Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How can I reconnect with feminism?

192 replies

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 12:48

Sorry for any mistakes-this is my first thread and I'm using the appSmile

Im in my very early twenties, and I really struggle to connect with the feminist movement. I'm absolutely pro-equality and ensuring the global rights for women, but my experiences have left me feeling uncomfortable about calling myself a "feminist".

When I was at school, women's issues and feminism were never discussed, so my first awareness of the movement came from websites like Tumblr and EverydaySexism. These websites were quite radical, and I struggled to identify with issues such as 'man spreading', 'mansplaining' and the general man-hating subculture that seemed to be present. It felt to me like a group of quite privileged, fortunate western women looking for reasons to complain despite there being so many serious women's issues to deal with around the world, and there was a lot of talk about the western world supporting "rape culture", which I don't believe to be true, so I grew up feeing like feminism wasn't for me.

When I got to university, I attempted to get involved in the feminism society, but found that most of the events/talks centred around 'trans liberation', 'micro aggressions' and trigger warnings/banning topics or events that might be triggering. When an infamous male misogynist was scheduled to have a talk at the university, I was excited at the opportunity it would open for a real debate on gender and equality, but the feminist society held a rally and protest that ended up causing the visit to be cancelled, which I felt was a waste of a good opportunity and probably not a great move in terms of free speech. I eventually left the society when I was openly mocked at an event about future ambitions for saying that I would like to be a young mother. Over time, I completely stopped calling myself a feminist or having anything to do with the feminist movement.

Recently, I've discovered Hannah Witton's youtube channel, and although I don't agree with everything she says, I have found her videos talking about sex, relationships, women's bodies and what it means to be a woman to be really interesting and encouraging. I've been inspired to read more books and interact with more information about feminism and women's issues, and I really want to start reconnecting with my own female identity and feeling proud to be a woman again.

The only problem is that I really don't know where to start. Can anyone recommend some influential women, works or materials that I can look into, or tell me some of the things that make them proud of being a woman and a feminist?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 03/04/2017 13:53

"Feminist men know their place? They must not speak out or have an opinion as that is an act of oppression.

Must not disagree with women...."

Yes, that's right. Well done. That is a perfect encapsulation of what feminists think

GenderEqualityAdvocate · 03/04/2017 13:55

I think I love the OP. Younger women just have a better appreication of gender issues.

IAmAmy · 03/04/2017 13:56

to say that British society encourages or accepts rape or violence against women is ridiculous

I don't think it is at all. I've heard and seen so many rape jokes/memes, so much victim blaming, so many cases of rapists being given lenient sentences, sympathy given to for example the man who avoided prison recently for "having sex with" (raping) a 12 year old girl, the list is endless. Also some of the most staunch feminists in Britain are WOC. Nimko Ali for example does incredible work fighting FGM and is also a supporter of Everyday Sexism and friend of the woman who set it up.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 13:57

I can see that I have not explained myself well, so I'll expand Smile
What I meant about privileged western women on sites such as everyday feminism was not that I don't feel any women in the western world are victims of inequality or abuse. What I was referring to, and I'm sorry that I didn't make this clearer, was the amount of anecdotes I saw on these sites referring to a man talking over someone, being called a female-associated slur, and anger at the way men sit on trains. While, these are, when considered solely within western context, issues to be discussed, I don't believe that movements focussed on these small inequalities should be a big focus at a time when women all around the world are being oppressed in terms of work, ability to vote, ability to go to school, child marriage, etc. There are serious women's issues, such as abortion rites, that need our support as nearby as Ireland, after all.
I haven't looked at the everyday sexism movement for a few years now, so if the direction of the movement has changed to include more tales of female abuse and oppression, then I apologise for not acknowledging it Smile

OP posts:
Eolian · 03/04/2017 13:58

Women in 'civilised' Western society absolutely do still suffer for being born female. Your posts read as though you don't believe that, which is particularly strange as you say that you were a victim of domestic abuse.

It is not acceptable to minimise or deny the daily sexism in this country just because women in some other countries suffer sexist abuse which can be more extreme or commonly accepted. You would not minimise the suffering of an abused child just because there are other children in the world who may be being treated even more badly.

Getting involved in helping women around the world would be a great thing to do. Rejecting other women's comcerns because you think those women are too 'privileged' (by which I presume you mean white and not poor) is misguided. Why should some women give up fighting for equal rights and treatment in society because of their bank balance or which neighbourhood they live in?

IAmAmy · 03/04/2017 13:58

Only last week in Britain a man was spared jail for beating his partner and forcing her to drink bleach. The judge also spoke of her not being "vulnerable" in legal terms due to her having a degree and a network of friends.

AssassinatedBeauty · 03/04/2017 13:58

Do you mean EverydaySexism or EverydayFeminism? They're very different sites, and EF is nothing like my kind of feminism.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:02

@AssassinatedBeauty as far as I'm concerned it used to just be one movement, but I might be wrong so I will look into it! As I said, I haven't delved into the world of online feminism for a while just because I felt somewhat disillusioned with it.

OP posts:
GenderEqualityAdvocate · 03/04/2017 14:02

Amy it goes both ways. There was the mother who was spared jail after attempting to murder her ex boyfriend. She left him with permanent brain damage but the judge ruled that to jail her because she had a child would just ruin one more life.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:06

I've received quite a few replies and I'm getting a bit lost in regards to what I've replied to and what I haven't, so I just want to thank you all for them.
I really hope I'm not coming across as aggressive - I came to mumsnet hoping to be exposed to new perspectives and that's what I've received, so I'm very grateful!
I want to learn more about the movement, and your messages have shown me exactly what issues are considered important by feminists, so that gives me a good basis to do further research and perhaps have my opinions changed in the process.

I really am grateful for every response, so thank you very much (even if you think I seem like a bad person - maybe I'm just a bit ignorant after years of not being exposed to material about women's issues, so I will fix that!)

OP posts:
ILoveDolly · 03/04/2017 14:08

I definitely identify as a feminist but all this no gender nonsense, what? It's just not grounded in reality. I love some men, you know, the ones who aren't horrible people, misogynistic or pushy sex pests.
You can be a feminist just by happily living life and trying to bring your children up to love human kind, and strive to be what they want. I don't see that harm in gender as a concept as long as we accept that gender, sexuality and self-presentation are a spectrum not a binary.

AssassinatedBeauty · 03/04/2017 14:09

Everyday Sexism is a British site about individual women's experiences. Everyday Feminism is an American magazine site about intersectional feminism, and has nothing to do with ES and never has done as far as I'm aware.

IAmAmy · 03/04/2017 14:09

Not to mention the risk of stalking. For example Shana Grice, who reported her abusive ex-boyfriend to the police for harassing her. The police responded by giving her a warning, he then went on to murder her.

Chemicalromance Everyday Sexism and Everyday Feminism are completely separate. I recommend the 'Everyday Sexism' book.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:09

Additionally, to respond to people who are asking why my experiences of abuse aren't reflected in my views - I will admit that I have always viewed my abuser not as a man, but as a person who was abusive. A woman was also involved in the abuse (although not the physical aspects) so I suppose that has given me a perspective that it isn't solely men who are the issue, but just bad people in general.

OP posts:
Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:12

It looks like I've been a bit confused regarding everyday sexism/feminism - when I interacted with it, everyday sexism was popular on tumblr as a category that people tagged their own experiences under. From a quick search, it looks like this has perhaps morphed into the everyday feminism movement, as everyday sexism isn't quite the page that I remembered.
Thank you for clearing that up for me!

OP posts:
GenderEqualityAdvocate · 03/04/2017 14:14

Hooray. Chemicalromance that is the most sensible thing I have seen written on here. You win the internet! Best person on this forum by a mile.

BertrandRussell · 03/04/2017 14:14

Everyday Sexism and Everyday Feminism are completely different.

GenderEqualityAdvocate · 03/04/2017 14:15

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

IAmAmy · 03/04/2017 14:15

The scale of abuse perpetrated by men against women and children (girls and boys) means I can't agree. There is a clear issue.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:17

@AssassinatedBeauty @IAmAmy @BertrandRussell I will make sure to read the everyday sexism book, hopefully I'll have a better understanding of the differences between the movements when I finish it!

OP posts:
IAmAmy · 03/04/2017 14:18

Chemicalromance it is a good, if at times infuriating read. I personally pay no attention to "Everyday Feminism" for a variety of reasons.

BertrandRussell · 03/04/2017 14:18

"From a quick search, it looks like this has perhaps morphed into the everyday feminism movement, as everyday sexism"

Honestly, it hasn't. Completely different things. Why are you finding this hard to accept?

GenderEqualityAdvocate · 03/04/2017 14:19

Really Amy?Men are the perpetrators?

Despite how enlightened some feminists are the "presumption of perversion" will always get wheeled out at one point.

scallopsrgreat · 03/04/2017 14:20

I think you made yourself perfectly clear in the OP, Chemical.

It is possible to focus on more than one thing at once within a movement. Everyday Sexism was set up to focus on the small street harassment/annoyances that happen everyday to women. And what a massive picture it built up - that there is a problem with our culture even in the western world that no-one takes seriously because each individual incident is seemingly trivial.

However, do you really think feminists aren't doing anything about any of those other issues (interesting that male violence wasn't amongst them)? There is a big FGM movement in the UK; plenty of opportunities to get involved in overseas feminism (e.g. 50 million missing is an organisation looking at why there are so many missing girls in India); there are active support groups for women in this country i.e. Northern Ireland who are unable to access abortions and pressure groups to change the laws. There are women on this site who've been involved in initiatives and ongoing projects to help with contraception and safer births in Africa through the Bill & Melinda Gates foundation (for example).

But hey, you've made friends with a man who likes to buy women to orgasm into, so not all is lost today.

Chemicalromance · 03/04/2017 14:21

@BertrandRussell I apologise if my genuine confusion based on a past experience is causing you anger, but some people just don't have the same understanding and knowledge of these topics that you do. I have acknowledged my mistake, and I'm not sure what else you want me to say now Sad

OP posts:
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.

Swipe left for the next trending thread