How do I fill in this form about ‘gender identity’?

[53rdWay]

Have to complete a form for work. One of the questions is this:

Gender identity
1)
a) I live and work in the same gender role to that assigned to me at birth
b) I live and work in the opposite gender role to that assigned at my birth
c) prefer not to say.

a) my gender identity is the same as that assigned to me at birth
b) my gender identity is the opposite to that assigned to me at birth
c) prefer not to say.

This is a web form. One of the answers must be ticked, & there is no space for comments. So I could tick box c) for both - but I would indeed prefer to say exactly what my problem is with these questions!

Am thinking of refusing to do it and sending back a brief explanation of what my problem is with this (not least that we’re in an area that has had big problems with recruiting/promoting women - thank heavens for all those women who battled their way through rather than working in the gender roles assigned to them! FFS.)

What would you say?

FFS.

I'd refuse too - send it back, explaining your reasons.

'Gender assigned at birth' is a phrase that is only relevant in the vanishingly small number of cases in which babies are born with ambiguous external genitals. It is an anachronism dating back to times before DNA testing when many of these babies would have been assigned 'girl' at birth and had surgery done asap (because, for obvious reasons it is easier to fashion some kind of a vaginal opening than a convincing penis), leading to all sorts of misery and hardship when puberty hit (testosterone imprinting happens in the womb, so those with an XY chromosome assigned 'girl' at birth did struggle later on').
This is why the small number of true intersex babies now born, DNA testing is standard and provided their genitals are functional i.e. allow them to void their bladder, any possible surgery will be deferred until the child is old enough to at least understand what may be happening to them or be old enough to have legal capacity to consent.

No adult human male or female with the appropriate set of chromosomes has been 'assigned' anything at birth.

Like I said, FFS

This is the whole problem, we are forced by this tick box Stonewall imposed monitoring to submit to this coercive supervision.

Yes. I mean, had they asked are you on the transgender spectrum? I presume you would have had no problem answering? You can just say no, I am not.

The framing of the question is that you must have a gender identity. It's like having the religion question as Are you Protestant or Catholic? when you're Jewish, or Muslim or Sikh or atheist. You're coerced into entering a false categorisation of yourself.

I do not have a gender identity. I do not believe anybody has a gender identity. I believe people have a sex, a sexuality and a personality. Why should I have to describe myself in terms of something I don't believe exists?

I'd contact and in a bewildered tone ask for a description please of the two gender roles on offer: are they talking clothes, split of household chores, hobbies, hair length, make up choices: you need to see the two role boxes they would like people to define themselves against. That ought to shut them up since it's impossible to do without major recourse to stereotypes. If they then send you a list you have all kinds of options including who wrote the list, is it subjective, is this compared to national standards, what national guidance are they following about what the 'role' of each 'gender' is seen to be?

If they get past all that (they won't), you can then explain you don't identify with either role OR a trans identity either, but you do have a biological sex, and watch their heads explode.

This crap all completely relies on people just going along with the open secret that everyone knows what a woman and a man is and there's no such thing as 'gender roles' that people 'choose'. There's biological sex and personal choice and that's it.

I would refuse, and say why - nobody is "assigned a gender".

We must stop going along with this bullshit

I’d refuse to fill it out on the basis that I only recognise gender as a social construct. If they would like to send me a form regarding my sex and biology I’d be happy to fill it in.

They form is erasing your protected characteristics.

Or yes I would go down Knee’s route and ask for a description of the two genders and perhaps the meaning of man or woman.

They appear to have only offered 2 'genders' as suggested by their use of the word 'opposote'.

You could ask them which 2 of they 112 genders they mean.

Admittedly, I only got to C, but maybe many of us would fall under Cassgender - the feeling of gender isn't important to you.

Although I get the impression it's supposed to mean something a lot more 'interesting' than "fuck off with your meaningless, socially constructed gender roles."

Right, have replied saying that I don’t have a “gender identity”, gender is a social construct used to oppress women, plus that I find the question about gender roles at work to be offensive. I mean, how am I working in a female gender role? What would that mean? Makeup and heels and hair twirling and letting men do all the talking in meetings?

Will see if they get back to me to discuss, but I doubt it...

Good on you OP

OP not sure what your issue is the doctor assigned you female gender at birth

If you still feel your gender is female you select - live and work in the same gender role to that assigned to me at birth

If you now feel your gender is male you select - I live and work in the opposite gender role to that assigned at my birth

If you now feel you have no gender or gender nonconforming you select - prefer not to say and go to HR about the missing other option.

It's not hard, I don't see the issue other than they forgot the "Other" option from the start.

The doctor observed that her sex was female at birth.
Society attributes gendered characteristics which feminists generally try to counter and reject.

orange
The doctor did not assign her gender at birth. The doctor recognised her sex.

You all realise that sex and gender where not understood the same back then just like homosexuality. Thankfully there is plans already to update the birth certs to change the word sex to gender with our more reasoned understanding of gender now.

Back when orange?

orange - what is the difference between sex and gender, in your opinion?

Gender is what you feel and present to the world, sex is body parts and unimportant to how you feel and present.

Gender is the consciousness and what is important, sex is flesh.

orangepie, what is your agenda?
Seriously, what is it that you are trying to achieve?

Sex is a biological fact, we may like the sex we were born in to or not, we may easily slip in to the gender attributes that society tells us 'should' go with that sex, or we may not. Gender is a social construct, a feeling, and giving it power over public policy is part of a society in which feeling trumps facts, individuals feelings somehow have become more important for decisions affecting public policy than what affects vast majorities of people, and in particular women.

@orangepie
There was no doctor there when I was born. There was no doctor there when my mother was born. There was no doctor there when I gave birth to my two kids.

Should I pop down to the GP and ask for us all to be assigned?

Go to HR about this missing option? I work in HR and trust me, we all laugh at this pomo twaddle.

Orange

The World Health Organization (WHO) defines gender roles as "socially constructed roles, behaviors, activities and attributes that a given society considers appropriate for men and women"

Please could you point me to the UK society defined appropriate behaviours, activities and attributes for women? (And who is in that society and how did they work out which went with which?)

Who polices them?

What happens if some of my behaviours, activities and attributes aren't deemed appropriate by these standards?

S0ph1a wrote - "I wasn’t assigned a gender role at birth"

Everyone is assigned a gender role, more accurately a sex role (behaviour expected by society for each biological sex) at birth, based on the person's observed (or very rarely, assigned) biological sex. Whether or not someone does the behaviours or not is another matter, but the person's conformity or non-conformity does not mean that gender role was not assigned at birth. Gender role is not biological sex. Gender role is not gender identity (which is how masculine/feminine/male/female you feel and therefore allegedly "are").

Biological sex is observed at birth for male and female people with unambiguous sexual characteristics. The very small number of intersex people are assigned a biological sex shortly after birth. Intersex is very rare. Intersex is not transsexuality nor transgender.

orange
So how would I, as a clinician be able to tell how a baby feels about their gender?

If all record of a person shows them to be “female” (when they are anatomically male) because of how they identify, how do I then account for differences in serological results and also for that matter when it comes to prescribing medication?

orangepie do you really actually believe that nonsense?

sex is body parts and unimportant to how you feel and present.

Well if I present with no bra and top on it certainly seems rather important. I feel a bit yuck because my female body parts are doing their female thing, wearing trousers doesn't seem to identify me out of that?

Oh yes, if I get a new birth certificate it will be ok. This is the modern solution not like back then. When was back then exactly?