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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gender ID bill - Gender Critical To Do List

174 replies

BetsyM00 · 02/08/2017 16:48

There seems to be quite a few of us with concerns about the proposed bill and who want to take some steps to voice opposition to it. I've pulled together some pertinent info and compiled a To Do List from threads on here, and elsewhere.

Please join in with any other suggestions.

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Stopmakingsense · 20/09/2017 07:18

Thank you posting that link to the NHS Consultation Betsy. I am trying to think of ways of getting it to concerned medical professionals, psychologists, teachers, counsellors, university staff - their input will carry more weight in the consultation. I am personally involved in this - my DD is squarely in the vulnerable group - over 18, on the autistic spectrum, mh problems, at uni. Any suggestions?

LondonPainter · 20/09/2017 10:34

I emailed my (conservative, male, pretty low key) MP last night. Thanks BetsyM00 for all the suggestions; I used a few sentences from your sample letters, as well as references to Speakers Corner, Martin Ponting and the trans woman weightlifting champ.

TheWeeWitch · 20/09/2017 16:02

I’ve had a response from someone called George (no surname given) at the Labour Party. It’s poorly written, misses the point completely and evades addressing any of the issues I presented. Totally pissweak.

Dear WeeWitch,

Many thanks for getting in touch about equality issues.

Labour is the party of equality. We believe that no-one should be left behind. To achieve that, the next Labour Government will build a Britain for the many, a more equal and tolerant society that treats people of all backgrounds with dignity and respect.

Under the Tories, progress is being rolled back for women, disabled people, LGBT people and BAME communities.

Policies introduced by the Conservatives have turned the clock back on gender equality. Our challenge now must be to build on Labour’s past achievements and push for full equality for women: financially, in the workplace, in families and homes, online and in public spaces. A Labour Government will gender audit all policy and legislation for its impact on women before implementation.
Labour will champion the rights of disabled people. We will reverse Tory changes to Personal Independence Payments and scrap the Tories’ unfair and counterproductive sanctions regime. We will ensure disabled people get the support they need by scrapping Work Capability Assessments and replacing them with fairer, more personal support.

The last Labour Government did more for LGBT equality than any other government in British history and the next Labour Government won’t stop fighting for LGBT equality. We will build on our history of championing LGBT rights, tackling homophobia wherever it occurs.

Labour will work every day for a fairer society, where every person is enabled to get on in life, regardless of race, faith or ethnicity. We will implement a comprehensive strategy for racial equality, one that effectively challenges the socio-economic disadvantage many Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic communities suffer.
With Labour, no-one and no community will be left behind. We will strengthen legislation around equal pay and tackle the barriers that stop women, BAME communities, LGBT and disabled people from reaching their full potential.

Only Labour will create a fairer, more equal society where whatever your background, wherever you are from, you have the means and opportunity to fulfil your potential.

Best wishes,
George
Membership Services and Correspondence
The Labour Party

Sent by email from the Labour Party, promoted by Iain McNicol on behalf of The Labour Party, both at Southside, 105 Victoria Street, London, SW1E 6QT

QuarksandLeptons · 26/09/2017 10:09

Hello, wasn't sure whether to start a new thread but thought it best to put it here as I've finally found a morning free to write a letter to my MP about the proposed changes to the Gender Recognition Act 2004 and the Equality Act 2010.

So far, I've listed out the areas I think are problematic but have got stuck at no. 6.

Was hoping someone can help.

Also, would welcome any thoughts on any of the others. I've found I keep re writing the letter as the various issues become clearer to me as I research.

  1. The Law should reflect objective not subjective reality (although the GRA 2004 seems to have disregarded reality when they allowed people to change their birth certificates)
  1. Safety and dignity for trans people (how the proposed changes won't actually help)
  1. Effect on women and girl's safety and opportunities
  1. Effect on gay and lesbian people
  1. Effect on children (coercion to trans)
  1. Effect on free speech

I'm hoping someone can explain to me the effect the proposed changes to the EA 2010 will have on freedom of speech? I can see that under the EA 2010 gender reassignment is a protected characteristic. What particular change is being proposed to this? Will it mean that using the wrong pronouns or not agreeing that a person can change sex will be punishable?
Sorry if this is listed somewhere already, I've had a good look through and googled but can't seem to find a clear answer.

Thanks!

BetsyM00 · 27/09/2017 22:00

The following impact statements should be helpful for you QuarksandLeptons:
www.transgendertrend.com/impact-assessments/
gendertrender.wordpress.com/2013/07/11/transgender-rights-the-elimination-of-the-human-rights-of-women/

With regard to free speech, have a look at this:
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/law-and-courts/discrimination/what-are-the-different-types-of-discrimination/harassment/
Basically, as gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act, then any behaviour that makes a trans person feel offended is harassment and the police can take action, treating it as a hate incident/crime.

So I guess wrong pronoun use is already a hate crime :( Along with feminist speech/writing and talking about material reality and women's bodies.

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BetsyM00 · 27/09/2017 22:11

A new group has launched, Woman's Place UK. See their twitter or facebook pages.

They are encouraging a mass letter writing campaign to MPs, to include 5 core issues. See this pdf for details.

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QuarksandLeptons · 02/10/2017 11:51

Thanks Betsy, that's very helpful.

I have just finished my letter. It's a bit epic and could do with a lot more editing but two little ones and work mean it will have to do!

I'll post it over the next few posts.

I've sent it to my local MP and Justine Greening. My local MP is great and I know would personally be gender critical but would likely not want any negative publicity, so it will be interesting to see if I get a response.

QuarksandLeptons · 02/10/2017 11:53

Dear MP,

I ask you to please oppose the changes being proposed regarding the Gender Recognition Act 2004 and the Equality Act 2010 with regard to self identifying as the opposite sex for the following reasons listed below. I would also ask you to argue that sex as a protected characteristic in the EA 2010 be maintained.

  1. Law should reflect science and reality

The proposals suggest no less than a re-categorisation of sex based classification to that of gender identity. This is a change to the legal basis of our common understanding of man and woman. As such this is a legitimate and proper discussion about balancing rights and thinking through consequences
The revisions do not reflect science or reality. Under the proposed changes the individual’s perception of their identity would be prioritised above the reality of their biology and above the reality of whether others might deem them to be male or female.

The law in the country should not reflect an ideology that is not rooted in reality. There is no current science that says there is such a thing as a male or female brain. Therefore the ideology that a person can be born in the wrong body is not correct. While some people feel deeply uncomfortable with their body, it does not prove that there is a mis match between their brain and body. Men and women have different sexual reproductive roles and this is where the differences between the sexes begins and ends. Sexual stereotypes such as strength / weakness, pretty /clever, artistic / scientific are not about the sex of a person they describe characteristics that society has attributed to those of the differing biologies. These roles should not restrict the life chances of either sex by forcing those who don't conform to the stereotypes to transition to being the other sex through surgery and drugs. To encourage hatred of a person's body through the law is unfair and wrong. The current trans banner covers a wide range of people who present as the opposite sex. What the proposed law seeks to do is to define people who identify as the opposite sex as actually being the opposite sex. This is clearly not true.

To allow people to change records of their biological sex on their birth cert without any regulation is illogical and rash.

  1. Safety and dignity for those defined as trans

Society should provide safety and dignity to those who are different to the majority of the population (trans people currently account for 0.03% of the population) but it should over write the protections of the rest of society in particular women and girls who make up 51% of the population.

The Gender Recognition Act 2004 provided a wide range of provisions which successfully did this but still provided some protection to the rights of women, girls and gay and lesbian people and children.

Under the GRA 2004, people are currently allowed to register as the opposite sex but need to be over 18, have a documented diagnosis of gender dysphoria (being uncomfortable with the sex of their body), have lived for 2 years presenting as the opposite sex, declare that they wish to live for the rest of their lives as the opposite sex and pay £140 for a certificate. No certificate is required for surgery and financial help can be applied for regarding the fee dependent on circumstances. If they are married, they need to get permission from their spouse to get the certificate (This is fair as when someone marries another person, they do so on the basis that they are of a particular sex)

Under the Equality Act 2010 there is protection for people in the process of presenting permanently as the opposite sex, these people are noted as transsexual people.

The main objection to the current process by the trans activist community is that they do not think there should be regulation in the process of being treated as the opposite sex. They do not think a health care provider should have any role in mediating those who wish to be treated as the opposite sex in legal terms. They wish for people to be able to change the sex of their passport and birth certificate on their own without any external moderation.

A large part of this relates to the access to free surgery and hormones via the NHS. At present there is a contradiction in the argument presented. On one hand, transactivists claim that surgery and hormones are necessary to alleviate the mental anguish of the mental illness gender dysphoria (hating the sexual characteristics of one's body and suffering from anxiety and depression as a result). However, they simultaneously claim that hating the body one has and wishing to surgically and hormonally alter it is not a mental disorder. If it is not a mental disorder, then it does not seem fair that the NHS should pay for elective surgeries and hormones. Many people are very unhappy with their bodies and faces and would wish to have elective cosmetic surgery paid for by the state to make themselves feel better, but it is rightly not deemed a fair way to spend public tax money. What the changes to the law would allow for 'informed consent' where a person could self define their dysphoria and identity and would not need healthcare professional to intervene in the process before the NHS would fund cross sex hormones and surgery. Both of which carry health risks.

The treatment of people with gender dysphoria by our society via the medical profession is very important. We have a duty of care to treat people with mental health issues properly. It is widely documented that a very large number of people suffering from gender dyphoria were sexually abused. Many others were from deeply homophobic backgrounds and were rejected on the basis of not adhering to strict sex stereotypes.

The NHS and the medical profession at large should be helping these people resolve their traumas through counselling and therapy before simply handing over powerful drugs and life altering surgeries that the afflicted person believes will be a panacea for their mental anguish.
Rates of suicide in transsexual people are highest a few years after they have had surgery. This is also true as an aside to women who have had breast augmentation. What can be inferred from both cases is that surgery does not adequately address the reasons that people request surgery. It seems humane and sensible to see if there is a less invasive and more helpful way of solving their mental health issues.

By forcing people by law to accept a something which is patently untrue, i.e. that human beings can change sex, a negative image of people who wish to present as the opposite sex is being created. A number of high profile transsexuals have already spoken out against these changes for this reason. Simply removing any regulation from this process is not going to make trans peoples lives any easier, it will in fact create more divisions between them and the rest of socieity.

  1. Effect on girls and women's safety and opportunities

The 2010 Equality Act enshrines rights for women and girls to be free from discrimination including sexual harassment and to have sex specific protections in law. These include the right for certain occupational roles to be legitimately categorised as female only in order to protect the privacy and dignity of women. Such roles include rape crisis counsellors or are in occupations with access to female intimate spaces. We believe these sex based protections are invaluable.

Separate sex facilities exist because 98% of sexual offences are committed by men. Male rates of violence remain the same even when the men transition to being identified as female. Please see link ( Dhejne et al, 2011).
‘Women-only services (gender-sensitive services) help female survivors to feel physically and emotionally safe. Furthermore, evidence and experience from the sector show that female survivors prefer to access services that are provided by women in a women-only environment.’ (Women's Aid, 2014)

I am also concerned that measures to increase opportunities for girls and women will be taken away if boys and men are allowed to 'identify' as a girl or woman. For instance, biological men who 'identify' as girls or women would dominate women's sport due to their different biology - larger size, and greater physical strength and stamina. Data collection relating to sex inequality will be rendered meaningless. This is not a hypothetical situation, there are daily accounts of male born competitors who were ranked low as men who come back to win when they play as women.

For instance measurements of the gender pay gap, or the prominence of women in high-level roles in business would be skewed by inclusion of men who climb the career ladder as men, but then later on claim to be 'women'. It is widely known that being pregnant and giving birth to children account for much of the discrimination that women face. Things that a male born person will never experience.

Scholarships and awards for girls and women could go to boys and men, rather than the girls and women they were intended for to increase their representation and opportunities.
In the Labour party this year, two men who recently in their 50s started to identify as women after a lifetime as men were granted two of the Jo Cox leadership for women grants. Unfair incidences such as these will be enshrined in law.

The collection of crime statistics will become meaningless, such as the case of a rapist being reported in the media as a 'woman' because he 'identified' as a woman, despite being a biological male capable of rape.

QuarksandLeptons · 02/10/2017 11:56
  1. Effects on gay and lesbian people

Gay and lesbian people are those who are same sex attracted. Lesbians in particular are being targeted by trans activists as being bigoted if they refuse to be sexually attracted to men who identify as women. Please look at the term cotton ceiling that trans activists have coined for lesbians who refuse to be sexually involved with them. find link

I am concerned that if it is made simple to self-identify, we will see many of those teenage girls self-identifying as male when in fact they may benefit from proper counselling and time to reflect.

In every instance of a trans identified person talking about their decision to change how they socially present themselves, the descriptions of their realisation always refer to sexual stereotypes. There is evidence that in most instances with children who show preferences for toys and play of the current stereotypes for the opposite sex (usually called gender non conforming children) they go on to be happy adults as their own sex. 80% of GNC children go onto become happy lesbians or gay men. Trans rhetoric polarises and reduces the scope for how a human being can behave based on their biological sex by saying that because a person doesn't conform to societal stereotypes they must in fact be the opposite sex. This is damaging to all of society and children but most intensely by lesbian and gay children.

There are schools in the UK now where there are now almost no declared lesbians, all of the girls who are same sex attracted are identifying as men and starting the process to having their breasts amputated and taking testosterone which is not proved as being safe for female consumption. St Paul's school for girls in Loneon now has 10 girls who have self identified as boys and are transitioning.

Surely, it is better to allow people to be themselves without pathologising them and making them lifelong medical patients.

It is relevant to note that in highly homophobic countries like Iran that sexual reassignment surgery is offered as an alternative to imprisonment or death instead of living as gay people, people are coerced to 'become the other sex' so that they can have relationships that are deemed to be heterosexual.

  1. Effect on children.

The changes to the GRA 2004 will mean that sex will be viewed as changeable. Also, under the changes proposed to the law, any questioning of a very young child's assertion that they are the opposite biological sex could be classified as conversion therapy. This would mean in an extreme case that parents could have their child removed from them if they refuse to call their child by the opposite sex and start the process of transitioning them. A process which generally leads them to taking sterilising drugs and causes them distress.

Telling children the lie that biological sex can be changed causes confusion for young impressionable children, who should be free to grow up experimenting with their identity without promting and coercion from lobbying groups like GIRES, Mermaids and others . Sex is an immutable fact, gender is a social construct.

Sex stereotypes like girls like pink and dresses do not mean that a boy who enjoys these things is in fact a girl. He is just a boy who likes pink and dresses. He should not be coerced into life changing decisions that will make his life complicated and cause him distress for the rest of his life. The changes proposed would mean that sex will be viewed as changeable and that any dispute of this fact could be challenged as 'conversion therapy'

Teaching children that a person can easily switch sexes back and forth and that it is a straight forward issue is not scientifically accepted. Children have wonderful, flexible imaginations and should not be taught at school that their bodies can be wrong and need to be changed. The results of this new orthodoxy that is being taught in some schools are younger and younger children being given either puberty blockers (The drugs being lauded as a safe option for 'putting puberty on hold' Lupron is currently used for those with prostate cancer and in some circumstances children with early puberty.It has a huge number of negative side effects on adults and is contra indicated for use in children. Children who have used the drug have reported enormous physical and mental problems Please see link)

The organisation Gendered Intelligence are sponsored by drugs companies and are now lobbying and teaching anti science ideology at primary schools, such as pink and blue brains and that if a child doesn't conform to gendered stereotypes they could be in the wrong body. Changes to the GRA 2004 will speed up this trend.

Gay children being pushed to 'become' the opposite sex as being a straight trans child is preferable to being a gay child. In these circumstances the trans ideology is a form of gay conversion. Please note that in Iran where homosexuality is illegal, gay people are given the option to transition to the opposite sex free of charge by the state. Please see link Also, please note that there are very high rates of trans people from conservative, homophobic Christian backgrounds.

I am concerned that if it is made simple to self-identify, we will see many of those teenage girls self-identifying as male when in fact they may benefit from proper counselling and time to reflect.
It would validate the massive rise in girls identifying as boys and opting to have their breasts removed and taking testosterone (which over time can cause sterility) and in extreme cases having their wombs removed and their vaginas cut and reappropriated with parts of their thigh or arm as male genitals. Girls are being forced into ever smaller, regressive sexual stereotypes. Surely we should be honest and let girls know that they don't need to be a man to act in ways that vary from sexual stereotypes for women. Please see link

  1. Effect on free speech

At present sex is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act 2010. Allowing people to switch their sex classification at will without any regulation means that the term 'woman' and all of its current protections becomes meaningless.

It would mean that once a man self identifies as a woman, the law would need to entertain his assertions that certain language is offensive and can be classified as hate speech. For example, there have already been instances within trans controlled student unions where women are unable to talk about menstruation and bodily parts as these cause offence and exclude and are 'literally violent' towards trans women.

Finally, during the consultation I would be most grateful if you would discuss the following issues that are at risk:

  1. Maintain sex as a protected characteristic in the Equality Act 2010
  1. Sex categorisation of statistics so that we can meaningfully continue to monitor equal pay, representation of women in public life on company boars etc. and that the recording of male violence is not eroded.
  1. An agreed process for categorisation of national statistics on Transgender trends.
  1. Female only spaces including in schools and sports facilities and public venues and workplaces.
  1. Facilities for the most vulnerable women in society such as prisons and shelters.
  1. Sports arrangements and protecting the integrity of competition for women and girls.
  1. Free speech and any conflict arising from creating gender identity as a protected characteristic.
  1. Sex discrimination law and the potential loss of meaningful sex based competitions

Kind regards,

Thelilywhite · 02/10/2017 13:38

QuarksandLeptons

Really good letter - just noticed a wee typo?
'but it should over write' do you mean should it overwrite? or it shouldn't over right ...
Dont mean to be critical but it could change the sense of your first para point 2

misscockerspaniel · 02/10/2017 13:42

Point 2, safety & dignity etc, "...should not overwrite..." (Sorry, thought I had better point it out before I forget, still reading your excellent letter)

QuarksandLeptons · 02/10/2017 16:52

Thanks Lilywhite & cocker spaniel.

Those corrections make sense
I should have posted here before I sent the letters off - gah!

Written fast and furiously without checking as ran out of time and it was starting to feel like I'd never get it sent.

Hopefully will be of use to someone else too. I put it together with info from lots of different places - last section is from Ruth Serwotka's letter from the feminist socialist group

QuarksandLeptons · 03/10/2017 12:32

Hello again,

I've got a template on word and pdf with the corrections made that I can send to people. Just DM me.

QuarksandLeptons · 03/10/2017 12:40

Also, has all of the links which back up some of the statements made, which for some reason did not paste through

lostplot · 03/10/2017 21:06

Quick question, is it better to write a letter or send an email?

BetsyM00 · 03/10/2017 22:49

Emails good for including links, letter possibly more likely to get attention - do both!

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lostplot · 04/10/2017 08:46

I'll do both, thanks!

Thelilywhite · 04/10/2017 09:23

lostplot
I did both saying in the email I was also sending a letter. To both Justine Greening and my local mp I got a reply to each letter both useless and essentially propaganda for each party. Hope you have better luck.

BetsyM00 · 07/10/2017 12:08

New campaign materials from SAGES for sharing. Both are bullet point summaries of everything you need to know and can be printed as handouts, for MPs, etc. They are essentially the same but a short version and a long version.

  • Quick Facts: Sex, Gender and Equal Rights (2 pages)
  • Fact Sheet: Sex, Gender and Equal Rights (4 pages)
They cover:
  • Definitions
  • Current law and proposed changes
  • Lots of key statistics
  • Implications for women, children, and lesbian and gay community
  • References

pdfs:
Quick facts
Fact sheet

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ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 07/10/2017 17:13

BetsyM00 thanks so much for doing all of this!

It may be worth noting that I got exactly the same reply from Patrick Grady (MSP) - I think it is heartening that he's had enough emails about it to warrant a stock response?

BetsyM00 · 11/10/2017 19:09

Good blog by David TC Davies, Conservative MP for Monmouth - may be worth passing on to your own MP.
www.david-davies.org.uk/news/transgender-rights-versus-womens-privacy

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BetsyM00 · 11/10/2017 19:11

Another petition to sign:

Keep the category of sex mandatory question in the 2021 Census.

We oppose the published tentative recommendation by the Office of National Statistics to make sex a non-mandatory field in the 2021 Census. We demand that sex remains a mandatory question in the Census and is included in all government demographic data collection in accordance with SDG5 commitments.

Data collection disaggregated by sex gives us vital information for policy making and distribution of resources. If implemented, the ONS recommendation will make widely acceptable that sex becomes a voluntary question. This will render useless equal opportunities monitoring designed to combat sex discrimination. It will influence governments worldwide making difficult the monitoring of imbalances resulting from sex-selective abortion, female infanticide and unequal treatment of girls and women.

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/202435

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AveEldon · 11/10/2017 20:51

Thanks QuarksandLeptons

I have emailed my MP again ( didn't get a reply last time apart from an autoreply checking if I had included my NI number?!)

QuarksandLeptons · 11/10/2017 22:23

Hi AveEldon,

I don’t think you need to send them your NI number, just your name and address so they can verify that you are a constituent

BetsyM00 · 12/10/2017 09:55

One more petition to sign:

Keep sex segregated areas sex segregated

www.change.org/p/theresa-may-mp-keep-sex-segregated-areas-sex-segregated/fbog/11955517

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