Nordic Model on the Big Questions tomorrow

[LauraMipsum]

The BBC's political equivalent of Jeremy Kyle is hosting "has the time come to decriminalise sex work" tomorrow morning.

I'm going to be in the audience; if anyone wants to support the Nordic model voice via twitter please do!

It's not a job.

Also I can't resist this sweeping statement:
Nobody silences the NM argument
That is actually so wrong - it's actually funny. How can you be comfortable gender making such a sweeping statement - that you don't even need evidence to refute it?

A most mundane (but shocking nonetheless) example is I once got kicked out of a 'feminist' group for suguesting reading a book by an exited woman who advocates for the NM ffs.

It is not a job? It is the "oldest profession'

Profession : "any type of work that needs special training or a particular skill, often one that is respected because it involves a high level of education" according to the dictionary.

Do you think CSA, rape, poverty, DV, coercion, deception, etc are 'special training' techniques for this 'profession' gender?

What is to be done about health and safety GenderEqualityAdvocate?

Both the prostituted women, and those that clean the rooms (quite possibly the same person) have the right to a safe work environment do they not? Since body fluids are involved, that needs to include protective gear, hazardous waste disposal etc.

How do you propose to make it so that women in prostitution don't have a 3X higher rate (conservatively) of Gonorrhea than a similar woman who doesn't have sex for money?

If you have some suggestions along with decriminalization that actually do make it safer, and bring it into line with normal working practice I'd love to hear them.

Many UK nationals did it full time and many dipped in and out when they wanted.

Assuming you mistyped that as its bollocks

Maybe you meant to say that in the past prostitutes tended to be uk nationals some of whom did it full time and others dipped in and out

And the poster upthread was referring to a man paying €49 for as many goes as he likes...as opposed to £20 a go

Like its a fucking all you can eat buffet

I think the ECP woman just made the point about health and safety. "Let women work together".

Good points about the Nordic model. It means men go to greater efforts to protect their anonimity. Far harder for women to screen them. Far harder for the police to trace the violent men.

I have a close friend who has worked in prostitution for 30 years. Since she was 15. Her friends and sister did it so she followed them.

She takes career breaks, she took time off to be with her children, she tried normal "civvie jobs". She goes back though. She has a whole wealth of life experience but wants the lifestyle that the money from prostitution gives her.

She has worked streets, parlours but now works from home and does tours from hotels. She is intelligent and articulate and had plenty of other choices in life but has settled on prostitution as her profession and has found a model she is happy with.

Sorry if this challenges your idea of exploited women but her experience is that the majority of women choose the profession.

Why then criminalise men who want consentual sex with another adult?

Yes, child prostitution is a great model to base policy on.

Consent can never be bought.

Why then criminalise men who want consentual sex with another adult?

There we go. That's more like it! This is your real concern.

Exactly venus

Someone groomed into prostitution at the age of 15? Nah no exploitation there clearly. FFS.

I'm not wedded to the Nordic model but I don't want German super brothels. They sound like hell on earth. I am deeply uncomfortable with the idea of women from impoverished nations shipped here.

Also why is it when I go for a sexual health checkup do they explicitly ask if I've payed for sex? There must be a public health dimension to this question otherwise why even ask? As such we all have a horse in this race from a health perspective. Especially as the NHS is publicly funded.

Anyone know the names of the panelists on the programme?

Sex workers and their clients will be encouraged to get screened more often. You often hear of localised outbreaks of infections amongst sex workers and their client base

I don't know if I can bear to watch further - but it looks like another situation where advocates the NM didn't want to take part in the programme.

Oh and Dervel, the grooming aspect. She says that was typical. Women relatives already in the industry were typically the ones to bring their friends and relatives in. Mid 80s they were still less aware of the child abuse aspect.

I doubt anyone these days would be so reckless. Anyone under 18 and it is statutory rape unless you are the Queen's son.

There were plenty of NM supporters there. The show for once was very balanced. Nicky Campbell even opened citing the Nordic model. Jeez you people want it all your own way.

I didn't watch it - were the NM advocate guests?

Yes one woman who made the point that it is men's behaviour that needs to change and not legalisation.

Essentially she is right. Men need to behave more responsibly but I cannot see that potentially criminalising them will serve that objective. It will just push them towards criminals who control women and can meet that need for anonymous and off the radar prostitution

Oh and Dervel, the grooming aspect. She says that was typical. Women relatives already in the industry were typically the ones to bring their friends and relatives in. Mid 80s they were still less aware of the child abuse aspect

I don't know you can write that with a straight face. Any half decent person would have seen that forcing a 15 year old into prostitution was abuse.

Oh and just to reiterate , prostitution is not a job , a profession or an industry.

Oh yes child prostitution. How empowering.

criminals who control women and can meet that need for anonymous and off the radar prostitution
Prostitition is not a need. You sound very creepy.

It was what women from that background did in the 80s. It was her sisters and cousins who got her into sex work. Now with hindsight they most likely realise they groomed/abused her. She is not angry though. That is just how it had always worked. Society has moved on and she was perhaps the last generation to be groomed by her closest female aquaintances

That wasn't too bad. He was quite adept at stopping Adams from dominating the thing.