The Feminist Pub (continued).

[UptoapointLordCopper]

Been busy. Came back today to have a look but the Pub thread was full! Shall we continue here?

Third episode of Borgen on tonight.

I just got a text from DH who was flying from Scotland to Leicester tonight: "OMG. We are down. But never again".
I take that to mean he was scared. I know I was scared for him...

It's all calm and very cold here now. -9 apparently tomorrow... . Better than this scary wind I suppose.

I had an interesting conversation about infertility investigations today - I cannot really go in to details, but basically there are religious/moral issues that prevent the man from giving a semen sample....
I was unable to find a way around that one.
Quite rightly invasive and therefore potentially risky investigations for the woman will not be done unless the information re his fertility is forthcoming.

Impasse.

Ah, so a man who believes in the 'every sperm is scared', no masturbation, no, erm, climaxing elsewhere than inside a potentially fertile vagina.

Difficult. I guess it depends if the partner has accepted and shares his beliefs on that issue. If she does, then it is the rational outcome of both their moral beliefs.

Though personally I think it's rot, what with teenage boys spilling their seed all over their sheets in their sleep and whatnot. Plus, if there is a god, I think he gave us our creativity sexually, which includes all the things we do in a relationship that might not result in a pregnancy!

Oops, cut a bit off. Meant to say glad your DH is safe and hope he recovers from the trauma.

He is currently having a stiff drink - he sounds fine to me.

Yes, I agree, if they both buy in to that way of thinking then this is the logical conclusion. I cannot quite follow that line of thinking, nor agree with it, but I am quite happy to make the choices that they are making as I fail to see how it harms anybody.

I wonder what sex eduction children in similar families enjoy??

I suppose, Pacific, in that case there is no need for any help from you (is that right, is that what you do?) because it's god will innit, so when god wants them to have a child, they will.

From the little I know, very little sex education at all. The focus of sex education is almost entirely moral education I think. And the basic biology of fertilisation and pregnancy.

Gosh, I seem to remember Pacific mentioning she is medical. If she's not and this is just a conversation she had with a colleague in the IT department then I am [shocked] at the level of over-sharing!

that should be

Oh, I know. I am not quite sure why she came - I suppose to confirm her own fertility. Of which by her history I have no doubt.

I worry about children in very repressed environments growing up being 'punished' for natural exploration of their bodies

Naw, you're ok, Penguins you're right

Nelson Mandela has died !

Sorry, not v feminist, but I had this thread open.

I know people who have an issue with the discarded embryos of IVF, but I find that more understandable. If you believe that life begins at fertilisation, it's a tough ask to accept them being discarded. I know a friend who has had her children through IVF in the end, but who struggled with that.

I struggle much more with the idea of a sperm being scared. After all, an egg is wasted each month if you haven't had sex, and that isn't seen as wrong.

Thank you. I didn't know.

Statement on BBC News 24 just now

Cross post.

Sad news about Nelson Mandela, though had obviously been expected for a while. I remember waiting watching TV for him to be released. And writing about it for the school newspaper. What an inspirational leader (though I suspect that the 'sainting' of him that will follow his death will obscure much of the complexity of the real man).

I grew up in the 80s RC. (sex is only for married people to make babies)
I was told nothing - NOTHING - at all by my parents. not even about periods. Nothing. Literally.
the nuns at school showed us The Silent Scream which is a graphic film depicting abortion as violent murder. Girls were going green and fainting and threatening to be sick and were not allowed to leave the room which was (deliberately?) too small and overheated.
We learnt the mechanics of reproduction as part of O level biology.
Socially, we learnt nothing except: sex is only for married people; contraception is wrong; in fact contraception causes life-threatening illness; abortion is murder; women who do have abortions usually go mad and steal babies.
masturbation was never mentioned.

I AM NOT EXAGGERATING

RIP Mandela, hero

Good grief, mildred - in the 20th century??

It beggars belief.
I presume you've caught up in the meantime.

And yy to 'sainting' of NM that is sure to follow - I started a thread in Chat and there is one lone critical comment...

erm well I wouldn't say I have and I am bit worried about how to look after dds in this respect. I am actually genuinely awfully embarassed to talk about periods for instance and that has to be got over. (no one else is, I notice, these days, which is heartening)

We fluffed it a while ago when I emptied a moon cup into the loo and it didn't flush properly and dd1 (4) asked what it was. I was too slow and shy to come in fast enough with a child-friendly truth and dp told her some made up bollocks. I feel like I need to get geared up to this.

Thought I'd crash in and say "hi", been having a nosey round the scary feminist threads after it being mentioned last night.

Bored my husband shitless last night about my newly re-awakened passion for the rights of young girls and how I was at my ignorance over the toys.

Not staying now, off to bed but I'll pop back another time - thanks for the invite!

I'm off to bed too, but here's a (or an orange juice should you prefer) in welcome Monica

mildred, my 100 year old gran had a very strict RC (convent) upbringing.
She knew nothing - her wedding night came as a great shock to her and she genuinely thought she was dying when she was in labour . V traumatised decades later .
But: she never told her daughters anything either .
So my mother, the older of 2 girls, assumed she was dying when she started bleeding. She was also frightened to confess to blood stained clothes. She hid in a cupboard hoping to die before her mother would find her...

To her eternal credit she did a great job with me: I don't remember ever being sat down for The Chat, she just answered questions as they came up, she never behaved in any kind of way exhibitionist in front of my brother and me, but I knew where her sanpro was, what it was for, that it was 'private' but not 'dirty'.

I really feel I owe her a great debt of gratitude for that.

I am sure you are doing far better than you think you are, considering all your very insightful and thoughtful posts on here

Mind, my mum did not cope so well with me having a sexual relationship before marriage, but we all managed to move past that !

... far better job... sorry

Welcome, monica

Aw, she's 4 - plenty of time to come up with the sciency bits