How do you stand up for what's right when the abuse you receive for it is terrifying?

[wowl]

A friend of mine posted something on FB today about transwomens 'periods' and some guff about the 'gender differentiation of the brain' occurring around month 5 of pregnancy

I posted a very mild response to it but I've seen people doxxed and sent death and/or rape threats for less so after posting it I'm now shaking. It's terrifying and the reason I've never before commented on this sort of thing. Short of not caring if you lose all your friends and have your reputation destroyed, how do you fight this bullshit?

I don't think I'll have the strength to try this again to be honest :(

I've decided I have to be bold but in ways I can see I'll have some real
Impact. I'm not publicly engaging in Facebook for example cause I don't think it will help

I would simply post a link to this website:

sexandgenderintro.com/

There is a lot of ignorance and Emperors New Clothes-ism going on out there.

That beginners guide is brilliant. Thanks boris. I'm going to write that down for future use!

Excellent link @BorisTrumpsHair. Thanks for sharing.

I found out about it via FWC/MN a while ago now.

I agree it is a brilliant resource and well written - and helps get your head round a potentially tricky minefield of a subject.

Yes and so straightforward. It couldn't be taken as 'transphobic ' surely, just scientific fact.

All the TRAs I've come across would argue with that site, and just say things about science having 'moved on' etc

Or jut dismiss it outright as "TERF rhetoric"

*just

You are right wow! TRAs are relentless in their dismissal of scientific evidence and this wouldn't alter their views one iota. It may persuade those on the fence however, or give people the courage to challenge some of the more outrageous anti-scientific claims.

It is such an uphill struggle. Why can't we just have this discussion sensibly without accusations of TERF and threats of rape or violence? I think when 'discussing' with those so hellbent on that point of view it is hardly worth the argument they are so entrenched in their beliefs and so aggressive in their responses it isn't always worth pursuing.

All the TRAs I've come across would argue with that site, and just say things about science having 'moved on' etc

There is no point arguing with the willfully ignorant :)

The funny thing is these TRA science deniers are scathing of of the climate change deniers, citing, er, science and all that. Facts are optional to these fuckers.

And yet we are 'bigots'

Threatening women with rape or violence to silence them is what I would expect from a man, not another woman.

Bizarre.

I don't think you can debate with them. They are in total denial. Facts mean nothing. Words mean whatever they want them to mean. Feelz is all. They believe whatever it suits them to believe.

I've decided to feel the fear and do it anyway, and call them out on their abuse as well.

The person on FB that I commented to isn't a TRA or I wouldn't have even tried, she's a libfem ally who hasn't critically thought things through. Otherwise I wouldn't have bothered

she's a libfem ally who hasn't critically thought things through

I do think feminism can be a journey of learning and awakening. Not too many of us are born "perfect" feminists. I would absolutely link to sexandgenderintro.com/

If she is in any way engaged with feminism I think she would read it at least. Plant some seeds!!

Short of not caring if you lose all your friends and have your reputation destroyed, how do you fight this bullshit?

You can't.

I am very careful about talking about it in real life, and have ceased to socialize with idiots who support transagenda (without telling them why).

Online, you use a pseudonym, because TRAs are violent and dangerous, and you don't want them to know where you live, you don't want them to know where you work.

And then you go into the fight with the mindset that all "friends" you would lose by speaking the truth are not worth keeping.

I know it hurts, but you then also know who your real friends are.

whoputthecatout, you're right that you can't debate with TRAs. But you can call them out on their obvious bullshit, and point out their lies and gaslighting for the benefit of others, especially women, who might be reading.

It's imperative that we don't allow sexist and incoherent gender identity dogma to go unchallenged in the public arena. The best way to counter it is not by getting into long and fraught arguments with TRAs, but to make short, clear statements of fact in response to the lies, and to point out the blatant sexism of gender identity ideology.

E.g, 'There is no way to 'feel' female, because it is a biological fact, not a feeling-state or a personality type.' Or, 'Sex is material reality, gender is socially constructed sex roles'. If they try to pull out the intersex argument (and they will), don't get into long debates about the intricacies of intersex. Just point out that intersex isn't trans, and the fact that a small number of people have disorders of sexual development doesn't mean that human sexual reproduction isn't binary; the analogy would be some people are born without legs, but humans are still a bipedal species. Nor does the existence of intersex people mean that men can become women via hormones, surgery or claiming to have a 'woman feeling' in their heads.

When people talk at me about how trans people feel female and are therefore women I simply ask them "biology aside, how do you FEEL like a man?" or "biology aside, how do you FEEL like a woman?".

No one has ever given a convincing answer to this question! Simply because it is unanswerable. It certainly gets them scratching their heads and thinking a little more.

to clarify, I ask those questions of non-trans people.

to clarify, I ask those questions of non-trans people.

I found that a number of people who did not particularly feel "like a woman" had zero problems at all siding with violent TRAs.

A common reaction to the realisation that they don't really have a gender identity is to assign themselves "agender" or "non-binary".

You're right of course DonkeySkin. I guess I just let exasperation get to me sometimes. The value is, I suppose, in pointing out biological facts to those who see the posts but have never given it any thought before.

I suppose I find it difficult to understand how anyone could even give any credence to such patent absurdity in the first place!

That's what Twitter, Reddit, mumsnet (netmums is very anti terf) is for - you can stay anonymous. I don't get politicsl on FB. It's my fun friendly, pics of the kids place.

A common reaction to the realisation that they don't really have a gender identity is to assign themselves "agender" or "non-binary".

It's not really funny I know but if I don't laugh I'll cry. I do think many people think that in order to support Trans people you have to buy into the TRA agenda hook, link and sinker. Let's keep chipping away at those people - show them it's not the case. It does get very tiresome.