Lily Madigan, TIM, elected Labour women's officer

[jMillicentFawcett]

Lily is 19. Lily was instrumental in the hate campaign against Anne Ruzylo which resulted in her standing down.

You have to be a woman to be women’s officer but ‘The Labour councillor said that “lived experience as a woman” should be considered an advantage — but not a prerequisite — for the role of women’s officer.’

Lily could also have gone for the LGBT officer role but they didn’t want that. No, they wanted to show women that they can shit all over them and we will applaud them for doing it.

I’m absolutely furious about this ( as you can probably tell)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/trans-teenager-lily-madigan-voted-in-as-a-labour-women-s-officer-mwchkhzq8?shareToken=472df23aa6315582a4f6558d7a1be5ba

Re this stance on Primogeniture - this exception in English law could have been challenged and maybe overturned by the ECHR as a human rights issue - perhaps this is also another reason that some people want Brexit. No more oversight.... or interfering as they would call it!

ollennaswimple such a 1% issue indeed! But goes to show how powerful they are much more than 51% of the population.

Q to all more knowledgeable than me - does calling a toilet a female only toilet help at all? Does female still mean female?!!! or is it all completely blurred now?

If anyone is really interested, here is the Hansard from the Lords Committee stage of the GR Bill - do a search for "hereditary" to jump to the relevant section, about 2/3s down the page.

Some relevant extracts (this is the government minister speaking)

Clause 16 states that the issue of a gender recognition certificate does not affect the descent of peerages. It has been included so as to exclude the possibility of a person changing gender—I refer to an elder daughter changing gender in these circumstances—in order to leap-frog a sibling and in that way obtain a peerage, dignity or title of honour. If that could occur it would defeat the expectations of the person to whom the peerage would have otherwise descended. Peerages are also unique because they descend to the eldest son, according to birth. That is another reason why birth gender should continue to count. The adoption and children act of 1992 makes a similar exception, about which the noble Earl, Lord Ferrers, may have waxed eloquently 13 years ago. The exception is there so that the adopted children may not inherit a peerage, even if they qualify—as, for example, the eldest son.

It was never the intention that a Knight Commander who became a woman in the eyes of the law should continue to style herself as "Sir". But the noble Baroness has raised a valid point—and I hope that I am not upsetting the noble Earl, Lord Ferrers, by acknowledging that—about whether a Peer or the holder of another title can legitimately swap it when his or her gender changes in law.

In fact, all of us are in the gift of Her Majesty. She, alone, can confer a title and she, alone, can alter the form of address that a holder uses. However, that does not mean that an amendment to the Bill is necessary. The Government have, since Committee, consulted the Palace and the Garter Principal King of Arms. We are in agreement that the best way to proceed in such rare cases—I underline "rare"—would be for the holder of the title to petition Her Majesty to ask that she change the form of address. There is a wide range of circumstances under which an individual may wish to adopt a different form of address as a result of the Bill. In addition to transsexual people themselves, the former or future spouse of a transsexual person may have a claim on a courtesy title.

Legislating for this multitude of circumstances would seem disproportionate given the very low frequency with which the situation would arise. It would also reduce Her Majesty's prerogative powers in this area. Accordingly, the Government are satisfied that the right to petition Her Majesty, which already exists and will continue to do so, is a sufficient and proportionate method of dealing with the matter.

A woman is an adult female mammal. A man is an adult male mammal.

Why do I keep that picture of the pilot whale who kept her dead baby by her side in deep distress obviously.

The following link is from the Daily Mail and I apologise. But already some professor has questioned the link between the death of the baby to plastics.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5100643/Blue-Planet-II-slammed-linking-plastic-dead-whale.html

BetsyM00

That says one case ‘in the service’.

Does that mean someone who had been referred? Do they only basis statistics on people who are referred?

I realise, at the moment, you have to get a diagnosis to be considered trans, so statistically it will be correct, given that someone who has not been diagnosed cannot legitimately be considered trans.

There was a case a couple of months ago about a child whose mother had died. They were trans. TRAs said they killed themself because they were misgendered by the school. The school denied it and said it was because their mother died.

But if they hadn’t been referred, they may not be included in the GIDS stats. But that might also mean that they cannot be considered trans.

Something else that will be a consequence of self identification.

sir I totally agree. It is meaningless, but there still needs to be a way to assess people who wish to transition and this is the the one we have at the moment (but not for long) most of the genuinely disphoric transsexuals I know also think it’s meaningless but it’s better than the alternative of not having that time period. This is something that is asked of transsexuals wanting a gender recognition certificate so it doesn’t seem fair to ask them to jump through that hoop and then also complain about said hoop but also complain when that hoop is taken away.
‘Living as a woman’ is a ridiculous phrase but I’d still rather that they had to do it for two years than we just handed out gender recognition certificates willy nilly.

I think the "suicide risk" stuff constantly trotted out is truly evil. Almost pushing teenagers into suicide attempts . Totally irresponsible and manipulative. So much transactivism is the agenda-led manipulation and gaslighting of women and teenagers. I didn't donate to Children in Need this year as they give money to Mermaids.

Because suggesting a prolific sex offender who gets off on seeing naked women without their consent may pretend to be a woman to see abuse women = bigotry

While enshrining into law that women would pretend to be a man to usurp a rightful male heir and possibly get into a position of power = sensible

Of course, women are money grabbing harpies after all.

Thanks ollennas I think we need to be using this as an argument - why property and title qualifies for an exception but a female wishing to see a female rape counsellor does not.

Again like the suicide argument, it reveals that this issue is not really concerned about welfare (of women).

Agree with PPs - still it seems that all that women may have is in the gift of men (or the HM the Queen as some numpty minister thinks, and who quite clearly ought to be a man anyway...)

If anyone else is pissed off about the idea that Madigan might get an award from the Labour Women in Leadership fund, it might be an idea to write to them:

[email protected]

As an aside, has Women's Aid or VAW come out in favour of the GRA?

I've come to the conclusion that "transition" itself is a hugely sexist concept, relying entirely on stereotypes about superficial appearance. I'm sick of reading young men on twitter, tweeting how someone "must be a woman of some description" (re travis, the top shop person) because of lipstick, and that women who don't dress in an uber feminine way are actually transmen. (See the transing of any historical figures who were non conforming in their dress) . Gender identity is all nonsense. We are being lied to on an epic scale.

Elendon There was some controversy about a trans women being involved and then quitting women's aid NI claiming bullying. As far as I can remember they accused Miranda Y but Miranda was able to prove the blog was written afterwards or something like that.

I haven't found a feminist group in NI that doesn't buy into trans rights though and I believe the NI women's aid isn't linked directly to the English and Scottish ones.

Just to be clear, by trans rights I mean trans rights taking precedence over women's rights.

Yup. They have an exemption for inheritance because they realise it's open to abuse by women.

On the other hand, they don't have an exemption for any of the areas that might be open to abuse by men (prisons, women's refuges etc).

Why, it's almost as if the law has been written by people who care more about men's rights than women's rights.

Such a clear illustration of a simple point. What part of this can people not understand?

Goodness knows Datun. It's a service for all young people who have been referred for assessment/treatment, so presumably stats only refer to people under their care. But as there is currently a year long waiting list to be seen, stats may not include these referrals.

It seems quite clear that actual suicide figures are hugely over-presented by TRAs. We all know this just from the lack of news reports on suicides.

Think I'll keep searching for more data...

Elendon Both Scottish Women's Aid and Rape Crisis have come out in full support of the proposed GRA changes.

If I remember correctly the written evidence Women's Aid gave to Maria Miller's committee said they were supportive of trans clients and were about to change their policy to allow transwomen to be employees ie. not use the exemptions under the Equality Act to restrict certain positions to women only.

Betsy really? Fucking hell.

Thanks Betsy. Well that's my donation to Women's Aid stopped.

Women's aid

Women's Aid's written evidence:

data.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/committeeevidence.svc/evidencedocument/women-and-equalities-committee/transgender-equality/written/19625.pdf

It basically says "we are thinking about throwing away all of our legal rights" not to employ transgender people. It's dated August 2015, and presumably the review has since been completed.

The Fawcett Society's views

www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/news/fawcetts-position-on-gender

However, I'm not liking this.

Respondents were asked which statement best describes their view – either, “There are two genders, male or female”, or “Gender can be a range of identities”. We realise that “male” and “female” refer to sex rather than gender, but we felt when asking ordinary members of the public this was the easiest way to gauge public attitudes to gender identity in a single question.

It's not rocket science it's basic biology.

I know! It’s not an opinion. Ffs.

It pisses me off. Biology is not an opinion.

You can alter the way you categorise people, sure. You can stay will categorise based on gender.

But you can’t say that sex is not firstly a category, and secondly one that requires an opinion.

In other words the Fawcett Society has used the lowest common denominator in determining 'public opinion'.

FFS indeed!!