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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

I've just been lectured at by a trans woman for painting my daughter's room pink

147 replies

Funnyonion17 · 03/04/2017 13:33

Just that. That's the 3rd time during my pregnancy I've been ranted at about gender and I've seriously had enough. Apparently by painting her room pink I'm assuming she's going to be a girl (she's deffo a girl unless the scan was wrong but hey ho). According to the person ranting at me it's irresponsible to paint the room pink and i should base it on the babies personality instead. She's 33 weeks in my womb, she has no personality! I just wanted a pretty space to store her clothes etc. Also after my scan i was ranted at over on the baby boards, apparently her sex is a girl her gender in unknown. I'm sick to death now of being made to feel I'm irresponsible for acknowledging my unborn child as a girl. It's madness. Sorry if my post is a bit disjointed, i have a bad case of sleep deprivation today.

OP posts:
originalbiglymavis · 03/04/2017 16:58

DSs room is blue. It's been blue since we moved in which was 3 years before he was born. I wouldn't have changed it if he'd been a girl and he's always wanted to keep the same colour apart from now, when his choice would be orange over my dead body apparently.

ChocChocPorridge · 03/04/2017 17:03

I had an orange wall up my staircase original - it made me happy every morning when I walked down, so don't completely rule it out :)

Orlantina · 03/04/2017 17:03

the girls play girls toys/pink is for girls kicks in straight away sadly

Pink and blue are everywhere. It's like an association. I've seen many boys refuse to play with something because "it's pink and pink's a girls colour" (their words) and they won't have anything to do with it.

Where do they get that idea from?

originalbiglymavis · 03/04/2017 17:04

We are talking Guantanamo orange not glorious golden sunrise orange!

brickinitIam · 03/04/2017 17:06

Funnyonion, don't take any notice of the loonies.
You're having a girl! Congratulations!! Flowers

I'm sure she will love her beautiful pink, girly bedroom.

WobblyLegs5 · 03/04/2017 17:07

I was in a toy shop the other day, for a whole 5 mins while my kids spent their bday vouchers, & 2 dufferent lots of parents/grown ups said no that's a girls toy to their boys

Original poster
Funnyonion17 · 03/04/2017 17:27

unlimited that's exactly how it was put to me on the baby boards! Vestel i painted her room pink as i like it. I didn't get her a pink pram as i dislike them, she has a blue pram. No i won't be changing the pink if she turns out a boy. You are questioning me and hinting at things of which you know nothing about. My boys liked dolls, tea sets, craft items heavily marketed towards girls, toy kitchens aswell as cars, avengers, etc etc. Tbh they lead me with their likes, not me them. They both still wear pink?! So i don't get your point tbh. It's just colours, your reading far too much into it and i find it offensive. Whilst i do understand nurture impacts how a child may turn out, it's not always so.

OP posts:
Datun · 03/04/2017 17:45

We all know that toys, colours, activities, etc, are currently very gendered. When I was growing up, although the adult roles may have been more gendered, the roles of children not so much. Maybe because the activities were generally generated by the kids themselves, not organised as after-school club etc. And we didn't have as much shop bought stuff.

So I think it's very hard to remain neutral. Unless you take a deliberate decision to stay away from gendered toys/colours. Which will be very limiting. So if you give your daughter an ironing board you're buying into gender stereotypes, if you refuse to give her an ironing board you're also buying into gender stereotypes!

And when they go to school, you have everyone else's social conditioning to counter.

It's a bloody minefield. All you can do is stay aware and do your best.

Enjoy your baby OP. You sound like you've got it taped.

ErrolTheDragon · 03/04/2017 18:39

My house now contains 3 adults, all of whom have a bedroom painted as they wanted. Mine is apricot. DD's is soft jade. DH's is a sort of slightly beige-ish pink. It's the colour he decided went best with his curtains and bedspread, and signifies precisely nothing.

Congratulations OP. Flowers

VestalVirgin · 03/04/2017 19:33

You are questioning me and hinting at things of which you know nothing about.

I shouldn't question you, but also shouldn't talk about things I know nothing about (because you haven't told us) ... yeah, right. Confused

With what's going on in the English-speaking world, you can hardly blame people for assuming that your daughters clothes and toys will be pink, too. Even if you don't want them to be, there's enough people who might give you pink things.

We are talking Guantanamo orange not glorious golden sunrise orange!

Yeah, that's not a good wall colour. I lived in a room with bright red walls for a while. Was very disconcerting.

Original poster
Funnyonion17 · 03/04/2017 20:36

Vestal your off ya rocker! So what if people buy my child pink. She's had teddies so far of all different colours, why should i be concerned about the pink? There is nothing wrong with me liking pink clothes like there is nothing wrong with her being influenced by my choices. It only becomes an issue if a parents tries to force a child to be something they aren't after the child has asserted their wishes.

Years ago i decked my eldests room out on Winnie the Pooh, funnily enough he hated pooh bear and all traces where gone by age 2 when he began asserting himself. He didn't just like Pooh bear because it was in his face! Hmm

OP posts:
Orlantina · 03/04/2017 20:47

It only becomes an issue if a parents tries to force a child to be something they aren't after the child has asserted their wishes

Do you think that wishes of a child are asserted without any influence from other people?

Years ago i decked my eldests room out on Winnie the Pooh, funnily enough he hated pooh bear and all traces where gone by age 2 when he began asserting himself

DS doesn't like pink because he thinks it's 'girl's colour' and society has taught him that pink = girl. Despite me telling him that there are no such thing as boy and girl colours, society keeps reinforcing the message to him that pink is for girls and blue is for boys.

Unicorn81 · 03/04/2017 20:58

What a load of pish, tell them to fuck right off. So does that mean you cant buy your baby any clothes with pink in it or nice dresses? Paint the room any colour you want, its nothing to do with anyone else. Congrats on your lil girl🌼

RogueBiscuit · 03/04/2017 21:08

Whys my post been deleted?

I'm sick of being forced to pretend that these MEN are women. If people reading can't cope with basic biology they need fucking help.

BBCNewsRave · 03/04/2017 21:48

Mavis We are talking Guantanamo orange not glorious golden sunrise orange!

If he really wants this, I used some called "Jelly bean" (from Wilkinson's) to paint my bathroom... it's edging towards terracotta and ok in small doses. Maybe one wall?

Thing is OP, if you had chosen pink "because it's a girl" then yes people might disagree because of gender stereotypes. Fair enough. But presumably the trans viewpoint would be "You shouldn't paint it pink because the female baby might turn out to identify as a boy and thus hate pink". Which is the opposite, really - if you had a boy who declared aged 6 he was really a girl (Hmm), they'd encourage you to paint the room pink...

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 04/04/2017 01:45

It's a funny thing, isn't it - DS1 (9) will wear pink, no problem. He has done dancing since he was 3 and it's often part of one of his costumes.
He has toys of all sorts, but mostly likes animals, dragons, and his kitchen (although he'd rather play in the big one now!).
DS2 (4), on the other hand, resolutely refuses to have ANYTHING pink because it's a girl colour, he won't sing "girls' songs", he won't play with "girls' toys" (although he, too, likes the toy kitchen - perhaps because I ensure DH takes his turn with cooking and washing up?) - but he also has done dancing since he was 3. He's a bit more stroppy about costumes, but so far hasn't had pink inflicted on him, thankfully (he didn't mind the purple with shiny spots).

Both brought up the same, both given the same opportunities and toys, and yet quite different attitudes.

My sister's girls have all been conditioned to hate green though, as my sister hates it. They're all pinks and purples - don't know how much of that is her influence and how much their own choice, as they weren't given any choice when they were very young (certainly not where green was concerned!)

FreeNiki · 04/04/2017 01:50

I dont get the issue here. Are we now supposed to give girls blue paint and boys clothes and boys pink rooms?

Or paint it a bland beige and provide gender neutral everything?

If the OP wants to pain her dds room pink why not? As her dd grows if she doesn't like it she can ask for it to be changed.

SSR24479 · 04/04/2017 02:39

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Klaphat · 04/04/2017 02:57

Probably only someone who's worked in publishing, design or the art world would know that the printing process colour 'magenta', one of the four basic ingredients of process colour pigment mixes, is a bright, true pink.

Or anyone who owns a colour printer?

numberseven · 04/04/2017 04:25

They picked a fight by asking me if I'd chosen to be told the sex (I had) and then aggressively asking why since "It doesn't tell you the gender"

Happened to me too. First he asked me if I had found out the sex and then started hounding me on "why wouldn't you let the child decide for themselves". I wouldn't have brought the issue up with that person but I was directly asked.

MiaowTheCat · 04/04/2017 07:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

WobblyLegs5 · 04/04/2017 07:28

What pp's say is true- some kids are much more senstive to socially pushed sex role stereotypes, no matter how they are parented at home, many of them are vulnerable to this social conditioning, and there's no way of knowing if you have a baby if they will be one of the most vulnerable or not. So going for girls=pink on something like wall colour is a bit of a jump start on that. Which seems a shame when there's hundreds of colours to choose from. It becomes much harder when you are in asda in the middle of the night, blurry eyes trying to find bigger size of baby grows & it's pink or white & nothing else (& white obvs isn't the stupidest colour for baby's clothing)

Orlantina · 04/04/2017 08:36

Are we now supposed to give girls blue paint and boys clothes and boys pink rooms

Other colours are available though. But there's nothing wrong with pink. I believe that many people do choose pink for a girl's nursery.

ImBreakingBad · 04/04/2017 08:48

This does my head in! Your DAUGHTER is a girl if she has the female anatomy. I just read a thread about a 2yo yesterday, with these pushy fuckers people trying to say he was associating as a girl! My god, let the children be children FFS!

If it looks like a duck....

peukpokicuzo · 04/04/2017 09:08

Pink is not just a colour though. It would be great if it was but it isn't. Pinkification of everything is part of the same fucked-up notions of gender-as-a-feeling-in-your-head that is bringing is all the peak-Trans moments that those of us who are Spartacus are noticing more and more.

There should be no "boy" colours and no "girl" colours. No "boy" toys and no "girl" toys. When this cultural shift is achieved then of course a parent can paint a child's bedroom pink if they like the colour - and if you would be just as likely to choose pink if you knew your baby would have a willy then your choice isn't based on stereotypes but the fact you have two boys already who didn't get pink rooms before they were old enough to express a preference suggests to me that you are not as free from this insidiousness as you believe. Until the cultural stereotypes are a thing of the past, choosing pink is a political statement aligning yourself closer to the school of thought that yes there should be "boy" colours and "girl" colours, "boy" toys and "girl" toys.

www.pinkstinks.co.uk

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