Visual erotica for women

[SparklingExplosionGoldBrass]

Because the discussion on this at Ladyfest was fascinating but didn't go on long enough, I fancy continuing it here.
Soo, iirst off, why aren't there proper erotic magazines (with pictures of naked men in them) for heterosexual women?

wukter yes - simmering sexual tension. Foreplay, exactly.

Well in response to the female desire thing. I think more men picked by actual women for visual erotica both film and pics. Stop the ban on heard cocks and have them in more magazines just top shelf/cover it. Also stop with the idea that womens porn needs to be all candles, and snogging in the moonlight without any real action. It needs to cover a lot of different areas to cover different womens tastes but use good looking men.

Also I think most women will not buy things from a conventitional sex shop even now (me included not in my own town anyway!). I do think if they made something like this but pay to use the site then it would be good but again needs good looking men picked by women not what men think women like. Also a wide variety of men doing a wide variety of things in different sections of site. Make it female friendly and not 'seedy' will see a big take off. Thats why vibes were no where near as popular or socially acceptable before but now they are more appealing (eg rabbit not bulging, veiny fake cock that men thought we would like).

I do think Jacqueline Gold is really inspirational in what she has done bringing a females opinion to the high street in the form of ann summers. In her book she mentions when she worked with her dad and started inputting these ideas one of her dads businesss assosiates said ' it wont work women dont like sex' (How wrong he was lol now its a multi million pound empire).

I believe visual porn in women will go that way in future once the stigma is removed but it will take a revolutionary woman to do it.

(sorry long post this is something me and my friends have discussed many a time over a bottle of wine lol)

sorry hard cocks not heard ones!

I think there is probably a difference between static photos and film.
A film has a narrative, or lead up of sorts.

'
I would be interested in some real feminist-led erotica. not directed and casted by males...but say an all-woman crew (no sneaky male power going on in the background/boardroom) and a woman with her boyfriend/chosen partner- that sort of thing'

Also reading back through the thread throughly agree with this. I did once have a subscription to a site before I got in to webcam but cant for the life of me think of what they are called. Its a private site set up by a woman and her husband and they do different acts for the customers by making videos, you can send them requests via the message board. I really used to like it but it was credit card only and had to give up my credit card so only had it for a few months back in about 2005.

Things like that are good and I think appeal to women a lot. Would love this to have been in dvd form

They don't need to make high street sex shops accessible to women. There are plenty of highly successful internet sex shops aimed at women which do a roaring trade.

I really don't believe that many adult women are unaware of the options that are out there when it comes to porn / toys / erotica. The mainstream stuff anyway.

However all of that does nothing to counteract the problem of socialisation and indoctrination of boys and girls, meaning that they are still being constrained into gender roles. The addition of harder and harder porn to the mix means that there is a whole tranche of girls/young women out there whose first sexual experiences are being based on what boys have seen in films. That is not good and not healthy. When I was young most porn was pretty bogstandard vaginal sex. Now anal intercourse and other activities are standard in porn, when in fact they are not standard in real life. But the young men have learnt about sex from porn, the girls have seen the same films and know what is expected, this is not good. It is a hijack of young people's right to discover their own sexualities and what they enjoy for themselves, instead this "McSex" view is being imposed and it is just all wrong in my view.

These films should not be telling young people "what sex is" it would be better for everyone if they found out for themselves.

At least with old style wank mags some imagination was involved, it wasn't a full how-to guide.

I wonder if this is why so many women prefer erotica / costume dramas / all the stuff that has been mentioned on here. Because when they have seen porn it had not represented in any way their idea of a good time.

On the subject of what women's sexuality really looks like, we have no way of telling.

Whatever it is you prefer to get up to, whether with one person or millions, in the dark or swinging from the chandaliers, in a twosome or a sixsome or all out orgy, whether you like to dress in lace or latex or custard... We're all steeped in the same society and the same messages, none of us can be truly sure that we are free of the effects of that. Of course men aren't free of it either. But I know who gets the better "deal" in the current set-up.

Will stop ranting now

Oh rant away ISNT, I frequently do.

You know there was a thread on Mn recently where a poster who is definitely not a regular in the feminist section said that the best way to help young women understand their sexuality and respect themselves and their bodies and be able to say no and etc etc all of that, would be to send you and Dittany into the schools to give talks .

I like it.

Voted!

You're late love the election was months ago

Did they win? I could probably do with one of their lectures.

Oh, just remembered - I've already been lectured by at least one of them

Has anyone actually looked in Playgirl?...I did I was in my teens way back when..I thought it was funny as hell..not sexy at all!!! blokes with fire hoses and bales of hay

SGB, you've tipped from being idiosyncratic to offensive with this:

"
WHile I agree with you that many women are very short of resources, there is no moral superiority in being poor or, if not so poor, in disdaining any form of frivolity or entertainment. The horsehair-tampon school of lefty feminism that seems to insist that All Fun Is Bad unless it involves lentils and fingerpainting with menstrual blood is one of the factors that does put a lot of feminists off 'feminism'.

YOu know that this has nothing to do with my argument. YOu have read enough of my posts to know that what you have just type is a stereotype.
The reason women don't like feminism is because women like yourself side with men to perpetuate the 'ugly, lesbian feminist' image. NOt actually anything to do with feminists, their sexuality, or how they look and behave.

The only thing feminists do "wrong" is object to the patriarchal status quo.

Your stereotype of the "ugly, prudish, killjoy, lentil-weaving feminist" is so much of a stereotype

Only under patriarchy could the word 'feminist' be described with such a sheer amount of venom you have just used.

THis has gone beyond erotica, beyond porn even. WHy do you hate feminists so much that you feel justified in using that type of language and descriptions?

"Moral superiority in being poor" PMSL

Are there seriously people who think like this. That sounds like something men made up to make women feel better that they're poorer. "Don'T worry that we've got all the riches and power. You can be morally superior because of the gender-pay gap.
PMSL, seriously

And the reason I said 'ugly, lesbian, prudish (as in a sexuality not dependent on men) feminist' is that under patriarchy, those "insults" that are used against women to undermine them. Patriarchy hates all of the above because they represent women who will not bow down to the system. By consequence, women who do not bow down to the system are charicatured with the above adjectives.

Hell, men don't need to lift a finger when they've got female proxies doing their anti-women work on their behalf.

Well I am poor but I would definitely buy porn and mags if they had fit men in. As long as I didnt have to buy in from the newsagents or anywhere in my town it was available on line. I would also want it to have fit men in such as Jamie Redknapp etc.

If it did I would pay for it but at the moment this is not available so I get what I need through amateur as maintream porn stars (including in mags all are either really hairy, beardy men or peter andre greasy types). I am yet to meet many women that are attracted to these types of men but they are what the mainstream sex industry say women like for some weird reason.

ISNT, you hit the nail on the head here: I wonder if this is why so many women prefer erotica / costume dramas / all the stuff that has been mentioned on here. Because when they have seen porn it had not represented in any way their idea of a good time.

We're still looking at three main issues, imo:
1] Is it possible to describe, in general, women's idea of a good time?
2] What media-borne representations of that idea would women buy en masse?
3] Why the hell has nobody exploited it successfully?

My feeling is the answers to [1] and [2] would be films of Black Lace books, featuring representational sex between fashionably attractive people and tidy-looking erections. I have to suppose the answer to [3] is male ignorance and/or inadvertent conspiracy.

Further queries:
4] Can women be educated to embrace their raw sexuality;
5] is that necessary or desirable?
But I think we lack sufficient information on those - definitely a patriarchal side-effect!

I know this is all about that age-old question "what do women want?" but, personally, I don't think the answer is all that mysterious until you get to [4] and [5].
Am I wrong, though? How would the women in this thread, and friends, respond to a Bridget Jones (say) with real sex?

We all seem to like costume dramas.

I think men and women differ in that women do need foreplay, and that includes mood and background story.
Men like the idea of grabbing any available passing woman and she'll be automatically up for it. BUt sex with a random passing person doesn't do it for women in quite the same way.

Oh, I dunno ... if it was Johnny Depp ...!