine.

It was agreed twice the sex of baby one and baby two as we had no idea of the sex because they didn't do sexing on scans - London hospital. We knew the sex of baby three and this was confirmed.

No one mention gender at all.

Re OP Please do write to them regarding this. It's so badly formed. Most would put other. But I agree that it shouldn't be there at all. It's nonsensical.