Do you think men can be feminists?

[AVirginLitTheCandle]

This may sound like a stupid question but do you think men can be feminists?

I've always thought they can be but I perhaps some radical feminists will disagree with me.

I'm not sure why explaining something is sexist is seen as radically feminist. Surely that's the basics.

And again - nothing about radical feminism here that would prevent men from being included as feminists.

I should say - explaining "this is sexist" is not unrad fem. It's just that it pretty much covers all kinds of feminism. It's not exclusively a rad fem thing obviously.

Wearing pink isn't a problem at all. Pink is just a colour. Boys being ridiculed for wearing pink because it's 'for girls' is a problem because the message is that being a girl is inferior and embarrassing for a boy. That's a huge message and contribute in its own way to the later problems with 'women's work', is housework being beneath men. It's all part of the same thing.

Pink = girls, not boys
Pink toys = for girls, not boys
Pink toys = cooker, sweeping brush, dolly.
Cleaning, cooking, babies = for girls, not boys.

Dividing the sexes by colour is a problem, not because of the colours themselves but because of the division and how that plays out.

Quite like this as a definition...no idea if its right

Liberal feminism is a form of feminism that argues that equality for women can be achieved through legal means and social reform. Radical Feminism-: Radical feminism is a movement that believes sexism is so deeply rooted in society that the only cure is to eliminate the concept of gender completely

You'd think it's the basics but it's not. Tackling all examples of sexism, even in books, is a radfem stance. There are plenty of feminists who would consider that to be 'overthinking'

What's your view on women shaving their legs/pits WhenShe?

A radical feminist is not an extreme feminist, or a very feminist feminist! That's not what radical means in this context.

Oh, yes, I thought that had been clarified earlier. 'Radical' has nothing to do with extreme or hard line. Radical means 'from the root' ie changing society in a fundamental way.

Tackling all examples of sexism, even in books, is a radfem stance

I seriously doubt there's many feminists who think pointing out sexism isn't worthwhile (I'm sure you'll find a few on the web - I could find a few rad fems who hate men, doesn't mean all or even most rad fems feel the same way).

Wrt to the Famous Five, it's worth remembering that they were written only 70 years ago, ie within a single lifetime. Nowadays it all seems amazingly sexist but at the time it was totally unremarkable. Things changed because women pushed and pushed and didn't accept things. Radical change did happen, so that within 70 years those views became unacceptable. What views from 2016 will our granddaughters be told are no longer acceptable? What will we challenge and change?

I'm not sure why it is you don't believe me, unless you feel you know more about radical feminism than I do?

What's your view on women shaving their legs/pits WhenShe

I don't care what other women do.

Personally I'm not that arsed about my legs or armpits (prefer hair off) but I remove all my pubic hair (I know I'm odd).

Prefer to keep it all off even when pregnant - no sex and the bump makes it tricker.

I meant more from a feminist point of view

What do you think radical feminism is when?

I have no idea after reading this thread

I'm not sure why it is you don't believe me, unless you feel you know more about radical feminism than I do

Im absolutely certain you do know more about radical feminism than me. i just don't agree with you that pointing out sexism is done exclusively (or nearly exclusively) by radical feminists.

I'm not a rad fem (I did a test and everything ). But I would happily point out to anyone that cares to listen that those books are sexist (doesn't automatically make me a rad fem).

I meant more from a feminist point of view

My feminist point of view is that I don't care.

Fair enough. I was curious.

A lot of this is semantics as people are using different definitions of what constitutes a feminist. Personally I don't agree that a man can be a feminist. He can support feminism as a feminist ally just as well, so I'd be wary of a man who insisted on the title as it smacks of a need for validation and a wish to set the agenda. I don't believe men should be setting the agenda for feminism as I believe that they then either consciously or unconsciously expect it to centre their needs, as they don't really truly understand many of the needs and issues women have.

Liberal feminism is a form of feminism that argues that equality for women can be achieved through legal means and social reform. Radical Feminism-: Radical feminism is a movement that believes sexism is so deeply rooted in society that the only cure is to eliminate the concept of gender completely

rufus

Re what do I think rad fem is. I think your earlier post is the best explaination (thank you).

This is kind of what I mean with a plan. Achieving equality through legal and social changes sounds doable (over the very long term).

I have no idea what you would do to eliminate gender entirely.
Plus would it really help all that much? Someone's got to give birth can't eliminate the gender out of that one.

Gender and sex are different things

Wow Sparrow you seem to have a lot of spare time!!!! With all that spare time, one would have thought you would have come up with something more eloquent than halfwit to describe my input

"With all that spare time, one would have thought you would have come up with something more eloquent than halfwit to describe my input"

Why should she?

I mean, I don't mean to be rude, but she is having an interesting discussion about notyou with other people. Why is that "spare time", and why would it be better spent on you?

Because he's a man and everything is about him! How dare we little women have a conversation among ourselves! We must be using our spare time on real people, ie men.

I never called anyone a halfwit, DrM

Perhap's sparrow 's "spare time" would be better spent cleaning and making herself pretty, huh ?