Sunday Times: "Extreme feminists" have used moderate feminism as a Trojan horse

[Unwind]

www.dylan.org.uk/fruitbat_freedom.html

supposedly published in today's Sunday Times

Evans gives his version of an internal, confidential, HR matter and then witters on about some straw man extreme feminism

he must have good connections to get that lot of tripe published

here is a less partisan summary of the fruit bat story:
www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/gene-kerrigan/gene-kerrigan-old-prejudices-rear-head-in-batsex-row-2191181.html

I'd use it

Becausse nowhere have I indicated what I think about that value system for boys Heroine, but you have assumed that I can't see it might be a bad thing.

"you are against women feeling like they are sexually dirty and can see why that is a bad value system to convey, but can't see why its a bad value system to convey to boys?"

HTH

from my side I have posted an opinion that you guys obviously don't like and you all are attacking me personally because my opinion differs! what is this, a cult?

re only some of her complaints being upheld - the chances are that only some of her complaints will have had evidence because there will only have been witnesses some of the time. If you were being harassed you would experience a series of incidents only some of which you would be in a position to prove. Given that there were still enough in this case to prove ongoing harassment, trying to suggest that the woman was discredited because not all were upheld seems rather like grasping at straws.

no, we're arguing with you because we disagree with you, and we were rude to you because you were rude to us - your first words on this thread were 'You silly people.'

Can I give you some friendly advice about how to engage in discussions, on the internet or elsewhere? If you want to have a constructive discussion, you will find that people respond in kind. Start off by insulting them and they may insult you; ignore and ridicule their questions and they might just ignore and ridicule yours. If, on the other hand, you engage politely and constructively, you will have an enjoyable and interesting discussion and may learn a lot.

HTH

oh yes i agree.. and i have been harassed at work fyi... but I still think that it is ridiculous that a paper about animal sex has been seen as almost equivalent to showing someone something about human sex - especially when in cosmo and MC there are loads of articles about fellatio and oral sex that I regularly show to male friends and I would be mortified if they collected it as evidence of a long campaign of harassement and then took me to court.

You haven't posted a particularly original, or well informed opinion, Heroine. It's more like 'silly women overreating again'. There is more to it than that. Obviously.

I know! Lets have a long discussion about the way I say things! Brilliant! There is a whiff of 'no you started it' about your post - I do think that in general the posts here are very much about people being silly about a topic that is really more complicated than 'ooh what a creepy guy ooh he must have done it' it just smacks of hatefulness

oh and 'walking' seriously get some help for your issues about 'overeating' I really don't know where you get that from..

Heroine, your colleague woould only take you to court, if you had been continually harrassing him in the previous weeks and/ or months.

You keep ignoring the context of harrassment in which this bat fellatio paper incident took place. Why?

Grow up Heroine. Engage at an adult level (which includes reading more than the headlines in a tabloid) or you can't really blame us if it all goes a bit over your head.

I never thought I'd type the words "bat fellatio paper incident"

Ooops sorry, my mistake, meant 'overreacting'

no i don't agree - your colleague would only take you to court if he thought i had been harassing him - whether I had or not (and in my example I have not) is not relevant to whether a complaint is made.

So we are onto 'you are a child' insults.. excellent work!

yup.
Heroine plays the 'poor little me, they're all attacking me' card
so Seth plays the 'well you did start it' card.

oh beautiful! A neat sidestep into 'lets go back and talk about the structure of the argument and the way in which people are saying things...

this is incredibly boring. Goodnight all.

If your colleague thinks you're harrassing him/her, and tells you so, and asks you to stop whatever it is you're doing that constitutes harassment in his/ her eyes, and you don't stop, then you are harassing him/ her, whether you think you are or not.

The harasser doesn't get to decide whether it's harassment or not. The victim of harassment does.

That's fairly basic.

First off, sorry, my last post was a bit harsh to you Heroine.

Re you showing magazines to your male colleagues: It's unprofessional of you, but probably no worse, especially if you are friends outside of work. But if your colleague had at any point expressed discomfort, or asked you to stop, and you continued, that'd be harassment.

I've never been accused of harassment out of a clear blue sky, while going about my legitimate, non confrontational, considerate to others, professional, way. But I have on occasion been asked to drop a particular subject, and I have always respected that.

Good night SSAM

you're fairly basic.

X posts with loads there. My apology still stands.