Girls only schools

[ParadiseCity]

I'm struggling with a potential decision and wondered if anyone would mind sharing their thoughts please...

DD may have the opportunity to go to an all girls secondary school. We have looked round and she loved it. She liked but didn't love the mixed high school (which DS is already at and I think is fantastic).

It doesn't sit right with me to separate children into girls and boys. However I work in a male dominated profession and can see that an environment free from mansplaining and being talked over is very appealing. Just not sure what is for the best.

silk - dds school has a male head and I was irrationally angry when I realised, nearly didn't send her there, what a bad message it sends.

I posted in here about it and got my are handed to me on a plate.
Best person for the job regardless of sex.

Still think it is crap.

One of the advantages we have is that the girls and boys school stand next to each other, share a DT block and a sixth form and all school transport (lots of it as kids travel from all over) is all mixed.

This does mean there is a lot of social interaction (no fence between 2 schools, so mingel at lunch time up to a point) and they all know each other, but classes are ther own school. I think this tends to give the best of both worlds

Lots of advantages and lots of bitchery and subtle bullying in my experience. Swings and roundabouts.

steppemum we have 2 girls' schools locally, one selective and the other non-selective. BOTH have a male Head Teacher {angry}

I would send her there if you can.

I went to both - and it was a bit of a culture shock going from the girls school, where homework was done, where it wasn't even a thing that I did CDT and Physics, where the uniform was trousers or skirts, to a mixed school where I had to wear a skirt, where people mucked about in class, and I was the only girl doing CDT (and Textiles - ie. sewing - was a whole separate subject), oh, and the physics teacher didn't like having girls in his class and hounded me out.

I went to an all girls Catholic primary and secondary. To this day I'm pretty sure it hampered my social skills

Interesting, seems to be the "Catholic" element that the horrible girls' schools have in common!
I can imagine how the gender stereotyping that's traditional with religions would easily erase all the positive effects that the environment might otherwise have.

OP, if your daughter loves the school, then why not send her there?

Aside from the benefits of girls only schools, there's also the fact that if you go to a school where a sibling already is, teachers know your sibling and make comparisons, have prejudices, etc.

if your daughter loves the school, then why not send her there?

Good question!! I think she is wrong and the other school is better I suppose I think what she liked was the small and safe feeling it has. Which I think could become stifling and narrow minded. Other school is big and more diverse - in lots of ways not just gender.

I went to an all girls private school and hated every single second of it , I felt suffocated . I was very academic and a high achiever, I left with very good exam results but it completely put me off wanting to stay in structured education .
Since school I have preferred both friendships and work environments that are more male orientated

I attend one moment and have only ever been in girls' schools (primary and my current one). It is absolutely fantastic. Girls are supportive, encouraging, inspiring - there are friendships across year groups and many girls from older years volunteer to "link" with girls from younger years, forming real friendships. There's also an excellent Feminist Society which many girls from across the years are involved with. The misogyny at a fair few mixed schools also sounds horrendous, as does the rise in sexual assaults in schools.

Being educated amongst so many passionate, talented and supportive girls is wonderful. Free whilst at school of stereotyping and sexism, it's no coincidence that at girls' schools the take up of STEM subjects is so much higher than at mixed schools (Maths is one of the most taken A Levels at mine and I have a friend at another girls' school at which Computer Science is taught from Year 7 and has become very popular - not that it should take being in single sex education to achieve this). There are so many different types of personalities and each is respected and valued - people get on so well. Former pupils coming back to give talks about their hugely successful careers is also brilliant - seeing women who've excelled in so many fields. It's a wonderful environment to be educated in and I'm very thankful I'm able to enjoy it, I'd never swap it for a mixed school. My experience is certainly not unique either - the Old Girls' Association is very active and shows how many former pupils are eager to keep up with the school and continue to contribute, and I have friends at a couple of other comparable girls' schools who also speak as highly of theirs. I'd be happy to expand on all this as I could write an even longer message than I already have on it.

FWIW, my former school was that rare animal, a single sex comp!

That should have been I attend one at the moment in my previous post.

I went to an all girls grammar school. At the time I wasn't a big fan but in retrospect it was excellent and I really don't think I would have done as well as I did anywhere else. I wouldn't hesitate to send DD to an all girls school, but the only one nearby is expensive!

giving into the idea that the world is a sexist place

In my opinion the world is an extremely sexist place. Girls' schools are environments we can be free of that for a time, be valued for who we are, be ourselves and not have to put up with the sexism which is inherent in the world and commonplace in mixed schools from what I've read and heard first hand. The message is that your sex doesn't matter, you do, your interests and passions, your opinions. There are also often environments for discussing sexism and misogyny within society when the time is right (possibly not at every girls' school).

as I said ds is at an all boys school, and I actually think he is becoming less sexist rather than more.

This is heartening. My brothers are in all boys' education and certainly the elder of the two challenges his friends on sexism now but I've had some impact on this

I wonder if the confidence girls receive is a result of being in selective education, that is knowing or being told they are best, rather than a result of not being around boys?

That may be part of it but I don't think this is the case. My school is an independent one but I feel it's being around so many intelligent girls which is what makes it so inspiring for me. I don't think we're told we're the best either - more that we should strive to be the best we can and follow our passions. Of course it's a huge privilege to be able to attend such a school though.

the horrible bullying that seems to be the modus operandi of teenage girls

Sorry to hear of your experience and I hope you're alright now. I do however hate this kind of statement which in my opinion is deeply misogynist. My school as I've posted is incredibly supportive with girls looking out for one another and supporting each other across friendship and year groups (and I know friends at other girls' schools who speak similarly of theirs). The camaraderie and support girls have for one another in all sorts of situations is so important and has helped me a great deal. I get enraged when people suggest teenage girls (of which I am one) are "horrible" or "bullying".

Sorry, I responded to different posters in that last message without stipulating who each time. Too much I wanted to post.

I think that when it comes to your decision you need to boil it down to the right school for your particular child.
Which one does she like? What's your gut feel? Forget the larger arguments, make it as personal as possible with the choices you actually have.

I went to a mixed school, and as I was quite academic, I was sat next to various 'naughty' boys to keep them in line.
I also had a much harder time from boys rather than girls about being a swot.

My DS goes to an all boys school, and it's been great for him. He enjoys music and drama and can get stuck in without it being seen as something that the girls do.

I went to see another coed local prep school choir. They had about 30 girls and 5 boys. Contrast this to our all boys inclusive choir of about 45, with everyone in it from sensitive Y3s to the captain of the rugby team.

Single sex environments do have their downsides, but they can be overwhelmingly positive.

Which I think could become stifling and narrow minded. Other school is big and more diverse - in lots of ways not just gender.

Do you have reason to believe that the school is narrow minded, other than it being an all girls school?

Diversity of ... what? Race? Culture? Doesn't always mean that there's diversity of ideas or thought. Misogyny for example is something that men (and many women) of all cultures and religions agree on.

On the other hand, you do not need diversity to be open minded. There's lots of families where the only diversity is that there's two sexes, and who still manage to be openminded.

If your daughter feels safer in a smaller environment, then that is probably what is good for her, and she won't feel stifled.

Some people like vanishing in large groups (I loved university because I could walk by mostly unseen and unnoticed) but others might feel threatened by it.

Your daughter knows best what suits her, surely?

I went to an all girls grammar and it was the making of me (alcoholic abusive mother at home).
I never once felt under confident in class, and would always feel I could contribute. I also didn't find it bitchy (no boys to fight over maybe?), if I had a daughter I would send her to an all girls school.
My friends at mixed schools cared about makeup and what boys thought of them very early, and seemed constantly self conscious in a way we weren't.

I went to a few different high schools, because we moved around. The best experience I had was at an all-girls school and I don't think that was a coincidence.

Not having constant (mostly negative and often harassing) attention from boys felt like I finally had room to breathe.

If I ever had a DD I would absolutely seek single-sex education for her.

I went to an all-girls secondary school, and it was truly awful. Bitchy, horrid girls. We had woodwork, sewing and cookery, so bit of a mixture there in terms on lessons, but it was really just terrible. There was an all-boys school next door, so maybe that made it worse? Or just a generally bad school haha.

As soon as I went to my mixed sixth form everything felt so much better, more friends, less bitchiness. My friend who went to both schools with me agreed it was so much better with boys as well as girls.

I wish we had single sex schools here

Boy and girls are different - they mature differently - have different hobbies and interests

Why should we be expected to 'be the same' which usually means girls conforming to the way boys do things?

I was at an all girls school and I never noticed the lack of boys - DD is in mixed and the stories she tells are shocking

None of my family had any option of an all girls or all boys school, at least those growing up since the 1950s. However if the experiences of my mum and others of her generation who went to girls schools and those I have known who have been to them, they have been very positive.

You didn't post that your son liked a mixed sex school, but choose to do it when your daughter was brought by you to a same sex school?

Where is the dilemma? Your daughter likes one school and your son likes another.

green

What kind of stories?

As an adult I have to say I get on better with men but I do remember alot of mucking about by boys in school and the constant who fancies who and the being asked outburst so they can dump you seconds later and it pretty much just being accepted that's how boys were and little done about it.

Very much depends on the child.

Dd1 went to Catholic girls Grammar School. She didn't excel at first, but the school empowered her and eventually encouraged her to apply for medicine.

She herself said she knows she wouldn't have concentrated as much in mixed environment.

Dd2 also passed Grammar School entrance exam but hated being in an all girls school and left in June of Y7. She is happier now in a mixed comp.

I went to a girls school and I'd say it was one of the most positive influences of my life. I didn't like the school but no one ever taught me I couldn't do anything because of my sex and I left there knowing the sky was the limit. It was a truly shocking contrast to the overt and subtle sexism of university and the world of work. I have bounced back, but I'm not sure I would have done if I hadn't been educated during my most formative years in an environment which really recognised and valued me and my skills for what they were. The other girls were total bitches but there were no limitations imposed on me and that has stood me in very good stead.