General Trans Thread Part 3

[mamamea]

www.adn.com/sports/2016/05/27/at-alaska-state-track-meet-a-transgender-athlete-makes-her-mark/

"Wangyot posted the third-fastest time in the 200 preliminaries and the fifth-fastest time in the 100 preliminaries. The top eight runners advanced to Saturday's finals."

So Wangyot knocked out two girls from their place in the finals.

That's an interesting article sheoneill - the dad (mum?) sounds like a nightmare. Incidentally, what usually happens when a parent transitions? Do they usually stay "mum" or "dad" or do they swap to the other one or something else? I remember seeing a photo of the Kardashians celebrating Father's day with Caitlynn but wasn't sure if that was the norm (or a passive aggressive dig from the kids?).

I know he/she said "I'm your father" to the author of the article but I wasn't sure if that was a momentary lapse or just normal for all trans parents?

How has autogynaephilia been disproven? It's not even a "wacky" theory, when you look at a proportion of MTT (eg: caitlin) it's very clear its a sexual fetish.

I felt very sorry for the woman in the article and felt that she was, somehow, a prop in her Father's fantasy life (goodness knows how much his ex-wife had to deal with) and by trying to talk with him it seemed clear that her reality was erased in favour of his fantasy. His "sexual" fantasy, at that!

It's a complicated fetish though is it not? I've just started reading that book "Men trapped in Men's bodies" (it's free to download from somewhere). I'm only on the first bit but there's a case study of a man who started cross dressing at a young age and even as a child the cross dressing aroused him but he did not enjoy this aspect at that age. He seemingly came to enjoy it to some extent in adulthood but it was always mixed with shame and wasn't purely sexual - there seem to be other elements? But I'm only on the first chapter...

There is a rebuttal to almost every study out there. Any small failing (and all studies have small failing) will be used as proof of a study's invalidity if the readers don't like what it says. Or the author will merely be written off as being clearly transphobic and links will be provided to studies written by homophobic authors with dodgy results and it will be compared to that. People believe what they want to believe. Even when there are trans people who admit that there is a fetish element in their individual cases.

And just because there's a fetish element doesn't mean that the man in question doesn't find his male body distressing. I had kind of thought that autogynephiles didn't have the dysphoria that other trans people have but this book is maybe suggesting that they do even if their experience of being trans is very different.

she - yes, I felt so sad for the poor daughter too and also wondered about the wife.

The Girls Schools Association has banned the use of the word 'girls'

www.pinknews.co.uk/2016/06/21/girls-schools-association-defends-trans-policies-after-advising-teachers-to-stop-saying-girls/

I guess they need to stop calling themselves the Girls Schools Association too....

I bet the boys' schools aren't going to stop talking about boys.

Seems like it's only women who are expected to redefined and erased. Has anyone heard of men being told that using biological terms for their body parts or talking about male specific health issues is transphobic? I haven't

I've rarely even seen the mantra "Trans men are men", only "trans women are women". It's all so fucking sinister

I suspect that in the coming years we're going to see some very high profile/powerful couples in the UK/USA where one of the partners is a transwoman. Because it allows a man who would otherwise be gay to deny his homosexuality AND claim to be a liberal, tolerant, open minded dude, on the right side of history. But he still gets to have gay sex. What we're seeing with the likes of Caitlin Jenner are the seeds being sown for society to blindly accept.

There is a dark, seedy underbelly that's driving this movement and it's got fuck all to do with ensuring the rights of transexuals but about homophobia and power. Women simply aren't a consideration.

It doesn't sound like they were told to do this though. It sounds like they took it on of their own accord (the GSA). As a result of discussing already existing expert advice, legal guidelines etc. I would be surprised if any boys schools followed suit though. Who knows?

Newsweek ran a gender critical piece a few days ago - www.newsweek.com/what-wish-id-known-undergoing-transgender-surgery-470386. By Walt Heyer who transitioned and detransitioned again. Are the press trying harder to allow debate?

Incidentally, I read this in the independent from March;

www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/paris-lee-placing-a-trans-woman-in-a-mens-prison-is-a-cruel-and-unusual-punishment-a6923831.html

It says that female prisons are actually more violent than male prisons. To quote:

"There is also robust evidence that women in general are a danger to other women, at least in prisons. The US Department of Justice says that the rate of inmate-on-inmate sexual assault is at least three times higher for women than men in the US. Women abuse other women in prison. More than men abuse other men in prison."

This seems extraordinary and goes against what most people would tend to believe. Is this an area in which we, the public etc are incredibly misinformed? I get that women might be more likely to report sexual assault more often but you'd think they'd take that kind of thing into account before reporting it?

From that article

"There is no evidence that trans women harm other women inside prisons"

Of course, it's almost impossible to find evidence because any search returns results about transwomen being raped and assaulted in men prisons but I can think of 2 cases of male rapists/murderers turned Trans women raping and abusing women in prison off the top of my head. Noel Crompton hall and Richard Masbruch. That never happens though

The actual government report mentioned in the article says that women are more likely to report sexual violence from other inmates. I think it's likely that just as many, if not more, men experience sexual violence in prison but not as many report it.

"Female prisoners (4.7 percent) were more than twice as likely as male prisoners (1.9 percent) to report experiencing sexual victimization by another prisoner."

Righto. So on one hand we get mansplained constantly that more men are actually raped than women because of prison rape, and on the other hand we get this shit. Talk about cake and eat it.

Exactly. we should stop complaining, we're being hysterical, women are just as dangerous, Poor men have it worse, etc etc

It'll be a cold day in hell before I listen to Paris Lees

My thoughts exactly Hermione.

Here's an article from the mother of a mentally challenged autistic girl, who is being subject to harmful and aggressive treatments, apparently for financial gain by the trans doctors:

www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/06/29/hold-mother-cant-stop-doctor-from-mutilating-autistic-daughter-who-wants-to-be-a-boy/

Play Misty for me?

Two Mistys win Democratic Primaries in two states.

www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jun/29/misty-snow-and-misty-plowright-two-transgender-can/

The headline below is perhaps prescient " ‘We have reached peak crazy’"

This seems extraordinary and goes against what most people would tend to believe. Is this an area in which we, the public etc are incredibly misinformed? I get that women might be more likely to report sexual assault more often but you'd think they'd take that kind of thing into account before reporting it?

If one in four women is raped by a man and reports it in the general population (25%), then 4.7% of sexual assault for prisons, where the female inmates are the most violent, what is it, 1% of the general population, is a surprisingly small number.
So means the average man is five times more likely to rape a woman than a female criminal.

Of course, those numbers aren't worth much, considering that it is always a question of who reports what.

BUT if we are going to take those figures at face value, then surely, it is more merciful to place transwomen AND transmen in men's prison, as the number of sexual assaults there is only half as high!

It's fascinating that Paris Lees - an English journalist based in the UK - cites US stats to back those assertions up, when the stats on women in prison in the UK are fairly easily available.

Women in prison account for 5% of the overall prison population. 81% of that 5% are there for nonviolent crimes.

But hey, Paris is right! Women prisoners do harm women in prison! Guess which women they harm!

Themselves. They mostly harm themselves. Despite being only 5% of the prison population, women prisoners account for 28% of the prisoners who are reported for self-harming. (That's not 28% of the 5%, that's 28% of the total prison population.)

This is not really all that surprising, when you consider the women prison population as a whole: 46% have been victims of domestic violence (one agency reports 80% of the women prisoners they have contact with having suffered domestic violence). 46% of women in prison have attempted suicide at some time in their life. 53% have reported emotional, physical or sexual abuse during childhood. 31% grew up in care.

Then you add on random facts, eg that women in prison are more likely to be disciplined (for similar offences) than men in prison, and a picture really has emerged.

I don't know the stats for trans women in prison, but all the cases that I have read about in the past few years have involved violent (and incredibly violent) crimes, and often the prisoners involved haven't declared their desire to transition until they are in prison.

addendum "...that's 28% of the total prison population who are reported as having self-harmed "

31% grew up in care.

That's a heartbreaking statistic. We are failing kids in care so badly.

Thanks for everyone's thoughts and so sorry for not having had time to add more of my own. I would tend to agree though that it is likely that women report crimes against them more often than men. (I'd be curious about the effects of gangs - in the US there are some mega gangs that control vast numbers of prison populations but I don't know if they are as prevalent in women's prisons as in men's. I suspect not and that might be one reason for women seemingly being more violent. Still open to the possibility that they actually are more violent though (women). Trying to keep an open mind and all that. Against all information out there...

That's interesting archery about the difference between the situations in the US and UK prisons. And about the self harming. So sad. 81% in for non-violent crimes is I think much less than in many countries.

And interesting stats analysis vestal.

Looking forward to the Olympics but hoping that if there are trans athletes taking part their identities will be revealed. I think that if they just say there are some transwomen amongst the teams but don't say who they are as looks like might happen it's just going to cause speculation that's bad for everyone.

I suspect that in the coming years we're going to see some very high profile/powerful couples in the UK/USA where one of the partners is a transwoman. Because it allows a man who would otherwise be gay to deny his homosexuality AND claim to be a liberal, tolerant, open minded dude, on the right side of history.

Not disagreeing with you here but just a ponder as most of the high profile Trans-women at the moment also appear to be 'gay', that is still prefer sex with women. . .

I wonder if it somehow become more of a case of 2 gay men with one posing as a Trans-woman to aid the others career. . . .

Not that that would ever happen; I mean a marriage of convenience in Hollywood or in politics...............nah!