Is the constant misinterpretation of Feminism ignorance or wilful misunderstanding?

[messyisthenewtidy]

The other day at work I had a book about feminism on my desk and my colleague jokingly said "oh gawd, you're not going all feminist on us are you messy?!" I replied that I'd always been a feminist and proud of it and they looked at me all like I was a bit odd.

It made me think that all my life feminism has been understood in our common language as a bad thing. Everywhere: in popular films to newspapers etc. From women saying "I'm not a feminist but..." to the common phrase "I believe in equality but feminism has gone too far" to the instances in my life where men, upon finding out I was a feminist, have gone out of their way to bait me and tell me why feminism is really a form of female supremacy.

I suppose my question is: How did this happen? And the people who misunderstand feminism - are they just being ignorant of what it really is or are they wilfully misunderstanding in a conscious attempt to dismiss it?

Great! Next time flora doesn't give a fuck about something she can tell you and you can high five each other

Slarti if you or any other man comes into a discussion with feminists about feminism or male violence against women and feel it is appropriate to discuss how the terminology used makes you offended, you can expect someone will point and laugh. This is MN / FWR, you know that right? Not every utterance gets treated with respect.

You're going to need to get over yourself / this if you want to have a serious discussion. Otherwise it just looks like you can't handle it without making it all about your feelings.

I pointed out that your definition of feminism cannot be stated without using "men as a class" or a similar phrase, and hence that your claim to find the phrase offensive is irreconcilable with not finding feminism (by your own definition) offensive.

That is only a logical deduction from your statements. It is only telling you what you think if your thoughts are logically consistent and your statements here are true reflections of your thinking. I did assume those two things in my post, and you are right to criticise me for failing to state them. I apologise for assuming that you were both intelligent and honest.

Thank you Buffy.

speverend thanks so much for femsplaining that to me and rejecting my request that you accept that I know my own mind. I should point out though that I agree with a poster upthread who said feminism doesn't have a monopoly on truth. We are all entitled to our opinions and just because mine is different to yours doesn't make me ununintelligent or dishonest. If you genuinely want to consider the question posed by the OP then an honest analysis of your own posts might be a good place to start.

The same goes for flora whose posts suggest men's feelings are something to point and laugh at, and that any dissenting voices should be met with rudeness and aggression. That's your prerogative, but don't pretend the negative opinions people go on to form are wilfully ignorant.

And buffy, sorry but I can't take anyone seriously who commends the baiting and taunting flora has engaged in whilst trying to claim I'm playing some sort of game. My opinion on the phrase "men as a class" might not be one you agree with, hell it might even be wrong (I'm able to comprehend that possibility), but that doesn't mean I'm playing a game fgs.

Anyway I'll bow out now as this doesn't seem to be about discussion or debate but about "winning".

flora whose posts suggest men's feelings are something to point and laugh at

NAM

Slarti:

Of course you are entitled to your own opinions. You gave two of them:

1. You said that you found the phrase "men as a class" infuriating and offensive.

1. You said that you did not find feminism infuriating and offensive.

I pointed out that even your own definition of feminism relied on the concept of "men as a class", so these two opinions are contradictory.

Either my argument is wrong (if so, how?), one of your two statements is false (but I note that you haven't retracted either), or your opinions are self-contradictory. The self-contradiction is what means they are wrong - not whether or not you agree with me. You are correct that feminism doesn't have a monopoly on truth but, unless there's a flaw in my argument, your opinions taken together cannot be any form of the truth. Can you point out a flaw?

It was a bit strong to infer that you are not intelligent based on one contradiction in your belief system, though, agreed. Apologies.

I think you are correct to bow out of the conversation at this point. The only productive direction it could go in would be for one of us to discover a flaw in my reasoning. I don't think that's possible in this case. If you do find such a flaw, happy to continue.