Amal Alamuddin has changed her name professionally

[EhricLovesTheBhrothers]

I'm actually disappointed. Her choice blah blah but honestly. Successful women who change their names professionally always strike me as either stupid or coerced and I'm sure that's unfair I'm not really but honestly why be so committed to the concept of the obliteration of the unmarried self that you allow it to impact on your professional reputation and renown?

no woman here is dictating that i can see. expressing opinion and discussing the issues surrounding the idea of "choice", questioning traditions, yes, but no one is insisting that every woman should be forced either way

I used to practice writing my name with whatever the popstar of the day's surname was. Mrs Le Bon Fortunately I grew out of it.
I noticed the impact of societal norms recently when my 6 year old (following a conversation about weddings) said "but if you hadn't married daddy, then I wouldn't have been born" - entirely overlooking the fact that he was present at our wedding, and hence well and truly born regardless of marriage! If tradition has had such an impact already on my ds, how much more so must it affect women who have spent 20/30 years with this expectation.

As I posted on the pub thread a few days ago, last week DH and I were granted permission by the court, to change our family name from his to mine (after spending nine years with his family name). We decided to change as we have gone NC with his Godawful parents.

Anyhow he sent an e-mail round work yesterday, announcing the change to his name, he didn't go into details but just said it was for personal reasons. He did mention the new name is in fact my "maiden" name, so it's not entirely new to the family.

A small number of his (male) colleagues have reacted with some level of shock, and have said to him (in a roundabout way), they can't understand why he would give up HIS name. Blah blah blah.

As a matter of comparison, one of the female lawyers at the legal firm got married two months ago, and made the decision to take her husband's name. She said to DH yesterday, with a wry smile, "funny how none of them told me they couldn't understand why I changed my name isn't it?!"

And there we have it!

I suppose it'll take slightly less time and use slightly less ink when she signs things, now.

You know what, if some women want to change their name, they will and it's got F all to do with anyone but them. If they don't want to change it and decide to stick with the name 'forced' on them by their fathers, grandfathers, great grandfathers and beyond - and of course forced on their poor subservient female ancestor - then that's their choice too.

I don't see what the fuss is. She's changed her name. She is the same person, she does the same things as she did before marrying and changing her name. She's chosen to take her husbands surname. So what? In the huge scheme of things, so what?

There is a difference between dictating, and pointing out inequality.

As a feminist I try to detect and avoid gender inequality, including when I find myself internalising it. Discussing the ways it crops up with other feminists, or just with people in general, is part of the process of learning to combat it. Sexism and inequality is all around us, and so ingrained that it often goes unnoticed. Talking about it, pointing it out, understanding it is important for those who want to try to change it.

That does not mean in a million years I would ever go up to Amal, or any other woman who has changed her name on marriage (and I know many, many of them including close friends) and "dictate" to them that they shouldn't do it or shouldn't have done it. If they want to discuss it, I'll give my views and explain why but I respect their choice.

As women often contribute to perpetuating equality, it's totally fair to point that out. It is not feminist to want to protect all women from ever hearing that you disagree with anything they do. It is not feminist to tell all women that whatever choice they make is fantastic.

If you want an extreme example, FGM is often promoted and practised by women who strongly feel that it is something that must be done to their daughters/granddaughters to save them from being an outcast/dirty etc. Now, are you saying that you think it's feminist to say "Oh OK then, a woman made that choice, so as a feminist I must applaud it"? Or would it be more feminist to say "hang on... in the interests of equality and women's rights, I'm actually opposed to FGM being enforced on girls".

I think a lot of people are confused about what feminism is, and this "surely feminism is about women having a choice" thing gets bandied around all the time. But if you follow that through to its logical conclusion, no, it's not the case that ant choice a woman makes is fine. If you think about it, there are all sorts of things that we don't have a choice about, male or female. Society restricts choices and rightly so. The question should be, is it fair, is it equal.

For me, it's quite simple - feminism is about equality. Every day when I encounter situations, the acid test is "is it the same for a man? Is a man expected to do what a woman is expected to do in this situation? Are men and women/boys and girls getting the same deal?" And I'm equally bothered if men are getting an unequal deal too, as in not being allowed to have long hair at school for example, because anything that acts against equality is unhelpful.

Yy to the impact of societal norms. I still remember my then 5 year old dd telling me that the doctor that treated her sprained ankle 'must have been a nurse, because she was a lady'. This is despite half the kids in her class having mothers who are doctors!

But those 'opinions' are very judgemental and unnecessary. If people want to discuss the merits of taking on a man's name after marriage that should not be done on the back of another women who has just done that. OP said she was 'disappointed" but in what exactly? what impact does this Mrs Clooney have on her?, Amal has made this choice for herself and so what if she is successful? is it the case that the more successful you are the more there is the expectation that you will keep your name? whilst i believe this has its merits, it is still none of our business but entirely up to the individual. Stop analysing other people's private choices ,
although i'm sure someone will come along and say it does She has a right to make her own private choices without them being analysed with condemed.

The majority of women in my position have kept their maiden name as their professional name, quite frankly because it made good business sense

Exactly so why would a successful, renowned professional do something that might harm her business? Lurve? Social pressures? Wanting everyone to know she's finally successful in that she's caught a husband?
I'm sickened by all the 'I'd love to be Mrs clooney' shit on this thread. So pulling GC would be an achievement to be proud of? Whatever.

Fwiw my beef is with women in her specific position who change their names, which is a different beef to the one I have with name changing per se.

IF you know that FGM is an extreme example, then its a bit silly asking if I think that should be a woman's choice and we shouldn't question it.

I got invited to Jack and Jill's wedding. The invite said:

"Mr and Mrs Jack's dad's first name surname, invite you to the wedding of Mr and Mrs Jill's dad's first name surname."

Took me a while to work out whose wedding I was being invited to! Jack also asked Jill's dad for permission before proposing. I'm sure the question of surnames was not raised, of course she would become Mrs Jack's Surname. Tradition or not, to me, that whole scenario is wrong.

*True story but some names may have been changed.

I've never dictated any woman's choice over her name. I've smiled and nodded and said mmhmm and address their Xmas cards to man and woman smith even if I think it's a massive shame inside.

The blindness that people have about name-changing can be astonishing. I heard about a woman not wanting to change her name on marriage and her FIL was outraged. She said to him something like "well would you expect your son to change his name to mine? Would you like to change your name?" FIL spluttered "Don't be ridiculous, I can't change my name, I've had it MY WHOLE LIFE!"

Sitting next to him was his wife who had changed her name on marrying him, presumably she up to that point had also had her name her whole life. So had his DIL. But that just... well, didn't matter as much. I wonder why.

Like I said, I am not saying at all that women can't question why women in general change their names at marriage and the merits of that, but starting a thread with I am actually disappointed..... Successful women who change their names professionally always strike me as either stupid or coerced is not being analytical but very arrogant and judgemental.

IF you know that FGM is an extreme example, then its a bit silly asking if I think that should be a woman's choice and we shouldn't question it.

No it isn't - I give the extreme example because it clearly demonstrates that the "feminism is about choice" argument is flawed - because when it comes to some choices, it totally falls down.

Women can make a choice to do something, that they want to do, but that actually isn't in the best interests of women as a whole, and isn't feminist. That's how I see women changing their name on marriage.

I agree that's it's good to have the debate, and I have found this very interesting and enlightening. But the OP is all about judging this woman in her choice, and calling her, and those like her, names because of it. Which is shit, whatever your viewpoint on married names.

And none of us know what discussions she and George had, and for all we know they did discuss changing George's surname to hers, or going double barrelled, or both staying as they are. As has been pointed out, regardless of what the societal norms are in the UK, Amal isn't British, and it is not the norm in Lebanon to do this, nor in her profession. It would be very interesting to know her thinking on this, and his, but really, it's none of our business.

Women can make a choice to do something, that they want to do, but that actually isn't in the best interests of women as a whole, and isn't feminist. That's how I see women changing their name on marriage.

I agree with Voyager here. I feel the same way with using Miss/Mrs.

But actually I think the fact that it's not the norm for her background and career makes it look even worse. It looks as if she's not just getting his name, but his culture wholesale. Why should the traditions of his background be the ones to hold sway?

I think I can guess at the answer, if he does have political ambitions as surmised. We've seen several politicians' wives get shoehorned into using their husband's names publicly when they didn't before. But I admit I don't know her reasons.

"I like my husband, I'm glad we have the same name."

Why do men never say to themselves " I like my wife, I'm glad we have the same name."?

Because whilst we women are arguing and dividing ourselves over this issue men are sitting pretty in their privilege of never having to ask themselves whether they should keep or change their name. Because no one ever makes them feel that to show love for their wives they should take her name.

And all feminists are doing is asking: why is that? A perfectly legit thing to do IMO .