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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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a letter to the woman who called me a terf

1000 replies

carrotandcornsoup · 10/12/2017 07:01

To the woman who shrieked at me that I am a bigot and a terf and a hateful transphobe for defending women's rights,

Ten, fifteen years from now, I ask you to remember me.

Remember me when you have your first baby and you're referred to throughout your pregnancy as a birthing individual, a pregnant person, and it makes you feel kind of dehumanised and you wish they'd just call you a woman, a mother, because that's what you are. But they're not allowed, because it's illegal to say only women can be pregnant and give birth.

Remember me when you give birth and you feel vulnerable and exposed and you really want a woman beside you who understands what you're going through and instead your midwife is a six foot man with stubble in a dress and you know he isn't a woman but you're not allowed to object, even when you need to be examined and you just want a woman to do it but you know you can't say anything because that would be hate speech, even though your body is screaming no.

Remember me when your elderly mother, who has lost her mind to dementia, goes into a care home and is told that her carer, Susan, is a woman, because you asked that she only be cared for by women. And even in her addled state of mind, she knows that Susan is a man, and you know Susan is a man, but you cannot object, and she has to allow Susan to perform her intimate care, because to object would be hate speech.

Remember me when your daughter comes home from school crying, the daughter who has spent the last five years training to be the best athlete in her class, her school, her district, she's crying because Lucas in her class, one of the fastest boys, has decided he identifies as female for now and so is allowed to run in her race, and she knows it doesn't matter how hard she trains, he will always beat her, and she can only ever hope for a silver medal now. Or bronze, if there is another Lucas.

Remember me when you go into a toilet late at night, perhaps in a bar, and there's noone else around, and a guy walks in, he has a beard and is wearing jeans and a t shirt, and the way he looks at you seems off, and you feel afraid and unsettled and worried he might hurt you. But you can't challenge him, because if you do he'll say he's a woman and has as much right as you do to be in this toilet, a place where many years ago you might have come to feel safe.

Remember me when you go for a promotion, for a board position at work that's designated for a woman. You've put in the hours, you've worked so hard, you know you deserve it. And the position goes to Lola, who until last year was a 50 year old man. Lola will never do anything inconvenient like needing time off to have babies, or to deal with any health issues that you, a woman might face, like endometriosis, breast cancer, PND. Lola is a woman just like you, and your company are happy that they have fulfilled their quota of women members on the board.

Remember me when you read on the news that crime statistics for women committing rape and murder are on the increase, and now women carry out a much higher number of rapes and murders than they did when you were a teenager or a young woman. And you know that these 'women' are men and that the statistics are wrong, but to challenge this would be hate speech. Remember me too, when these women rapists are locked up with vulnerable women in female prisons and cannot escape, because to challenge the presence of the women rapists with penises in prison with them would be hate speech.

Remember me when your son comes home from school and says that he's learned at school that you can change sex and that some girls have penises and some boys have vaginas and that his teacher said that because he likes playing with girls and dolls that maybe he is really a girl in the wrong body. And you think, no, you are just my wonderful, unique, son, and you were born in your own body. Remember me when a few months down the line the teacher calls you in and says she's concerned that you are not validating your son's identity and that she's noticed you are still referring to him by the name you so carefully chose for him when he was born, and calling him a boy, when he is actually a girl, and that she doesn't want to have to involve social services but she's worried she might have to if you continue to misgender your son and deny his real identity. And you know that she will, because it's happened before in a school near you, and you are afraid.

In this brave new world that you helped to create, look around for your transactivist friends, your lefty male allies, the ones you stood beside and yellled 'terf, transphobe, bigot' with, with you shouting the loudest, because you wanted to show what a good ally you were, how inclusive, how progressive. Where are they now? Why, they are where they always were. Benefitting from the patriarchy. Enjoying the new, improved version of it that you helped them to build by crushing the resistance from the women who spoke up for their rights. This has all cost them nothing; it has made the world a better, easier place for men. It has cost you and your sisters who campaigned with them for virtue cookies, everything.

And me? I'll be where I've always been. Fighting for your rights. Fighting to undo the damage.

I'll have your back, as I always have done.

OP posts:
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christinarossetti · 14/12/2017 18:00

It's almost as though women saying 'no' is more than they can bear. Much worse than being harassed, abused, attacked by men.

Oh, yes. Because in their narrative that is what men just do. Not even worth a mention.

But women saying 'no'. That's what really winds them up.

MrGHardy · 14/12/2017 18:10

Hah, if I felt being banged on about there would be both a good likelihood it's because it's deserved and that I wouldn't be here anymore.

BatShite · 14/12/2017 19:20

And yet people have taken Martin Ponting seriously. So much so that there is very little evidence online of the crimes he committed before he changed his name to Jessica Winfield. He raped two children but PinkNews is furious that he was deadnamed. Who gives a fuck about the children whose lives he destroyed though

Pink news are an utter joke. Its always the same on there.

lostplot · 14/12/2017 20:49

That Shon quote is utterly disgusting, my God they really do hate us.

Nelly5678 · 14/12/2017 21:56

raises glass well said OP, thankyou for standing up for us

TheIntrovertedMum · 14/12/2017 22:00

Yesss Love this! Perfect response to that crap post yesterday! And all very plausible things that could happen. Girls are girls. Boys are boys. Transgender people are transgender girls or transgender boys. They say they don't want to be stereotyped but take real offence when someone tells them they're not a woman/man. Ridiculous!

CertainHalfDesertedStreets · 14/12/2017 22:18

The crap post was a response to this one.

thebewilderness · 15/12/2017 01:05

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

BitterLittlePoster · 15/12/2017 01:10

Wine Cheers, op. Well said.

AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth · 15/12/2017 11:46

What was Shon saying? I'm blocked Grin

BeyondAssignation · 15/12/2017 12:17

Assigned, that's why it's handy to have a second twitter account to easily view (without annoying "sign up to twitter" pop ups) tweets of those who have blocked you... Wink

I'll screengrab for you now...

BeyondAssignation · 15/12/2017 12:19

.

a letter to the woman who called me a terf
therealposieparker · 15/12/2017 15:54

Shon Faye is a bellend, he swings male privilege around like his tiny wang. Misgendering is nothing like being catcalled, not Paris Sleaze empowering catcalling, but constant since you had tits at eleven catcalling, when you're alone late at night catcalling, when you're with your kids catcalling.

It's a funny old woman hating world when a guy in a dress who claims to call himself Janet can whip his cock out in the ladies changing room and if you call him he you're the one in the wrong.

WTAFisthisshit · 15/12/2017 16:00

Posie Ian this you on twitter? Can't argue with stupid but bless you for trying Grin

a letter to the woman who called me a terf
PencilsInSpace · 15/12/2017 17:08

Ah the lovely Shon Smile

therealposieparker · 15/12/2017 17:10

Yes, tis I! WTAF

purplecloudsgreyrain · 15/12/2017 20:02

Women already don't have the right to request a female carer unless they are from a BME community. I worked in a local authority social services dept. I not talking about this from a trans perspective, I mean woman couldn't request female carers, that just wouldn't be approved.
I thought that was disgraceful.
I suspect the same is true for male midwives in the NHS.

WTAFisthisshit · 15/12/2017 20:18

TBH this all throws up a lot of questions about the NHS and MH services. An awful lot of the people we're talking about clearly need sectioning, starting with Tiffany Scott! The perceived wisdom is that you vote Labour for the benefit of the NHS but they've just made themselves utterly unelectable.

After Christmas I'm going to have to have a long hard think about what I can actually DO other than trying to peaktrans everyone I meet and stalking my MP.

AssassinatedBeauty · 15/12/2017 20:31

If a woman in labour refuses consent for a male midwife to touch her, then surely the only option at that point is to find an alternative midwife? The hospital surely can't override the patient's consent, and they can't turn away a woman in labour I would hope?

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace · 18/12/2017 09:22

The way I understand the quotation Shon gives there is that the poster is saying, if we understand men's toilets to be inherently and inevitably violent places, then what would happen if women's toilets became the same - which they won't, because nobody wants to kill anyone, obviously, but it's a way of drawing attention to the ridiculousness of saying that all men in men's toilets will kill transwomen, and this is to be accepted.

But it doesn't matter what anyone says, ever, does it - you'll just be met with 'YOU ARE LITERALLY SAYING TRANS PEOPLE DON'T EXIST'.

irretating · 18/12/2017 09:59

In Transutopia women are silly to want women only spaces like toilets; that sign on the door is useless and won't stop anyone walking in, and women get attacked in there already by men. However, transwomen will be killed if they go in to the men's toilets and can only be safe if they go in to the women's because the sign on the door has magic powers to stop violent men getting in.

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace · 18/12/2017 10:35

And while all men who understand that they are men simply cannot help themselves from beating up men who don't perform masculinity in the same way, and therefore TIMs are rightly terrified for their lives around them, women have nothing to fear from any men, no matter how much they perform or don't perform masculinity, because men don't beat up or hurt women at all. I guess if they did, our suicide rates would reportedly be much higher, and so denying us our will in any way would be LITERALLY KILLING US AND LITERALLY SAYING WE DON'T EXIST AND LITERALLY (BUT POINTLESSLY, SINCE WE DON'T EXIST) KILLING US ALL OVER AGAIN.

thebewilderness · 18/12/2017 20:03

I realize that you are being sarcastic, but the truth is that is the argument being made by trans identified male advocating for an end to sex segregated public spaces.

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace · 19/12/2017 09:54

Yes, I know, that's what I'm being sarcastic about!

PeanutButterIsEverything · 20/12/2017 17:31

Of course those people that say 'transwomen ARE women' and deny the biological differences, are also saying that transwomen LITERALLY don't exist - because they can't be the same as women and not the same all at once. If you say that transwomen are the same as women then why keep referring to yourselves as transwomen and not just women? Is it because to everyone else there is a massive and glaring difference?

Just something I have been pondering a while. Sorry if it's already been covered here as I've read most of this thread (and many others) but not all of it.

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