Men who parade how "feminist" they are but who can fuck right off...

[ArcheryAnnie]

...as they don't actually want to listen to women who disagree with them in any way.

I am not including common-or-garden arseholes here, as the list would be a billion posts long and the internet would explode. I am talking about the kind of man who writes a long, handwringing article in the Guardian about how we should all listen to feminists more, but then deletes most of the comments from actual feminists that are posted on it.

The two currently at the top of my very long List are:
Ally Fogg
Owen Jones

Nominations, please.

So basically no chance of any examples of feminist extremism?

Positive mental attitudes should be transferred into positive mental posts. Your motives are exposed as bullying tactics can you not see how ironic and contradictory that is? not very 'Sisterly' is it when im a feminist myself.

I'd certainly like to rally on some of the unhelpul negative cycles of posts I read from certain people.

But your posts in this thread aren't positive, Pandora. I think you're trying to wind people up, you know.

I'm always a bit suspicious of people who claim to be feminist women using the term sister to refer to other women. I've never met a single real feminist who does that.

When I say real feminist I mean someone who genuinely is a feminist, rather than someone who claims to be for the purposes of goadiness or belittling.

Your motives are exposed as bullying tactics

Who are you accusing of bullying you this time?

Saskia maybe it's an age thing? Or a culture thing? Because I've met loads of women who refer to "sisters".

pand0ra if you are so keen on "positive mental attitudes", perhaps you'd like to model them for us one day? Not today, obvs, but one day.

Annie made references to 'sisterhood'. Am I not a 'sister' then?

Puffins - it's bullying tactics but it seems you are at the driving seat - enjoy your derail.

Countess: Tell me why can I not have a neutral view? I'm not really into pendulum swings of hate and emotion I much prefer a calm constant logical view.

Think its time to sign off for a bit.

Annie Yes, it may be due to age/culture. I'm in my 40s, and can honestly say I've never heard that term used in a positive sense.

pand0raslunchb0x

No, I suspect you aren't anyone's sister.

Saskia, it tends to be used quite a lot in the context of sisterhood by RF and lesbian feminist groups iirc. It does however get used by a fair few people ironically, because they don't believe in sisterhood or that women are capable of organising in a coherent way. Which is how I believe it was used in this context.

I hear radfems talk about sisterhood quite a bit though with a consciousness of the issue of women being held to a higher standard than men and 'sisterhood' being used as a stick to beat feminists with for not agreeing all the time.

I also hear it used non-ironically in a positive way - when women help each other out in a way that goes above and beyond what you might expect, it sometimes gets celebrated as 'sisterhood'.

Saskia so am I. (And I'm not a radical feminist, either, in ref to what Puffins said.) So probably a culture thing.

True enough Countess

Sorry if I made it sound like those were the only examples of groups that use it Annie. Should have qualified it by saying that those are the groups I hear it used by most

No worries, Puffins - and I have nothing against RF, it just isn't how I see myself.

I've heard it used, but I think it works better offline, where women are part of a community in the traditional sense of working together, eating together etc. It feels a bit stranger to use it in an online setting where you don't meet the women you are speaking to.

Thanks for the replies! It's interesting to hear how the word is used in a positive sense.

"It does however get used by a fair few people ironically, because they don't believe in sisterhood or that women are capable of organising in a coherent way."

This tends to be how I've heard it. Or used in the context that women who defend other women are doing so because we have some kind of hive mind and automatically agree with each other on any given issue.

Do they wear wimples and play very violent hockey?

They might be undercover nuns. They wear plain clothes but can be identified by their habit of carrying guitars and randomly bursting into a chorus of Lord of the Dance.

Unless they float and know what you're doing when they have their back to you, they aint real nuns.

pand0raslunchb0x wrote - "the blind ignorance of extreme views from polar opposite ends of the scale ie: Extreme Misogynist vs Extreme Feminist - both are in sense 'narcissistic' and will therefore never reach any viable nor reasonable solutions with their current opposing mindsets." and "Extreme Feminist is an anti-male pro-female mentality, Extreme Misogynist is the exact opposite. Ask yourself where that view concludes to?"

Do you even know what an extreme misogynist is? Extreme misogynists include men who rape and murder women by the thousand. Do you think any feminists behave like those extreme misogynists, the only difference being that they rape and murder thousands of men instead of women?

There are no feminists who behave as some kind of extreme anti-male equivalent to extreme misogynists.

Glad you mentioned the scale Vesuvia.

I'm wondering what this scale is that Pandora is referring to.

Social scale? Philosophical scale? Political scale?

Because at the moment, socially, politically, economically, the scale is set at misogynist as norm. We still live in a society defined by misogyny. Extreme misogynists want it kept that way and extreme feminists recognise the misogyny of wanting to keep it that way and point it out as the misogyny as it is.

Someone who thinks that society is evenly balanced and most people, institutions, organisations and ideas are held somewhere around the middle with extreme misogynists at one end equidistant to extreme feminists at another, is usually steeped in misogynist assumptions. While believing they're in the middle.

You make a very good point Vesuvia. I'm yet to hear of rabid man-haters who go around castrating and then killing men. Yet men who rape and murder women? Sadly we hear about them every day.

Oh, I say 'sisters' on here sometimes.

I like the way it sounds more than 'ladies' 'girls' or 'women'

If I dropped it, I'd use comrades