Breastfeeding and feminism - is there a stance on this? What did the feminists on MN do?

[hellooo]

Fully expect to be told there is no feminist "stance" on breastfeeding, that the two aren't mutually exclusive etc etc.

But I've often wondered if breastfeeding can stand in the way of truly shared parenting?

I see breastfeeding, especially breastfeeding in public as very much a feminist issue.

Some of the pressures on women not to BF are definately anti-feminist eg DPs who dont want to share their DP's breasts with a baby.

The hypersexualisation of society which has made women's breasts solely sexual objects is a big obstacle to successful BF.

Surely both parents, irrespective of gender, want the best for their child? In most cases breastfeeding is best.
On a practical level it is the mother who recieves maternity leave and it makes sense for the one who doesn't have to go to work to do the night feeds at least. Night feeds are easier if bf, but bf is easier if full time... I believe!

On a personal level bf is an important assertion of a wonderful aspect of my femininity (i mean that in a positive sense).

And if that doesn't work for you, well it is possible for men to induce lactation. Then they could share.

It depends what you mean by "shared". A woman needs support while breastfeeding - that is the man;s role IMHO. I suppose in former times it was the man's role to protect a bf woman from sabre toothed tighers. Now it's to go to Sainsbury's.

Ment to say femininity and therefor feminism.

I think it's another example of how a woman's body and what she does with it is a matter for public comment/censure. It's just another example of damned if you do/damned if you don't.

I think "our bodies/our choice" or "my child/my choice". I chose not to BF and even now want to justify that decision but I don't have to. I think there is pressure to BF which is as unfair as the pressure not to from some men (not all by any means).

hellooo - I dont think it stands in the way of truly shared parenting - just stands in the way of the non-bf parent doing all the parenting iyswim.

Also agree with foreverastudent that bf in public is a political act. As lots of domestic things are - ie housework etc.

It has been a complete failure of feminism that people have interpreted it as meaning that dp should be able to do half the feeds - both women and men.

There are some things in nature that are non negotiable. The fact that women have got the breasts in the partnership is one of them

I agree with AnyFule. The most depressing thing I hear when talking to new mums about breastfeeding is that they are spending loads of time expressing "so dad can be involved."
For this particular feminist, the issue around breastfeeding was that I should be able to do it when I returned to work ie nothing should stand in the way of my choice to combine motherhood and my career.

I agree with anyfuel - it is really sad to read women saying they didnt breastfeed or expressed very early on just so their dh could share the feeding. Daft.

OK for me there are a few issues. Pedants don eyemasks as I am too tired to think about proper sentences.

1. Means of production/self-suffiency/survival skills. Breastfeeding reduces women's dependency on formula milk manufacturers, who profit from women ceasing to lactate. Worst case scenario, breastfeeding means we can feed our babies during natural disasters, wars, famines, etc. Best case scenario in the West, we save our money which we can spend as we wish or invest. Formula companies profit from a choice feminism that separates milk nutrition from milk comfort and fails completely to factor in the hormonal/neurochemical/emotional interplay between breastfeeding mother and baby during feeds. It's a very 'you've come a long way, baby.' 'Loreal because I'm worth it' situation.

1. Health. Breastfeeding protects women's health and the health of their children. Mothers who breastfeed are less likely to get osteoporosis, breast cancer, etc. Female children who were breastfed are less likely to get breast cancer. Etc.

1. Environmental. Environmental impact of FF (as well as bottle feeding expressed milk if done with fancy equipment) is enormous. Wish I still had the link to an article in New Scientist (I think it was NS) about it. Damage to environment means damage to humanity which includes 50% female humans.

1. It really is not desirable to parent exactly the same as your partner. What a bore for the babes. Some of us are better at certain things, we think in different ways, we like doing certain things and hate others. We have totally different relationships with our LOs because we are totally different. That is a good thing. Nature is good, nature isn't stupid, nature generally works. Why fuck with a good thing?

Right, that's it for now, lol

V good topic by the way :)

Very good thread!

Never, ever, for a minute thought I wouldn't breastfeed and never thought for a minute about ff being a good way to share parenting. In a lot of ways ff is harder for women, especially if you are at home on maternity leave and are stuck with all the preparation of bottles, sterilising, washing. I don't think it would be worth it for one minute for dh to do 1-2 measly feeds a day!

I did feel feminism was to thank for the fact that I could ask for breaks in work to express for the babies.

Very good post EgyptVanGOgh,
I never go on the breast/bottle feeding threads because I find it so painful to hear women say it's equality for a baby to get cow-derived formula derivative instead of the mother's breastmilk

WHen you think that it's a multi-billion dollar industry and the people reaping in the profits are men, it suddenly becomes a gender issue

I think this new "Plumpy NUt" is exactly the same as formula. I read that the US and France are arguing over the patenting of Plumpynut, which is being agressively marketed in the third world. Plumpy nut is a peanut-butter type concotion supposed to help babies and toddlers. My DS is 1 and if he's ill he's exclusively BF for the days he's ill. Plumpy nut is a "follow on formula" for the third world. FOrmula kills babies if they're not healthy. Premature babies are given breastmilk or donated breastmilk because it would die if it got formula.

YOu know, I think I could just keep writing all day, but I'll stop now

I am with Belle my/our bodies my/our choice.....
My caveat would be it should be an informed choice (and not informed solely by mik manufacturers). I would also argue it is a feminist issue becuase it is used to pit women against women and to make judgements

Yes, informed choice
Formula conglomerates are not allowed to advertize as far as I know, so that is good, although I noticed they've found a loopholein the law and are allowed to market follow on formula's with language that undermines extended breastfeeding.

Formula companies also have to stop saying "breastfeeding has benefits" and admit instead that "formula has negative effects on infant health".

I think women should be presented with the facts before they make the "choice"; but what is happening is that they're being told there's minimal difference between the two milks

Great post EVG

I am a feminist, married as feminist a man as I could find.

He fully supported my decision that EBF was best for our babies - I fed dd1 to 12 months, ds to 15 months (when I fell very unexpectedly pregnnat with ) dd2 to 2 years.

At the time we lived in a very very patriarchal area of the UK (Outer Hebrides) and I did feel a lot of the time that my breastfeeding was a political statement in one of the areas of the UK with lowest bf rates. I certainly gave a lot of teenage boys in Stornoway their first glance of nipple! (feeding in the window of the Library coffee shop).

I think there should be a feminist stance on this - that breastfeeding should be normalised as part of women's work. Having had my 3 dcs in a society (which we have now left) where breastfeeding was abnormal, I became quite strident about my right to do so.

Another feminist issue - to maximise health/IQ in females, they shoudl be breastfed? Maybe? (not sure on this).

I also felt (feel) a need to challenge the "well I ff cos happy mum = happy baby" scenario. In the first 8+ weeks with my 3 children, breastfeeding was hard, sore, time consuming, and a reason to argue with family in almost every setting. Yes it was stressful. I had severe PND - hospitalised with it actually. And now I knwo the ONE DEFINITE good thing I did for my children was to ebf. There were so many other things that were crap, but the feeding was good.

PND is played down in the media/medical profession (ime). Feeding through it is something you have to fight for. It is a fight I won to the benefit of my children.

I do think that women need lots of support to breastfeed. They need help for at least a month with their first baby. IN Japan if you get clogged up they've got a technique called "breast massage" which sounds weird but it's basically a midwife trained in getting rid of all the blocked up milk. It feels lovely afterwards. There are loads of breast clinics. YOu need to be shown and encouraged; there needs to be a culture where it's acceptable to whip out your breasts in public. Society conspires against breastfeeding

breastfeeding can allieviate PND sometimes because of the hormones released into the body when the milk comes in. Oxytocin, I think.

also in Japan, you are in hospital/clinic for a week after you give birth, so you have time/resources to start breastfeeding.

Then, most Japanese women go back to live with their mother for a month, so all they have to do is concentrate on their baby (their mum will do most of the cooking and washing etc.)

so by the time they eventually are home with their DH, breastfeeding is well established.

The Japanese custom of co-sleeping also helps with the success rate.

However, I found that it was expected that you breastfeeding ended at age 1. I carried on until DD was 15 months and DS was 3 years, but it was fairly unusual.

I must admit I never saw BF as a feminist issue for myself, more a health issue.

I can see that in the 3rd world it is a different story - but it's the children who are (mainly) being failed - with consequences for everyone in the society - really it's just a downright scandal that everyone should be outraged about not just feminists IYSWIM.