To all those who say on threads 'I am too scared to go into feminism' - this topic isn't scary!

[GetOrfMoiLand]

I think it's a shame when I see threads where the OP says 'I am too scared to put this in feminism' or something.

I am certainly not knowledgeable about feminist theory, but have never felt that my opinion on this thread wasn't wanted or I was vilified for stating what I believed.

I think this topic is pretty inclusive - yes some people are forthright with their opinions, but nobody's word is god, and I would hate to think that mumsnetters were put off contributing to threads in this topic because they mistakenly think the posters on here are viragos.

You're attempts at popularity-garnering won't wash with me, Missy.

hully - not really, I think. I feel as if here the implication is that anyone who defends the section should feel ashamed and should make amends for others feeling bullied. If someone tells me I'm not a good feminist because I shave my legs, that is different - they're not accusing me of hurting someone else or making me responsible for something I didn't do.

I also don't think I need to change my behaviour.

lenin - thanks for replying. That does make sense, I'm just getting wound up seeing both sides of this.

[i feel as if the implication is that......................][17.41 post]
yep-exactly LRD.

Proles-[17.31 post]
[what i would say about dittany is........................]
yep-couldnt agree more.
i hope she comes back or we would of lost a damm good feminist.

"So right lenin. I am sick of my choice of religious clothing being accused of oppressing women thousands of miles away.
Puts me right off the feminist section which is wrong as im as much a feminist as anyone here. I have had to hide threads cos of religion bashing. Im not all clever with words so feel oppressed, bullied and i timidatex.
Anyway, its ramadan soon and i will be taking a month off the internet. Maybe things will be nicer when i get back."

How did Rivs post get totally ignored?

This thread has been a bit hard to follow and a wee bit argumentative. I'm a newbie on the feminist boards, I need educating but can see that some posters have been offended on here.

Are you suggesting that LeninGrad is a MRA troll?
Being as she's the only one so far who has been accused of trying to win a popularity contest by attempting to stabilise the two see-sawing ends of the melee that is argument/discussion on the board.
Good job I'm sitting down.

I lurk a lot on here and can see both sides.

I have seen some posters ripped apart when asking (what to me at the time were) fairly innocuous questions. After reading/learning more I can see why the questions were irritating, but 'outsiders' or newcomers to feminism probably wouldn't have seen that and therefore would have felt that it was too 'scary' to post.

I can also understand that having to answer the same questions over and over again would be annoying. The only way I can think of it is, I suppose, if I was trying to have a discussion about Nazi Germany and propaganda, and someone kept saying 'Who was Hitler?' or tried to derail by saying 'the holocaust didn't actually happen'. It interrupts the flow and after the 800th time would make you annoyed.

The book suggestions are helpful but sometimes I see one and think 'I don't want to wait to get a book I just want someone to tell me the answer NOW' but I can understand why you don't want to keep answering the same questions. Have we got a sticky on here like Feminism 101? Apologies if so, I haven't seen it.

What the answer is? No fucking idea

I've recently started to delurk and I love this section because it is intelligent, well argued, makes you think and does leave you outside of your comfort zone (so all the reasons everyone else hates it is seems ).

I can see that it would be daunting to rock up and be completely ripped to shreds, and it does happen a fairly regularly when people unwittingly put forward mainstream views that are actually anti-feminist and anti-women. To be fair to them, we live in a society were these opinions are so wide spread it's hard for people to see how they could be misogynist, but on the flip side of the coin, why shouldn't the feminist regulars call people on it if they see anti-feminist views expressed.

Exactly karma. Exactly what I think but couldn't articulate.

But no one has disagreed with that. It makes sense. We all need challenging. What is being questioned is the being "completely ripped to shreds."

How does that help? The ironic thing here is that people pointing things out (pleasantly) is putting people on the defensive and yet you can't see what ripping someone to shreds might do!

Great post karma

Goblin - who is your post to?

I haven't been rude, or called anyone names, neither has Lenin, Pag, reeling in the years, or any of the other posters who have commented that there is reason for the bullying feeling some experience.

Hully, I know this will sound harsh, but I think that if you come onto the Feminist board and are interested in feminism, if someone with a well thought out argument is telling you that the views you are expressing are anti feminist, misogynist or rape apologist, the onus is on you to find out why and to consider them. You may decide you still think the same way, you may not, you may learn how to defend them, but this is a board with mainly intelligent debate and if you can't join on those terms, maybe you need to lurk a little or read one of the book recommendations first.

The first thread I posted on here, I got torn to shreds so I do know how it feels. I still think the same way but can defend my stance now. But also, I can see why the way in which I expressed my point of view was seen as anti-feminist on that original thread.

I'll happily bet that most of the people supporting dittany on this thread have been called anti-feminist by her at least once. Almost everyone knows how it feels (and that it feels shit) but some people seem to find it easier to put it behind them and get on with things rather than carrying from thread to thread.

Honestly hully, given that dittany who is one of the most thick skinned posters on this board has felt it necessary to take a break, I don't think anyone can claim it was pleasant.

My post?
LeninGrad is trying to be a peacemaker, MillyR appears to think that Lenin is some kind of contestant in a popularity contest and SAF asterisked points 1 and 7 in her list which links being an MRA with trying to make oneself popular with other posters.
So take your pick. SAF was the one I was addressing.
Although, on reflection I think it was just that SAF is crap at bolding text and her asterisks were linked to that.

Karma, we're not going to agree on anything, are we?

Let's not even go there.

hully, I've been ripped to shreds. I'm fed up with this 'you can't see' - knock off blaming everyone but yourself.

As karma says, most people on this thread have been called anti-feminist by dittany - we're not here because we all fall into natural agreement and just can't imagine what it's like for other posters.

I think it's a great shame that dittany has taken a break, because whether I agree with her or not, she always adds an interesting perspective and gives food for thought.