Feminist Pub 17: The Bluestocking frolics in the fells and fens of feminism

[AKnickerfulOfMenace]

This is the 17th incarnation of the Feminist Pub!

Here be goats, cannons and chat on feminism and related themes. Also snacks. And booze, copious booze.

Welcome!

So when hr etc see potential in men that they don't see in women it is usually on this final characteristic. This is why when there are senior women in business they are nearly always hr or accountants. On these roles the bias doesn't matter. Hence why woc often when they are more senior are accountants or lawyers ... It's easier to prove your worth. With billable hours, cash saved and real benchmarkable qualification rather than experience which can be ignored.

In my personal experience I have been viewed as not-ambitious, not-wanting-to-do-this-or-that-and-they-try-to-accommodate-me-which-is-bloody-nice-of-them-isn't-it, and scary. I'm barely 5'3'' but I'm scary. And what I have actually achieved has not been noted down in correct categories - they were (not any more if I have any breath left in me) put in less "ambitious" categories.

The thing that really gets me is the second thing - the being-nice-to-me part. I would like to be asked whether I wanted to do something or not, not have the script of my life written by some fuckwit.

Disclaimer: I have a stinking cold and hate the world.

I watched the first episode of Gaudy Night last night. I don't like the PW on telly.

it's been a busy few days.

Wanted to share this with you all:

sluggerotoole.com/2015/02/26/briefing-about-ni-barriers-to-accessing-abortion-services-launched-by-amnesty-mybodymyrights/

It has the vast majority of the barriers to abortion in NI interview and panel from yesterday. I found Breedagh Hughes and Donagh Stenson extremely moving.

Thanks so much for that enormouse, really interesting and the film Vessel they mentioned looks really interesting too. I'm going to contact my local independent cinema to see if they will put it on (if they haven't planned to already - I would be v impressed if so). I can see that it's available in various online places but it would be great if there were a showing in the cinema too

Massive tangent but is anyone watching Will Smith and Margot Robbie on Granham Norton? Just had a really nice moment with DH going 'why won't they let her speak? And me saying 'men's voices are always louder because they think their experiences are more important.'

I think Ms Robbie is a master of restraint for not slapping the two of them into the middle of next week, but at least DH and I had a good chat

I was thinking the same thing lonny. She barely got any air time at all.

I've gone off so many chat show/game shows these days - it's mostly men sitting around haw-hawing at each other's jokes. (Perhaps a generalisation, but I used to enjoy QI and Mock the Week and stuff like that but one more haw-hawing and I might throw something at the telly and we can't afford that...)

Now the BBC has the one woman per panel show rule, it's even worse I think. They're usually picked on and shouted down and male comics can justify it because she didn't get there on merit like they did.

One woman out of 4 panel members + 1 chair = equality? Funny, isn't it? Like we are some sort of minority.

Can I moan about kids clothes please? Just been attempting to get the DC a couple of summery things (holiday in 6 weeks ). Boys section - nearly all of the summer shirts are 100% cotton and the shorts are knee-length with an elasticated waist; girls section - nearly all of the summer shirts are 100% viscose and the shorts are barely an inch longer than crotch level with a non-elasticated waist. Why? Surely girls want to be comfortable and cool just as much as boys? Or is there some unwritten rule that only boys are allowed to be comfortable?

(DD got cotton jersey boys shorts in light grey and navy and has no summer shirts as yet)...

Yes, and it's often Victoria Coren looking as if she's too polite to hit whoever's chairing HIGNFY. Grr.

oub, I'm not so sure it's an 'unwritten' rule.

My moan today: ten years ago, I was at university in the town I've just moved back to. The barman in our university bar had a crush on me, and was generally a bit of an odd bloke - he'd get incredibly drunk and stoned, and he was friends with a couple of my mates, so he'd come round and get drunk with us on occasion. I ran into him outside the pub at the end of my street when I moved back here, and he's kept trying to get in touch on facebook and through linkedin. The other day I went to the pub with my housemate and he was there, so I said hi but made it pretty clear with body language that I was talking to her and not up for a chat. So he comes up to us, interrupts, and holds his hand out until I take it, and kisses it.

Which is really mega creepy, isn't it? I think he imagined it was some kind of super-romantic gesture. I really felt wrong-footed by it.

Yup, it's creepy!

Yep. I feel a bit grubby.

Eeek! Creep!

(Actually I also spend a fair amount of time shouting "Creep" at the telly these days....)

Creepy, and you'd be perfectly justified in publicly upbraiding him for it, then telling him you want no further contact. He isn't being polite or respectful, so has just surrendered the right to the same treatment.

Oh, I know, kickass.

It's moments like that when I am really aware how socialized I am. I have very little issue with all sorts of terrible, bolshy, un-feminine social interaction, but I really do struggle with the 'I'm such a nice guy' types. Bleugh.

I would also say, he genuinely wouldn't understand it.

Definitely creepy. Coupled with the LinkedIn/Facebook stuff, it actually sounds like he could be approaching stalker territory (he isn't taking 'no' for an answer, is he?). I'd steer well clear if at all possible.

What an incredibly creepy man. And like Oub said, he has stalker written all over him.

On a tangent: so what does "romance" mean for a feminist? Nothing I saw on telly or read in the media that's supposed to be romantic seems very appealing to me. For example, cut roses dry out and then you have to compost them and the garden path is muddy ... (Besides we have a perfectly good rose bush by the muddy garden path.)

So what is romantic?

The French?

I do a lecture series on romance. Most medieval romances are rape myths, stories about incest and adultery, anti-immigrant propaganda, or all of the above.

So, really, nothing changes.

(And thanks all for sympathy over creeps.)

uptoapointlordcopper

I had some warped ideas when I was young, I got stalked by a girl when I was at juniors, think she wrote all over my books how she loved me, think I told the teacher, then later another girl was obsessed about ALWAYS being my partner in country dancing as well as tuition group, I remember purposely trying to sit with another girl but stalker went to the teacher and said I'd moved places and was put back with her. In addition to media and society and 'pursuing', 'winning the girl', I ended stalking a girl in secondary, I even phoned her house pretending to be her friend to talk to her, I think she put her mum on and told me to stop calling.

I still feel terrible about it now, my parents never told me anything about this, which I will rectify with mine.