Feminism chat for right wingers

[LeslieKnopefan]

Wondered if anyone else who is on the right like myself (see myself as centre right) wanted to chat about feminism.

I noticed there was a chat going for those in the Labour Party and thought it might be nice for anyone else like myself who is on the right but see them self as a feminist.

To introduce myself to begin... I’m in my mid 30s and always been right wing for as long as I can remember and am an active member of the Tory Party. I didn’t until recently see myself as a feminist because I always had negative connotations about the word and felt it wasn’t an issue that effected me.

But now that I’m older I’ve realised that feminism is a broad church and it is an issue that I’m not only interested in but actually there has been times in my life where being a woman has held me back or where I have been judged in a way that a man wouldn’t have been judged.

The areas that I’m currently most interested in are trans issues and how the Conservative party will deal with the many grey areas that trans rights brings with it.

I’m also concerned about the way we raise girls (and boys!!) such as the seperation of toys and the pinkness of everything for girls that we didn’t see when I was growing up. I know myself that I will say to little girls how pretty they look but wouldn’t say that to a boy, I am trying to stop myself saying such things but I realise how ingrained this is.

Finally, an issue that hasn’t really changed since I was growing up is the idea that men that have many sexual partners are great whilst women are sluts or slags. Again, I can’t say I’ve always been innocent of this especially at school where it seemed to be the norm to talk badly of girls who had lost their virginity but not boys.

Anyway that’s enough from me right now. If there is anyone else on the right here who wishes to join in please do :)

Interesting thread. I'm the dreaded 'centrist' that Momentum derides so viciously. I'm also politically homeless now, like many other GC feminists. I don't think you have to be left wing to be a feminist though and I definitely think we need to be cross party in defeating what is the greatest threat to women's rights in a century.

I think the Hands Across the Aisle movement was a good example of cross party activism. For anyone who has not heard of it, the following is a great watch.

handsacrosstheaislewomen.com/2017/02/17/biology-isnt-bigotry-why-sex-matters-in-the-age-of-gender-identity/

But actually, I think the Left and Right divide is not so clear cut any more. The Left are acting in an extremely authoritarian manner, with regressive policies imposed on supporters with no room for debate. I won't be part of that. I think there will be a new movement arising from the madness. Or at least I hope.

To be clear, I don't think either Thatcher or May have done anything for women. Except being PM.

I'd still vote Labour, but it's interesting that the party that does the least for women is the one who's had two female PM.
Contradictions on both parties.
And considering that Labour is essentially limping behind Corbyn, perhaps they should show some courage and finally elect a woman.

Anyway... is it possible to be conservative and feminist? Is free market compatible with feminism? Less regulations? Less state? Less social protection?

I'm firmly on the left but believe that women all across the political spectrum need to work together on the trans issue, not only because it's the only way to win but because attempts to change the meaning of "woman" have an impact on all of us. This isn't a partisan issue. Our political representatives are letting us down on all sides, in large part because misogyny is not a left/right issue and there are people who're either indifferent to women's concerns or who've been looking for an opportunity to undermine our progress at every point on the political spectrum.

They can't silence us all, and the more strategically we work together the harder it is to shut us down. If I can help conservative women challenge this stuff within their own party, I will. I hope they'll do the same for women on the left. TRAs are overrepresented in tech, and that's given them a massive strategic advantage and helped them push things to the point they are now, but the flip side is that the raging narcissism that's common among TRAs means that if we're smart we should be able to play them off against each other. Women, otoh, are good at working together. We've done it before and we can do it again. There's already starting to be a shift in the way the media cover this issue, and the more we can frame this as a non-partisan issue on which women of all stripes have concerns the more likely we are to see results.

I'm very left but I don't think left wing politics are necessary to feminism (I used to though). I'll take good old fashioned tory sexism over liberal sell her vagina, womb and she's not even a woman anyway sexism.

Fabulous thread. I can't see how anyone can not describe Margaret Thatcher or Theresa May as feminists. Surely doing the job they do/did, fighting against centuries of male oppression and being successful at it, makes them feminists? Same with Diane Abbot and Harriet Harman who despite the fact I disagree with almost everything they say, I still admire them as feminists just for doing what they do.
I tend to describe myself as a Right Wing Leftie btw & I admire all women who put their heads above the parapet in politics.

I admire all women who put their heads above the parapet in politics

Hear, hear!

As the rise of the TRAs shows, even if a woman in politics thinks she's prepared for what will be thrown at her there's always the possibility of some new form of "women, get back in your boxes" landmines being planted where she wasn't expecting them.

'I'm not on the right, but when I was a SAHP I drew comfort from some conservative politicians because they didn't dismiss or belittle that contribution to society in the way that the left did. I know that their motivation for this probably didn't match mine but it was appreciated. I was crushed when a Labour woman in government said that SAHMs wasted the money spent on our education and should get out to work.'

coffeecork that is an interesting post. Im quite far left and a member of momentum but what you say does sadden me too. Im a SAHM and yes it does seem that role is valued much more by the right. I cant really understand why the left dont value it more? Its a job that does need to be done after all and surely the left knows that money isnt the only important thing in peoples lives?
So actually even though I would never vote Tory in a million years I am grateful for feminists on the right who talk about SAHMs and family life more assertively than I find people on the left doing.

The problem is, what protection does the right give to SAHMs and to single mothers?
It's ok to say it's fine to be a SAHM, but many women end up being stuck in unhappy marriages because they are financial dependent on their husbands and don't think they'll be able to survive on tax credits or benefits. It's the right who wants to cut those benefits.

But it's silly to say that education is wasted on SAHM. Only if it's wasted on pre-school educators or nursery workers.

Couple of old but still relevant sayings.

Left wing men think women are public property, right wing men think women are private property.

Left wing and right wing men merely disagree over where to place the boot on women's necks.

It would be great if misogyny was confined to one part of the political spectrum, would be easier to work around that way.

Lweji well quite. I would not vote Tory for that reason amongst others. Because yes, they are praising SAHM but they are praising the ones who have partners who are wealthy or have their own wealth. They arent too concerned about women who have ended up in that situation for financial reasons and then are unable to leave it for financial reasons.
However the left does seem to focus very hard on getting mothers back into work fast whether they actively want that or not. Which I do not agree with.

I am a centrist - slightly right on economic matters and slightly left on social matters.

I was a second wave feminist - 60s and 70s was my fighting time. But you definitely don't have to be left wing to be a feminist.

I have never found a political party with which I can 100% agree, so for me it has always been go for the least of evils. I recognise there are some things that need to be done by the state, yet I am wary of giving the state too much power. I recognise there are some things better done by private enterprise yet I believe it cannot be given unfettered freedom.

There is no natural party for me.

The old Liberal party (pre-dating the Lib Dems) was probably the nearest I could get to a fit.

Littlemissbrainy - by your definition the leader of the women's organisation of the Nazi Party or Queen Elizabeth 1, or 2, or Eva Peron would be feminists - but they are just not. Unless feminism means being a woman and maybe doing something. Errr?

However the left does seem to focus very hard on getting mothers back into work fast whether they actively want that or not. Which I do not agree with.

Sure, but it's mostly right wingers who complain about single mothers on benefits. While also conveniently forgetting the non-paying fathers.

Interesting view of women as public property. Yes, probably.

It's interesting that, here in Portugal, the two most extreme parties, left and right are both led by women, and are doing well.

(BTW, I don't mean extreme right as in far-right, but only as the most right wing party that we have atm. They're probably as right wing as the Tory party in the UK and to the left of the Republican party in the US).

In the left wing party, they actually told the party that they should put their votes where their mouth was. The previous leadership was male, so they selected a female leadership next. Perhaps that's what Labour needs. :)

Tories certainly don't value SAHP. Remember when Ian Duncan Smith was in charge of welfare? He basically said SAHMs were economically worthless and wanted to get them into the workplace, where they would generate two incomes - their own and the child minder's!

I'm not affiliated with any political party, but somewhat right/libertarian leaning. I like the way some recent issues like the trans debate have united women/feminists across the political divide.

I have questioned whether I can call myself a feminist. The main sticking point is the one people have touched on above - biology is unequal when it comes to parenting, and aside from the very wealthy/highly paid few, mothers are stuck with the choice of depending on a man or depending on the state. Neither seems ideal. I've not found any neat solution or easy way of reconciling my views, but will be continuing to listen and think.

I sometimes wonder if there's a possible radical feminist 'third way' (for want of a better phrase!).

I'm a Remainer first, feminist second, and LibDem distant third. So wouldn't describe myself as right wing by a long way and suspect we'd disagree about a lot, but women's issues should transcend traditional party lines. And also I feel very let down by the wishy washy crappy way my party are dealing with the whole trans/GRA question. Glad you started this thread.

This thread makes me think of Beachcomber and LassWiTheDelicateAir on prostitution threads. They often had very opposing views but on this issue, they could set aside their differences and work together. And actually that probably terrifies both left and right men.

They often had very opposing views but on this issue, they could set aside their differences and work together. And actually that probably terrifies both left and right men.

Yes. It will give us a strong foundation to fight self ID if we can do this.

'I'm not on the right, but when I was a SAHP I drew comfort from some conservative politicians because they didn't dismiss or belittle that contribution to society in the way that the left did. I know that their motivation for this probably didn't match mine but it was appreciated. I was crushed when a Labour woman in government said that SAHMs wasted the money spent on our education and should get out to work.
Absolutely,vas a working single parent i really suffered under Blair whilst my non working friends prospered whilst i disagree with many Tory policies i like the rational behind them better than Labour. I'm probably a natural Liberal voter but they've severely blown it. We need the trans debate to include all of the political spectrum and sometimes the Left week to exclude anyone who disagrees. The poster upthread who said except UKIP obviously exemplifies that position of vote like me or you're a kitten killer and we need to avoid that and act together.

InfiniteSheldon Sorry, do you mean that the education is wasted or are you agreeing with my comment? I can quite imagine that Blair did nothing for women in your position. Single working parents get shafted by government after government. And society in general TBH.

Where is lass?

LLLAAAASSSSSSSS!!!!!!

No education is absolutely not wasted didnt mean that at all.

I've not seem her for ages rufus I think she's gone. Hope she's ok