To all those who say on threads 'I am too scared to go into feminism' - this topic isn't scary!

[GetOrfMoiLand]

I think it's a shame when I see threads where the OP says 'I am too scared to put this in feminism' or something.

I am certainly not knowledgeable about feminist theory, but have never felt that my opinion on this thread wasn't wanted or I was vilified for stating what I believed.

I think this topic is pretty inclusive - yes some people are forthright with their opinions, but nobody's word is god, and I would hate to think that mumsnetters were put off contributing to threads in this topic because they mistakenly think the posters on here are viragos.

I am popping over to the chicken keepers topic and post about my lovely foxes. Then I am going to tell all the tack room that keeping horses is cruel.

Why are people so fearful of feminism and feminists? Is it just because deep down they know that they are wrong.

SecondComing - I find that real life experiences are taken extremely seriously here i.e. if you experience DV or rape or sexism then you are believed and your feelings are validated. If you look across MN that really is not the case. Just look at some of the "My husband looks at porn and I hate it" type threads. People are told ALL the time that their feelings and perceptions are invalid and to lighten up.

"I am popping over to the chicken keepers topic and post about my lovely foxes. Then I am going to tell all the tack room that keeping horses is cruel."

I see your point Crapola but (with the exception of the trolling that does sometimes happen here) I don't think that's an adequate analogy.

People may disagree on which ideas are essential to feminism and how they should be manifested in one's life or in a larger scale, it's not the same as saying feminism is bad. Debate is essential to come to consensus.

There can be domination, granted, but no more so than in every group where the most informed like to spread their knowledge. However it's all in the approach. I am sure if people come here with questions and not criticism they would always be welcome.

a lot of us know each other in RL and on FB, we tend to meet up at conferences, marches, summer schools etc, and that has increased in the last year, so I think it is inevitable that it is going to feel cliquey to other posters who have no interest in being part of that. We are enthusiastic about new members who would like to join in with these things though.

I often lurk on the feminist threads. I have always called myself a feminist, just not a radical feminist. In the old days, (or maybe when everything was done face to face, rather than in online anonymity), feminism was a broad church, in which a variety of different views were acceptable, and debate was encouraged.

Since posting on the feminist board, I feel I am no longer a feminist, as it appears that I lack the ability to be sufficiently dogmatic and patronising to anyone with a different viewpoint.

Some of the denizens of this part of MN are doing feminism no favours with their fuck off attitude to anyone who deviates from the opinion of the dominant clique.

To address what you said Hully, I think your example illustrates what I was trying to say quite well. Change is a scary thing for people and they'd rather convince themselves that they're happy than admit the whole thing is shit and needs to be changed from the ground up. I know some feminists I've talked to have been so frustrated with how some women seem to reject feminism and have assumed that it's due to lack of knowledge or understanding. I think it's actually due to fear, fear of change and fear of having to let go of things that you're comfortable with.

Proles would you argue that femininity is completely constructed or do you think that even in a totally equal world women would still behave in a somewhat "feminine" way?

Crapola that's not it at all.

long time lurkers do not come onto a thread to be told anything.
that's not debating, that's intimidating IMO.

WoD When they're saying "read this book", do you not think they're directing you towards that book because that book says it better - and probably more comprehensively - than they themselves could? I have to say, I have learned more, ultimately, from books on the subject than I have reading threads here. Obviously I find this section useful because it flags issues for me, but then after I've read a thread, I mostly go off and read other stuff.

"I am sure if people come here with questions and not criticism and not criticism they would always be welcome"

So we are only allowed to ask questions on here, rather than debate? I think that is part of the attitude I am questioning. You are only welcome on here as either:

A. a fully paid up radical feminist

B. a humble supplicant

That hasn't been my experience Crapola. If you look at an earlier posting of mine I linked to thread where I asked questions and engaged in debate and was given a very hard time indeed. I find that even asking questions is frowned upon, as though by questioning something you're ridiculing it, rather than just asking for clarification.

You may have a point. But generally I like it here. Many of the threads seems to start with 'you know what's wrong with feminism' or 'feminists are (insert a mild offence or misconception)' . What do people expect?

WoD.........I remember your name as one that said something pretty anti feminist, I may be wrong.

Mo I honestly don't mind if someone says "Well I feel this way about it... but such and such explains it much better in this book." That's informative and friendly. However, a lot of posters have responded to me simply with a booklist, which in my view is basically saying "You don't know what you're talking about, go away." If someone experiencing DV posted in relationships and everyone just listed books they could read without giving any actual opinion or advice it wouldn't be considered very kind, but here it seems to happen quite a lot.

Where has the op gone?

MN is full of posts that care more about how clever they sound than what advice they give or who they are giving it too, it's not just the feminist board. The most outrageous thing on the orally raped thread was said by someone who doesn't frequent this board.