'A woman who drinks to get drunk is deliberatly endagering herself and inviting rape' Oh my Gosh

[SuperTheoryofSuperEverything]

TThis is the opinion of my seemingly reasonable policeman uncle.

I am asking yet again if you stand by your assertion that group sex is gang rape, as per your post "group sex aka gangrape".

Do you? I am happy with a one-word answer. Yes or no.

That's fine Dittany, and if I had completely misread your post then you only needed to say so.

Thank you for the clarification.

Because every other post I understood what the poster was saying. With yours I wasn't sure, so I asked for clarification.

I apologise for the personal attack.

I've been sexually assaulted and didn't report it, Dittany.

And I only regret not reporting it because it may have stopped the same thing happening to some other poor girl. So I regret that.

But this thread reinforces that apart from that, I was right to not report it, and to just forget the whole damn thing (as much as I could). Rather than relive it to someone like the OP's uncle (apologies OP).

I never talk about it at all. I hope this clarifies my stance and isn't too garbled.

Goat, you are not the keeper of your assaulter's subsequent sexual behaviour.

You mustn't feel guilty about not reporting.

I am sorry you went through that.

Thanks Anyfucker.

I really really do appreciate your thoughts.

IWNCNWAG - I wanted to point you to this thread where other MNers shared experiences of sexual assault.

I second what AF said. Be kind to yourself.

hope you are ok, saying this stuff "out loud" can be a trauma in itself sometimes

Bit of a headfuck.

Thanks all for your kind words.

I had repressed the whole thing for a long time.

I did that too

I also blamed myself (date rape situation, I didn't struggle)

I didn't report..I wouldn't have been believed

I even had social chit-chat with him a few months later, when we crossed paths out and about

Go figure

I was drunk at the time.

I didn't invite rape though.

Ah, but in response to your reply to me, dittany, that's not what I'm saying.

I am merely saying that when alcohol is involved, caution is necessary.

I simply don't buy this notion, in the modern age, that young women are always and completely beyond reproach. whatever their actions. They have responsibilities too.

If you are suggesting that an extremely drunk girl, who is flirtatious and suggestive, simply should not be taken advantage of by a similarly drunken bloke who's probably picked up the 'wrong' message, then that is to assume that all men should be noble, and all women should be protected.

Nice thought, but totally impractical, and hopelessly one-sided.

I don't think it's particularly noble, to not penetrate someoen else's body when they don't want you to.

I think it's just normal. But that's because I have quite a high opinion of men and don't think that not being a rapist makes them particularly noble.

I was your classic 'plucked off the street', AF.

And I blamed myself too.

Desiderata when you say "take advantage of" what exactly do you mean?

Sex is a two-way street and your post seems to put the woman as passive once she has "flirted" IYSWIM.

Past tense for me, Goat

blamed being the operative word

I know better now, but it took a while to get there (by myself and with the help of MN)

I don't get into the "one type of rape is worse thn another" but that must have been particularly terrifying, goat

At least I knew my attacker wasn't going to kill me

desi...I think it rather unfortunate timing of mine and your posts, but I am struggling a bit here with what you said

ISNT, I am merely trying to balance the view that all men are beasts, and all women are blameless.

When alcohol is involved, there is confusion and shame. The shame can often lead to a charge of rape, when in fact, the sex was as consensual as two inebriated people can gauge it .. at the time.

It is rather difficult for a woman to rape a man, for obvious physical reasons. However, I have certainly been in the company of women over the years who, in drink, would certainly do so if they could.

The issue here, primarily, is alcohol, and the manner in which people deal with it.

But you're putting forward the view that all men are beasts Desi. As if they can't help raping a woman if she's drunk and has flirted with them and they're drunk too (but not too drunk to get an erection).

That's a view which is grounded in the idea that men aren't really human beings with morals and ethics, but just beasts. Waht an insulting view of men. Even when we're drunk, most of us are reasonably capable of not doing something really very unethical - we might do stupid things like losing our keys, or snogging someone we don't fancy - but we don't murder anyone, or burgle their house, or assault them. Why assume that most men are so lacking in moral fibre that they simply can't help themselves raping someone?

The issue here is not primarily alcohol, Desi. None whatsoever involved in my attack. It was 5 in the afternoon and I was walking home.

Alcohol is AN issue, I'll grant you.