I'm a gender critical feminist with a 'trans' child.

[Theoryofparenting]

Just a question I've been wondering. I have 15 year old twins, both of whom are biologically female. However, one of them 'presents as male' and has done for a couple of years.

He tells me that TransActivists are stupid. He doesn't believe that people are born in the wrong body. He knows you can't change your sex. He doesn't 'identify as transgender'.

As a young child he would tell me that he was a boy, that he would be upset if he became a woman. I assumed it was a developmental phase (I was similar as a child), however as soon as puberty hit at 11 he went downhill. Eating disorders, self harm, depression, anxiety. He would never tell us the root cause until he came to us at 13 and told us how he was feeling. He does not have 'gender dysphoria' - he has 'sex dysphoria'. His feelings are not caused by gender roles/expectations.

When people ask about it, he tells them that he isn't 'transgender' as he never had a gender, just a sex. He says he feels more comfortable presenting how he does and that he strongly dislikes his body, not societies expectations.

He has never been to a gender therapist. He isn't on blockers or hormones. Anything like that is being delayed, by his choice as well as mine.

I strongly agree with the gender critical feminist point of view (as does he). We've been through so much because of how my child feels. He gets annoyed when people associate him with TransActivists, because he is nothing like them and disagrees with everything they say/do.

I made this thread to show that not all parents of 'trans' children agree with the agenda. All I want is for my child to be comfortable and happy. If anyone has any questions then I am more than happy to answer them.

I'm a slow typer too
I absolutely don't have a sense of personal identity that corresponds to the stereotypes imposed on women by the patriarchy.

My personal identity corresponds to my personality. Why does my personality have to be defined by 57 ridiculous statements invented by someone or other?

I'm just me. Not "ciswoman".

The stereotypes associated with my sex don't form part of my personal identity either. Most people would class me as unusual in that regard. If you asked me if I feel male or female though I'd say female. I can imagine, and have heard enough from others first hand, that in another life I'd feel male, despite my body. Or I'd feel I was neither (as a friend did).

If you meet the definition of something (and I don't have enough info to assess that) then why is it rude?

Agree with alittlebitofbutter except i prefer a lot of butter

If you meet the definition of something (and I don't have enough info to assess that) then why is it rude?

Isnt this part of the whole 'problem' of discussing these issues

If you meet the definition of something

Whose definition? And of what?

Are you refusing to accept my self defined identity? Why do I need you to tell me if I meet your definition?

I don't feel female or male. I just feel like me. Cis is offensive to me as it implies I'm A-OK with the stereotypes associated/imposed on me because of my sex.

That Horizon programme was on about Transgender just at 9 pm. I watched some of it. I admit I really don't understand it at all. It's girls saying because they don't like 'girly things' they identify as boys. And this doctor was seeing children as young as three. I am getting the stereotyping issue a bit though.

So if someone meets the definition of one sex then I'm not being rude if i refer to them as that sex

See I thought it was considered rude not to use the pronouns, for example, that someone prefers

Oh dear God this hurts my brain!
Good luck to your DC.

I saw a bit of that programme. Unfortunately it was the reassignment surgery, it looked horrific. I feel for anyone who feels so at odds with their body that they would go through with that, but at the same time I think it's important to show the younger generation this kind of programme so they can see how extreme this all is and it's only mimicking a vagina, it isn't a real vagina.

It's so important that vulnerable people are able to access therapies to help them come to terms with their biological bodies and not be defined by gender stereotypes but the TRA's don't want that. It's alarming.

I didn't watch the surgery part. I wonder how long this reassignment surgery has been performed. I can't think it's more than a few years. A lot of doctors disagree with it I believe.

vivienne

I think its been going for many years...to what extent i dont know

And that's the problem with this programme. They don't show the aftermath and all the things that can go wrong.
It's all presented as hunky dory and as a means to an end and the person who had the surgery lives happily ever after, when in fact they have a lifetime of problems.

But Level

If you asked me if I feel male or female though I'd say female.

What does that even mean? Think about it.

If one has a female body all one's life, one will have an intimate knowledge of it. Everything it does, the way it's treated, and the way people treat you because of it.

There is literally nothing else to 'feeling female'.

You have to play this out, in your head.

What else is there? Seriously. One word. Nurturing? Floral? Strong? Empathetic? Ambitious?

For every stereotypically female characteristic, I can give you 100 women who don't have it. The same with men. It's not innate. It's personality.

The only reason you feel female is because of your body.

Trans people have a disconnect over their body. It's a disorder. It's awful.

But it doesn't make them a different sex. They can pick any number of gender characteristics and employ them, while still being the sex they are.

But they don't because society tells them certain characteristics need to apply to certain body.

So because they feel of those those characteristics best describe them, they assume their body is wrong.

Gender is damaging.

You can't 'feel' female without being female.

I'm so sick of hearing the word gender now. After participating in gender critical debates, to me, it just means people who want to categorise their personality according to stereotypes that were developed to subjugate women.

The whole trans ideology is so confused, illogical and regressive.

And WHY is it so important to "present" as one or the other set of stereotypes? Why can't people just be comfortable with wearing what they want, without constantly worrying about how they're perceived? We keep getting told how fundamental "gender identity" is. I've happily lived 40 years without it thank you very much.

I have a female body. It does not define my personality. I experience sexism because of my body not because of my personality.

There are now books educating young children about their gender, asking them to explore something they do not have. They are written in the same way as religious books aimed at kids. Genderists are creating gender, then telling kids they may have a problem which can be fixed by changing your name and surgery. Bet the companies who make the drugs are gleeful, for once in history they are benefiting from a youth movement and cult.

And WHY is it so important to "present" as one or the other set of stereotypes?

It has to be because the way they perceive they will be treated.

Making such a song and dance about who they are, what they are and why they are is narcissistic, yes. But what is the point other than to be treated in a certain way by other people.

There are certainly lots of people at the moment, Sean Faye, Paris Lees, and that other chap whose name I can't remember who talked about wanting objectification, who quite openly state that street harassment, etc is empowering, or flattering.

There is no rush to be described as nurturing, good mothers, or empathetic. Or any female stereotypes that don't relate to the physical.

Even those without AGP, crave the validation being seen as female. Only physically though.

How do women know they are being treated as physically women?

There's admiration, yes of course. But it's also often negative behaviour towards them. In the form of harassment, objectification (and worse).

One of the most damaging parts of this new wave of transwomen is both their lack of understanding (or care) of how this is intimidating for women and their encouragement of it for themselves. Especially if they then go on to say they are representative of women and support feminism. And therefore it's representative of the attitude of most women. Or should be.

The danger of any these people getting into a position where they can directly affect legislation, schooling, company protocols, or writing for teen magazines, (as several of them have), is horrifying.

I too am a gender critical feminist with a trans child. I was totally blind-sided by this, and I have become a gender critical feminist as a result of it. My DD is on the autistic spectrum - this we have only recently found out (i.e. after the trans thing). A feature is rigid thinking and inability to tolerate grey areas. She has never been very girly but that was never an issue, until about a year ago. So when you are talking about stereotypes, in her case I can quite see that, finding she doesn't fit squarely in one box, and struggling with undiagnosed autism, she categorically decides that she must be in the other box, and that this is answer to her struggles. It is well documented (Tony Attwood etc) that gender difficulties are common for these individuals, and this can take a number of years to resolve (i.e. hold off the hormones and surgery). So whether through autism or another cause, I can see how the upholding of cultural stereotypes is incredibly important in the transgender "religion".

Stopmakingsense

I'm going to start a thread tomorrow, in feminist chat. I've just come back from the Brighton meeting.

Stephanie Davis Arai was speaking. She originally set up a website for parents of transgender children. And very much has the interests of children at heart.

She had several things to say, which I will post tomorrow when I can give it my full attention.

But one of the things was that she has never seen a girl transition who didn't have either autism, was a lesbian, or had past sexual trauma.

Given the girls now make up 70% of referrals, that's very damning.

It shows that girls are transitioning, purely for societal reasons, apart from the autism.

She is determined to get autism addressed in this context.

It also makes you wonder what the reasons are for men transitioning. If it's homosexuality, autism, and past sexual trauma, what's the rest? If it's not a fetish?

Her experience of girls transitioning give the absolute lie to the fact that it's a brain-based mismatch.

Looking forward to your thread, Datun . It's funny, I had a suspicion I am acquainted with you in RL, but the person I thought might be you has not been to Brighton recently

AdultHumanFemale

Come to the next meeting! Let's get acquainted in real life.

I too, am interested in the autism side of things. My nephew is very rigid in his thinking and now will only accept presents that are boy presents.

Another relative, after sex education lessons in Y6, came home thinking he had to sort out getting a girlfriend fast as he could only have sex when he was 16. (now an Oxbridge student)

Diagnosis of autism like conditions is not very good and it is not easy either. Tony Attwood, mentioned above, had a piece in the Guardian about failing to diagnose his own son. www.theguardian.com/society/2017/sep/25/why-the-world-expert-on-aspergers-took-30-years-to-notice-condition-in-his-own-son

It has been known for the last ten years or so that the probable reason for the low number of girls with autism is that they do not come under the obvious signs that have been used for boys.

That you can diagnose yourself with transgender, and set off on the path of puberty blockers, and opposite sex hormones and surgery, without ruling out any other problems is bizarre.

I said this in another thread and it might sound counter intuitive but I think it might be time for feminists to reclaim the 'feminine gender'. Gender does exist, albeit as a social construct. Gender is just a set of beliefs, in society, concerning how men and women are expected to look, think and behave. Feminists are very much a part of society. Why not reclaim the feminist gender in a way that transcends and challenges traditional sexual stereotypes?

Then feminists can create some truly inclusive resources, for schools etc, dealing with gender within our society. Ones which are compatible with science and equality.

Slip there, that should read 'feminine gender' although IMO it can be feminist too!