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Original poster

The Unconditional Parent -- is this bollocks or for real?

347 replies

oregonianabroad · 14/11/2007 21:21

I haven't read the whole thing yet, but am torn between thinking it is totally revolutionary, and then the next minute I think the guy is smoking crack and wouldn't last 2 minutes with my ds. (of course, he would have an answer for that, another of the things that turns me off about his argument).

It also seems clear that he evaluated all the books on the market and decided to write one with a radically different approach (a discipline book about how not to use rewards/ time outs??? how novel!).

SInce I bought the book on the basis of a few recommendations here, I am interested to hear what you lot think.

OP posts:
Psychobabble · 17/11/2007 21:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
oregonianabroad · 17/11/2007 21:36

OK, I'm going to go and ponder that and drink some wine and chill out for a while.

This all gets a bit too hard at times, doesn't it?????!!!!

OP posts:
FrannyandZooey · 17/11/2007 21:37

Children usually experience a punishment as a withdrawal of love, yes

this can be the case even if you do not intend it or feel it to be the case

an argument is not the same as a punishment, is it?

PippiCalzelunghe · 17/11/2007 21:42

thanks for all your suggestions but the tidying up was just an example as 98% of the time she does it when I ask first time TBH. so it's not a crisis situation, far from it. I do all the things you suggested and make it fun and that that's why most times it not a problem. thinking about it we do not have crisis situation and everything is catered to her being a 2 year old so maybe I do what this book say already and should not worry too much .

blueshoes · 17/11/2007 21:46

pippi, any punishment meted out by a parent that is not a natural consequence is very likely to be seen by a child as arbitrary and an (ab)use by a parent of their power over a child that depends on him/her for everything.

If a child is not behaving, what is making a child sit on a step for 3 minutes anything but a random punishment devised by a parent for making the child feel bad about himself. Same with taking away toys or privileges.

If my parents grounded me as a teenager (they did not, thank goodness), I would have thought that incredibly unfair. Far from making me reflect on my "sins", it would just have made me feel resentful and unloved. The focus shifts to the punishment, rather than the behaviour the parent wants to encourage.

PippiCalzelunghe · 17/11/2007 21:46

like oregoniana I'll go and ponder as well. part of me things that punishment is an easy way out. certainly it does not work when used often, and so I am sure it won't work if my next one is more challenging. unfortunately won't be able to have glass of wine as already had my pg allowance of one.

PippiCalzelunghe · 17/11/2007 21:55

blueshooes waht you say it mmade great sense. you are right when I was grounded, very rarely, I felt resentful and even more rebellious. but because I was hardly ounished and therefore very wild I am not sure if that was a good thing either. it's a bit the egg and the chicken story.

babyboo1and2 · 17/11/2007 21:56

this thread has got me reflecting on my parenting

could someone tell me the author of the how to talk book as when i just tried to look it up on amazon there were a number of books with similar title

thanks

Psychobabble · 17/11/2007 22:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LittleBella · 17/11/2007 22:03

but but but - the no rewards thing - my DD wants rewards for her good behaviour.

Well praise anyway. What does he say about praise?

babyboo1and2 · 17/11/2007 22:13

thanks for the link psychobabble

Original poster
oregonianabroad · 18/11/2007 08:29

Just to be clear:
How to talk so kids will listn emphasises the importance of praise, and even gives tips on how to improve praise from 'good boy/girl' to something more specific.

On the other hand, TUP seems to suggest that praise is wrong.

(At least, that's what it seems like but I am only on Chapter 4.)

OP posts:
Nightynight · 18/11/2007 08:41

I think this book is losing the plot a little, by the sound of it (havent read it)

I punish my children when they do naughty things. But I don't withdraw love for them.
My children usually know (after I have pointed it out to them!) that they have gone over the line.

My ex h, on the other hand, is an emotional blackmailer, and runs ALL his relationships along the lines that you have to constantly be earning his love.
The children have in the past got very upset about this. IMO it is totally crap parenting.

FrannyandZooey · 18/11/2007 08:42

I don't think it is fair to judge a book on a few sentences written on a website, mostly by people who have not even read the book!

I really would advise anyone interested to borrow a copy and make up your own mind

Nightynight · 18/11/2007 08:43

Id be interested to read it franny, but fat chance of getting it second hand, and do not want to fork out for it off amazon, in case it turns out to be a pile of crap and I regret making the author richer.

FrannyandZooey · 18/11/2007 08:45

Why don't you borrow it from the library? That is what i did.

FrannyandZooey · 18/11/2007 08:46

many cheap copies here

Nightynight · 18/11/2007 08:46

lol
the library is only open during times when I am at work, and they probably wouldnt have it unless it is published in German as well (I am in DE)

Nightynight · 18/11/2007 08:49

ok, I might fork out 2.40 for it! thanks.

in general, I try to avoid starting arguments with my children though, and am suspicious of any book that advocates talking more to your child. My children can argue the hind leg off a donkey, all of them.

Original poster
oregonianabroad · 18/11/2007 09:48

NN,
I know! My ds1 is constantly negotiating something -- a skill I am sure will serve him well in adulthood, but can be tiresome in a 2 year old.

OP posts:
Nightynight · 18/11/2007 10:00

oh god yes

Me: would you like a biscuit?
child: can I have 3?

ScottishMummy · 18/11/2007 10:15

eh yes we really need another pseudo-intellectual self appointed parenting guru. mince tosh guff chuck the books away trust your instincts.

Judy1234 · 18/11/2007 12:01

I said above and I repeat, do what you think is best. Follow your instinct.What is written about what he's said seems to be how my parents brought us up and I have brought up my children but I would never bring up a child by something written in a book or what anyone else told me. It would feel silly. If this doesn't seem right for you then don't do it.

Yes, you talk to them and then you distract or deflect. I doubt he (or me or my parents) gives children everything they want but that basic principle he's described seems to work fine for some people. If it doesn't work for you don't do it but never ever keep chopping and changing. Children like to know where they stand....although obviously if you're doing anything illegal to children then do indeed stop it.

NKF · 18/11/2007 12:04

I haven't read it so I'm probably talking nonsense. But why do children think time out means you don't love them? They might just think you mean they need a break to calm down and think about how mean it is to push their baby sister.

Judy1234 · 18/11/2007 12:07

I had never heard of the practice or name of time out until a few years ago. It sounds bizarre but obviously some people think it work or it wouldn't be so popular. It's certainly wise if you've lost your temper to withdraw yourself but that's parents being bad and needing a break.