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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Do you think men can be feminists?

999 replies

AVirginLitTheCandle · 01/01/2017 23:39

This may sound like a stupid question but do you think men can be feminists?

I've always thought they can be but I perhaps some radical feminists will disagree with me.

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 04/01/2017 00:46

I didn't put that apostrophe in "perhaps"

DrMorbius · 04/01/2017 00:58

Apologies Sparrow I was skimming and I misread your post Blush Blush this is for me Biscuit

DrMorbius · 04/01/2017 01:03

AF you may not recall that I have two young adult DD's, neither clean or cook, as I do it.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 04/01/2017 01:05

There is absolutely no point in allowing girls to receive subtle negative messages their entire lives and then expecting them to be unaffected as adults. You have to tackle all of it as it all contributes

And I don't think the extremely negativee opinions often expressed on this forum about what girls can expect their lives to be is particularly helpful or encouraging self confidence in girls or women. Life is presented as something awful which happens to girls and women over which they have little and can expect to have little control.

AnyFucker · 04/01/2017 01:08

What's that got to do with making a snipe about how much "spare time" someone has ?

If you feel resentful about how much time another person can spend debating a subject on t'internet perhaps you need to get those adult dd's to pull their weight then Wink

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 04/01/2017 01:09

I seriously doubt there's many feminists who think pointing out sexism isn't worthwhile

I think you could apply that to many people. My very conservative (with a small "c") husband gave up on James Bond films years ago because of that.

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 06:38

I know that's your interpretation of it Lass but that's not what it's about at all.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 04/01/2017 07:27

I think you could apply that to many people. My very conservative (with a small "c") husband gave up on James Bond films years ago because of that

I actually thought of you whilst writing that.
Yes doing a feminist thing doesn't necessarily make you a feminist - let alone dictate that brand feminist you are,,

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 07:35

I didn't say that doing certain things makes you a feminist. I said pointing out sexism in fiction is an example of a radical feminist act. It doesn't mean you are a radical feminist.

CocoaX · 04/01/2017 07:37

Smile at DrM -not sure if the comment about your adult DDs not cleaning or cooking is meant to be an indictment of your parenting or an indictment of womankind based on a sample size of two!

My friend, mother of three under fives, simply has the iPad propped up in her kitchen. But that is not relevant either.

HilbertRiddle · 04/01/2017 07:41

sparrowhawk "Because he's a man and everything is about him! How dare we little women have a conversation among ourselves! We must be using our spare time on real people, ie men.

I never called anyone a halfwit, DrM"

There you go again, this is basically the same message as your first reply to Dr M. You didn't like what he had to say so you immediately become passive aggressive with accusing him of being self-centered, using sarcasm and completely failing to engage with his points. Actually rather ironic how you act given what you accuse men of.

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 07:43

It'd be great if you could contribute to the thread Hilbert, rather than just telling me off.

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 07:50

Also I'm not sure how I could engage with DrM's 'points' when all he did was comment on my spare time and accuse me of saying something I didn't say.

CharlieSierra · 04/01/2017 07:51

Hilbert why is it you think she should avoid sarcasm and aggression whereas he need not?

DeviTheGaelet · 04/01/2017 07:54

when you are coming across very biased. Asking for a plan from rad fems and when people give you examples you say that's just a feminist act so not radical.
I'm not sure why you are so hung up on categorising feminism. That's "small stuff" to me. If someone's behaving in a feminist way I care not how they label themselves. Similarly, people who behave in a way that's not beneficial to women (I'm looking at you, sex possie crew) are not feminists, even when they say they are.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 04/01/2017 08:24

when you are coming across very biased. Asking for a plan from rad fems and when people give you examples you say that's just a feminist act so not radical

Everyone is biased, so that's a fair comment. I did however point this out earlier - this is what I said
I think what could be happening here is people identifying as a particular brand of feminist and then claiming the bits they like as their brand of feminism

I'm just trying to understand what radical feminism is. Rufus's post earlier was really helpful.

Liberal feminism is a form of feminism that argues that equality for women can be achieved through legal means and social reform. Radical Feminism-: Radical feminism is a movement that believes sexism is so deeply rooted in society that the only cure is to eliminate the concept of gender completely

I don't really see how pointing out a book is sexist is a particularly liberal or radical - it just seems like the basics to me.

I'm not attacking anyone, I'm just trying to understand.

With regards to changes to paternity leave. Well that sounds like a liberal thing to me (but as you say I am biased). As it involves using legislation to affect a social change.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 04/01/2017 08:24

Got to go to work now. Bye

HilbertRiddle · 04/01/2017 08:30

I mentioned sparrow's first response to him. In light of that, his comment about spare time seems appropriate (though I fail to see where he was sarcastic...don't fall into the playground trap where you accuse the other of the things you were accused of). And contribute? This thread has been derailed beyond belief. And I tried for a long time to get one point across that was related to the actual topic and all you said was "sorry I don't get it".

EBearhug · 04/01/2017 08:55

I don't really see how pointing out a book is sexist is a particularly liberal or radical - it just seems like the basics to me.

If radical is about going back to the roots, that must include the basics, surely?

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 04/01/2017 09:03

I find myself struggling with my lovely devoted Christian in laws

They will say some thing about someone being short of money at the checkout (10p to £1...not huge amounts) and inlaws gave them the money and what a wonderful christian act it is to do that

And i sit there thinking "i do that all the time you fuckwit...everyone does...is called being a normal human being"

By their definition i am doing a christian act...by mine i am doing what every 'nice' person should do

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 09:36

You made no point except to try to criticise me Hilbert. I meant you should try to make a point about the topic of the thread instead of wagging fingers and trying to tell people off.

amispartacus · 04/01/2017 09:37

I'm not sure why you are so hung up on categorising feminism. That's "small stuff" to me

It seems a bit like the people's front of Judea Grin

I hope that I can bring DS up to be 'a feminist'. There are things he won't be able to understand but I hope he learns to challenge sexist thinking, to challenge assumptions, to fight against gender stereotypes and to see issues. He's used to having things pointed out to him.

It will be hard for him in a world where there are lots of things to challenge and standing up to be counted can come at a social price.

BertrandRussell · 04/01/2017 09:49

I think broadly the different types of feminism agree what the problem is and do more or less the same things day to day- pointing out the issues with the Famous 5 isn't specific to one sort of feminist, for example. I think there are differences in how we think the bigger picture should be addressed- whether fundamental change can come within existing structures or not. Radical feminists think it can't, liberal feminists think it can't. But that has no effect on addressing everyday sexism.

HilbertRiddle · 04/01/2017 10:07

"You made no point except to try to criticise me Hilbert. I meant you should try to make a point about the topic of the thread instead of wagging fingers and trying to tell people off." coming from the person who took part in massively derailing the thread. okay.

TheSparrowhawk · 04/01/2017 10:07

'By their definition i am doing a christian act...by mine i am doing what every 'nice' person should do'

Can't it be both? Being generous is a Christian act, it's also a nice act. Doing it doesn't mean you're a Christian because being a Christian involves more, such as a belief in Jesus. It doesn't have to be either/or surely?