Spectator article: Don't fall for it people

[JenniferJames]

Comrades,

The framing of the self-id debate as 'Corbynistas vs. Mumsnet' is a deliberate tactic by the right wing propaganda machine and done to undermine Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour party and paint it as hopelessly divided. We're not.

It is important to remember that only a Corbyn gov't will lift women out of poverty, build homes, invest in the economy, make tuition fees free and stop invading the Middle East. Jeremy, though he doesn't hold our position, is the only Labour MP who has not only come out and said that women are entitled to a debate and to campaign against self-id, but that we have a right to raise money to see if the Equalities Act 2010 exemptions are being misused by AWS.

Hope everyone is well. Mumsnet you are indeed mighty.

We do need to remember that the poster calling herself Jennifer James may be an imposter

Could be but her reaction to Kirkups tweet on her Twitter would suggest not.

I agree piglet, but the difference between her comments on Go Fund Me and here/Twitter is striking.

Right now the right are pissing themselves laughing at the left tearing itself apart yet again

And the poor and sick suffer.

How does self ID benefit the poor and sick?

for Askbasil. Exactly.

I don't want a tory government. But Corbyn has been on MN, he has spoken to us, he has shut us down and answered questions about biscuits (poorly). He knows and he doesn't care. And if he has heard the screaming of women and decided what they are screaming about isn't worth investigating for 20 minutes he can fuck the fuck off.

He's either lazy, sexist or stupid and he doesn't strike me as lazy or stupid.

Right now the right are pissing themselves laughing at the left tearing itself apart yet again

And the right tore itself apart with UKIP and the tories. That's how politics works. That's how it is supposed to work. Can't apologize for it and we can't back down.

Yet again women's rights are somehow "other", nevermind that the "poor and sick" aren't a separate group to women. Women are hugely represented within that group, and those poor and sick women will see their rights eroded if self-ID is accepted as the way to determine who is a woman.

Poor and sick women need safe spaces too, especially as poor and sick women are especially vulnerable to domestic violence and less able to escape it without the help of refuges.

Even if you don't accept that women are in that group, why is it women who are expected to sacrifice their rights? We are not here just to look after everyone else, we are people in our own rights, with our own needs. And I'm personally fed up of women being expected to put everyone else first.

Oh God now we are at conspiracy theories. Is this really the best we can do? Some women I know have been fighting this for ten years, I've been at this for two, I know many who've been trying to raise the alarm for four or five.

She's only been at this five minutes and doesn't seem to be listening to us, doesn't seem to have much respect for what we are saying. I mean, MN is a hotbed of Tories, is she having a laugh?

It's an insult to all the hard work that has already been done and is continuing to be done.

The 100% most important thing to me is my children's physical and mental health. I will prioritise being skint over them thinking they are the wrong "gender". I raised my children to not conform to gender stereotypes because that's what I thought good parenting was. I now worry that as they enter secondary school this will back fire and they will think they are the wrong gender.

I am scared my daughter will be pushed into sexual acts she doesn't want because the left has gone completely mental about "sex positivity" and being pro porn and sex work.

These things are the most important for me. I'm not "falling" for anything. I prioritise women.

The NEC were about to confirm that only transwomen with a GRC were eligible for AWS but then the statement was pulled. married with I don't think he's had time to consider it in detail. does not inspire confidence or boost his credibility.

Corbyn sits on the NEC ! I would hope anyone on the NEC had read whatever papers were put in front of them and ensured they were informed before agreeing to a policy position.

Oh dear I am worried about JJs mental health. It really does smack of an abusive relationship - "he's a good man really, if only I could find the right words, he would change"

I really really despise the "if you're not Labour you are Tory" attitude too. Especially now when both parties have deserted the centre ground.

Yet again women's rights are somehow "other", nevermind that the "poor and sick" aren't a separate group to women. Women are hugely represented within that group, and those poor and sick women will see their rights eroded if self-ID is accepted as the way to determine who is a woman.

Poor and sick women need safe spaces too, especially as poor and sick women are especially vulnerable to domestic violence and less able to escape it without the help of refuges.

Even if you don't accept that women are in that group, why is it women who are expected to sacrifice their rights? We are not here just to look after everyone else, we are people in our own rights, with our own needs. And I'm personally fed up of women being expected to put everyone else first.

Thank you for making the point better than me.

Its the hypocrisy that is problematic and what women are seeing through. If you are not honest with yourself on an ideological level then you won't be honest with voters. Far from having integrity, Corbyn lacks it every bit as much as any of those he is held up against.

Women are hugely represented within that group

Yes they are. And the tighter the Tory screw turns, the more they suffer.

Will we gift them another decade?

I really really despise the "if you're not Labour you are Tory" attitude too.

This goes one further. It seems if you don't worship Corbyn, you're a Tory.

I think this issue is such a big divide in the Labour party BECAUSE we are (in theory at least) the party of equality. The rest of the parties all support self id too but Labour are the party with the women's only shortlists in the first place - a policy that actively aims to increase women's representation. And a load of other great, progressive policies that will improve women's lives.

Corbyn has inspired many women to get actively involved in politics, my CLP has more than 50% great female officers. Unfortunately they are all pro self id, this seems to be the default progressive position.

I do think Jen is right - the best chance we have to challenge self id is through the Labour party. Active members decide policy so I am sticking with it for now hoping to influence things from the inside. But I understand those who have tore up their membership cards.

I am furious over this too and very disillusioned with Corbyn and the whole party tbh but I don't think we should totally right Labour off either. I welcome anything that draws attention to this issue in the media - we need external pressure to do the right thing too.

Advice for battered women everywhere, particularly those going down the plughole of Stockholm Syndrome

1. When people show you who they are, believe them the first time.

2. Get out.

I've seen quite a few women corbynites (corbynettes?) who'd benefit from a thread in relationships :(

If this is JJ then I feel very upset and betrayed. No, I'm not a Labour voter but I did donate to the crowdfunder because I see this as a serious threat to ALL woman (including Tory woman).

To see the comments from JJ has just made me feel like my money is welcome but because I don't like/support Corbyn then I, even as a woman can go to hell.

And JJ, I support your campaign re AWS. My motivation is not because it is the Labour Party. It is because it is an issue that effects politics and the ability of women to participate in politics. It is because it is stabbing women in the back, and this time they just happen to be in the Labour Party. If the Tories did the same, I'd support a campaign for AWS. If it was the Lib Dems, I'd support a campaign. My concern is that women, no matter their political allegiance, should be able to participate in politics and that AWS are specifically designed to further the participation of women in politics.

I am asking myself what price I am prepared to pay to prevent ALL women from becoming legally invisible for a very long time.
What price I am prepared to pay to halt the progression of this culture of abolishing women's rights in every space, of censoring and threatening women, making it harder and harder for us to organise.

It turns out that I am prepared to pay a high price to stop it. If labour are ready to crash on the rocks rather than fight for women's rights than they are telling us what we need to know.

Asking nicely will not work. All parties need women's votes. Let them realise this, and they will court us. We are half the nation. We have immense power but we have to be prepared to make it work for us.

This is a bizarre development.

Agree v much with Basil and GirlScout's posts

Jennifer, I do admire your bravery and tenacity in getting the fundraiser started.

But you were not elected by us and to don't get to tell us what to think or what we should believe in, so I for one will certainly not sit down.

You need a break. Please consider what you are doing, because coming onto a feminist board and hectoring women on politics is really not the brightest of strategies

JJ posted an update to the Go Fund Me appeal, praising the Spectator article (and just commenting in passing that she disagrees with his views on Corbyn), whereas she appears to be condemning the article totally here. The tone is inconsistent

They are not the same article I don't think. She is praising the Spectator article asking for an honest debate (which criticising his views on Corbyn). The one she is condemning is the one he wrote saying that Mumsnet is angry and Corbyn could lose Labour women.

"Jennifer James" wrote a post on the comments section of a Times Article recently with exactly the same tone and it does fit with the tone on twitter.

I feel the same DaisyDrip I'm not a Labour voter either
I've been trying to engage people about TRA and Self ID. My friends range across a broad political spectrum including Corbyn supporters.
This is for ALL women. I'm more strongly defined by being female than by my politics. So JJ, I care about you and I'll still support your cause but obviously you despise me.
Bet my dirty money won't be refused though.
I'm a bit fucking annoyed actually.

Howyoualldoworkme I wish there was a like button, I would have pressed it over and over again. I agree with your post in it's entirety.

I am asking myself what price I am prepared to pay to prevent ALL women from becoming legally invisible for a very long time.

Me too. Whatever the price, I will pay it.