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Riders - Jilly Cooper Book Club

262 replies

JillyCooperBookClub · 14/03/2016 09:53

It was a perfect spring day. Thickening crimson buds fretted a love-in-the-mist blue sky. The banks were draped with crocuses of the same Lenten purple as the altar cloth. A host of golden daffodils, retarded by the bitter winter, had just reached their prime and nodded their pale heads in approval.

Thus Helen falls for Rupert, and I fell for Jilly Cooper: against our upbringing and our better judgement, and despite every single red flag.

Riders wasn't my first Jilly Cooper, but the first I sought out, after a few stolen pages of another under dappled sun on Guide Camp as a teenager.

It starts deceptively happily, with gymkhanas and very proper sexless dates. But we mustn't be fooled: at every point every character is being judged by every other, and found wanting. Character flaws, damaging childhoods, trauma and tragedy: frankly it's a wonder any one of them made it to adulthood.

Rupert's friendship with Billy predates the neglect and misery of his childhood, so unsurprisingly it is the only healthy and unconditional human relationship he has.

There couldn't be much wrong with Rupert if he inspired friendship like this.

Rupert shivered, suddenly reminded of the desolation of Sunday nights at school, summoned by bells to Evensong, followed by cold ham and bread and marge for supper, and everyone else coming back feeling homesick from days out with their parents. Rupert had never really had a proper home to feel sick about.

And indeed it will be some years before he finds one.

We discussed on the general thread that Rupert is a bit, well, rapey. In Riders he has precisely zero respect for any woman's body autonomy (the very first time he and Helen meet he thrusts his hand into her jumper) and once he has any declared rights over a woman he takes absolute possession of her body.

With a colossal feeling of triumph he pushed her back on to the bed and began to move downwards, kissing her ribs, then her belly.

"No," she gasped, grabbing his head.

Firmly he removed her hands. "Shut up. You're mine now, to do exactly what I like with."

The foursome in Kenya is deeply, deeply troubling. Billy doesn't seem to realise how unwilling Helen is until he has raped her; Rupert is more concerned with how his friends will perceive them, and his response to finding her as dry as a marathon runner's throat is to declare her "useless"; Janey is so turned on by Rupert she doesn't stop to think about it. All three of them assault her together, until she escapes.

Any minute she expected an enraged Rupert to appear and drag her back to the torture chamber.

But the others were enjoying themselves. [...] Playing games of their own, they carried on till morning.

Days later, she falls for Jake: physically and romantically the exact opposite of Rupert. It was inevitable, surely, and as little as I like her I have the greatest sympathy. But I'll never forgive Jake as long as I live.

When I first read Riders I identified strongly with Tory. Poor unloved Tory - considered a fat failure, whilst in truth neither fat nor failing. Jilly is horribly judgemental about an ounce of spare fat on anyone, but she shows us that however miserable Tory might be, she is beautiful and perfect:

She was tallish and big boned, with a huge bust that bounced up and down as she walked. However she stood on the scales, she weighed eleven stone.

(Note: at 5'8", "tallish", that's a BMI of 23.4, and she promptly loses nine pounds when she falls in love, taking her to 22.5)

Actually she was much less far without her clothes on; rather splendid, in fact.

Tory is capable and loyal and loving and stoic and all the characteristics of a balanced human being. She doesn't expect Jake to love her; it's enough that she loves him.

"She loved you," said Fen bitterly. "Isa, Darklis, me, the horses, Wolf, were only extensions of how much she loved you. She knew you didn't love her, but she felt you needed her. That made life easier, that was enough."

"Oh, Christ," Jake groaned, putting his head in his hands. "I only realised in LA how much I loved her. [...] She always seemed so strong that she could cope with anything. I didn't realise I meant so much to her."

[...]

Frantic, he took her in his arms, trying to warm some life into the frail body.

"Don't die," he pleaded for the thousandth time. "Please don't die."

"Jake," came the faintest, faintest whisper.

I was going to talk about snobbery and class, and the animals, and the culture of celebrity, and the freedom of wealth, and Billy, and Malise, and political marriages, and fidelity, but I can't, because tears are streaming down my face yet again and my nose is running. So to cheer myself up, and to evidence Jilly's brilliance, I'll leave you with my favourite exchange:

"Will it be very fancy tonight?"
"Not particularly."
"Shall I wear pants?
Rupert's eyes gleamed. That was getting somewhere. "Certainly not," he said.
[...]
"Chicken, you are wearing pants. What's this?" he pinged the elastic."
"Panties," said Helen quickly. "You thought I'd go to a party without panties?"

OP posts:
BalloonSlayer · 15/03/2016 07:12

I think Shepherd's Pie is a bit of an "upper class" thing (doesn't Jeffery Archer 'famously' serve Shepherd's Pie and Champagne at one of his 'famous' get-togethers?)

I wonder whether there is a touch of Mr Gray about her depiction of Rupert, female readers are supposed to find it exciting that a rich, handsome, sexy guy says she is his to do what he wants with. And so it would be if Helen liked what he wanted her to do. She does mention that she has only given him one blow job and been too revolted ever to do it again, so she does manage to refuse some things and stick to her guns.

Riders is the best example I have ever read of a fictional account of an ill-advised marriage between two badly-suited people which goes dismally and predictably wrong.

I was disturbed by the amount of letching at 14 year old girls - by all and sundry - that seems to be going on right from the off. And I had forgotten that Rupert talks about "unfinished business" with Tiffany Bathgate, suggesting that he is fully intending to carry on with his original intentions. A case of the "14 year old child pretending to be an adult and the so-called responsible adult pretending to believe them" I suppose. Sad I think if Rupert were real he would be having a knock on his door from Operation Yew Tree about now. . .

Wish the books could be re-written with bits like that taken out.

CallMeMousie · 15/03/2016 08:13

Oh well who knew Shepherd's Pie was posh? I made Cottage Pie for dinner last night and felt a bit sad I was dishing up what reminds me of school dinners. Turns out I'm way classier than I thought. How Jilly, to do things so unselfconsciously.

Agree I'd like them to edit out the worst of the abuse stuff, but then I guess where do you draw the line? I skip over it when I read the books.

MrsHathaway · 15/03/2016 09:42

I would say shepherd's pie is posher than cottage pie because lamb is expensive, far more expensive than beef Grin although I don't know if that was true in the 1970s.

Rupert would definitely have been spoken to by Yewtree. But I find it interesting from a 2016 to see how ... not acceptable precisely, but accepted certain sexual ideas were in general society, which are now definitely not.

I'm thinking of (in no particular order):

  • a man's right to fuck his wife
  • a man's need to have sex generally
  • the idea that an unwanted sexual experience doesn't have lasting consequences
  • the desirability of teenagers to all adult males
  • the insatiability of an athletic man's sexual appetite

I have always been Hmm about Rupert's hypocritical fury over Helen's infidelity. We're not shown that he stays faithful to her for more than about ten minutes at a time - grooms "don't count" and he pursues other women constantly. But she accepts a lift from Malise and Rupert sulks like a toddler. When she sleeps with Jake he's stratospheric. A woman is a possession, a sexual plaything, for him to possess entirely and exclusively.

LadyMonicaBaddingham · 15/03/2016 11:26

"Marriage is for children and having someone to run your house. You get your fun elsewhere"

Billy on how RCB feels about Helen. Says it all, really...

MrsHathaway · 15/03/2016 13:28

That's what Jake thinks of Tory for 900 pages.

And it's why Janey and Billy are doomed: he's expecting a mother housekeeper and gets a slut.

GertrudeBadger · 15/03/2016 14:21

You only have to look at Roman Polanski's continued career after the 'incident' with a 13 year old to realize that teenage girls were considered fairer game in the 70s, it's pretty odious now - he was defended by many people back then and over the years though.

JillyTheDependableBoot · 15/03/2016 14:41

I was never totally convinced by Jake's scales-falling-from-his-eyes moment with Tory and I don't think JC was either, hence Isa Lovell being portrayed as a misogynistic shit in later books.

Thurlow · 15/03/2016 14:48

Rupert went for Helen because she was the right sort of wife for him, not the right woman - as Billy says. I don't think there is a woman Rupert genuinely likes or respects until he meets Taggie, is there? And even that, as much as we all hold it up as a wonderful romantic story, is a bit dodgy.

I'm in the middle of Polo and have just read Rivals (all coincidentally) because Riders was never my favourite my heart belongs to Ricky France-Lynch. There's a line where Rupert says he'd marry Lizzie Vereker if only she lost a few stone Hmm

You know, the first time I read Riders I think the whole rapey thing just past me buy Blush I did read a lots of Mills & Boon and Jilly as a teenager. Between that and my utter obsession with Sharpe, I'm amazed I have a normal relationship at all...

(Can't wait until we get on to talking about Polo!)

JillyTheDependableBoot · 15/03/2016 14:58

But Helen wasn't really the right sort of wife for Rupert - or at least only because she was so beautiful. He'd have been much better off with some posh horsey girl who could have minded the yard while he was abroad and made friends with the grooms so they wouldn't shag him.

Anyway, look! JC has a blog! www.jillycooper.co.uk/notes/notes_2013_1.html

It's hilarious reading - she is such a raging snob, bless her.

GertrudeBadger · 15/03/2016 16:01

i agree about Jake, JC has to write happy endings but people's characters in her books and life never really change, I like that about her writing. I agree about the Taggie/RCB thing too - it's well-written but you're thinking - there is a 20 year age gap and he loves her because she's so cute - hmmmm.

MrsHathaway · 15/03/2016 16:08

Taggie is younger than Tiffany. Just FYI.

BalloonSlayer · 15/03/2016 17:49

Rupert married Helen because like Rhett Butler with Scarlett, he "couldn't get her any other way." (GWTW also has a rape scene, actually, in which Scarlet finds she likes Rhett's forceful behaviour. Hmm He is so ashamed he can't talk to her, and it damages their relationship further in an ironic sort of way.)

I think you feel cross with Helen, as a reader, because she is the introspective thoughtful one and she KNOWS that they are not suited, they've got nothing in common etc. Rupert's just as much to blame for the poor decision to get married but because he never thinks about anything much you sort of excuse him.

Helen does drive me mad in the early chapters. She goes out on an all-day hunt sabotaging mission and doesn't eat any breakfast or bring a sandwich. So she's hungry! Really? And she's cross because the menz don't look after her and get her something to eat. How's that feminism going, Helen?

She watches Crittleden on the telly and it's pissing down. So then she goes down the next day, gets cold and "wishes she'd brought her coat." WTF? And she's supposed to be intelligent.

BeautifulMaudOHara · 15/03/2016 19:14

MrsHathaway re

"* a man's right to fuck his wife

  • a man's need to have sex generally
  • the idea that an unwanted sexual experience doesn't have lasting consequences
  • the desirability of teenagers to all adult males
  • the insatiability of an athletic man's sexual appetite "
  • rape in marriage was only made illegal in 1994, way after these were written Sad
  • I think that's still true, many men do 'need' sex
  • As a teenager I was fully aware that adult men fancied me (Urgh, but it's true)
  • certain men do have erm large sexual appetites
BeautifulMaudOHara · 15/03/2016 19:14

I haven't got to Taggie yet, is she really that young?

MrsHathaway · 15/03/2016 19:22

Yes, but it's the fact that Jilly-people accept these as universal truths. All men, all teenagers (etc).

It isn't true of all men, nor is it untrue of all women.

And I'm very skeptical about "needing" sex Hmm - enjoying sex is fine, but needing it is just nonsense. Away and have a nice wank occasionally ffs.

MrsHathaway · 15/03/2016 19:25

Taggie is a book away (sorry) but her DOB is later than Tiffany's. Off the top of my head she's five to ten years younger.

It's different because RCB doesn't meet her until she's an adult, but his tastes get older far more slowly than he does.

BeautifulMaudOHara · 15/03/2016 19:32

True re universal truths MrsH

I'm reading Jillys blog and laughing, her life is like her novels!

BeautifulMaudOHara · 15/03/2016 19:40

Lol at this

"In anticipation of handsome stallion handlers, I’d been stupid enough to splash myself with scent not realising this makes stallions ‘draw’ which is racing slang for getting an erection, so the moment I went into their boxes, both Oasis Dream and Frankel not only ate my notebook but also waved massive willies. Fortunately George the cat came back and restored respectability."

JillyTheDependableBoot · 15/03/2016 20:17

Isn't Taggie about 19 at the start of Rivals? Or even younger?

LabradorMama · 15/03/2016 20:40

Oh I love a Jilly thread!

There were so many recurring themes of men fancying underage girls in her books though that I sort of accepted it - I started reading JC at about 14. The boys were very 'of their time', weren't they? So many sub plots and just throwaway comments would be deemed unacceptable now and mostly so crass that no self respecting author would dare to use them anyway, even if they were writing a book set in that era now.

I always found Rannaldini going after Flora - his teenage son's teenage girlfriend - a bit disturbing, mainly because Rannaldini was a disturbing (and unbelievable) character though. Can't remember which book that was? TMWMHJ? Must dig out my Jilly stash this weekend, I'll be housebound looking after the dog which is having an op on Friday [convenient]

WizardOfToss · 16/03/2016 07:49

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

caitlinohara · 16/03/2016 12:16

Gutted to not be able to read along but I am moving house tomorrow and all my stuff is boxed up!

Please think of me sitting at a scrubbed kitchen table, unwrapping china whilst drinking whisky out of a teacup and reading the bits of newspaper with a disapproving dog looking on. And if anyone wants to send me some bantams eggs as a housewarming gift, they will be received with many thanks.

Hurrah!

BeautifulMaudOHara · 16/03/2016 13:40

I'm reading Rupert chatting up fen now and I think she's only 16 and I hate him for it Angry

LadyMonicaBaddingham · 16/03/2016 14:51

I've just realised that I almost certainly probably got the name of our first child from a child in a JC book. Don't worry, it's not Cosmo!! Grin

caitlinohara · 16/03/2016 16:17

Just to pick up on the thing about JC not really believing in Jake and Tory - I don't honsestly think she likes him at all. I think she went off him in the process of writing. It's all set up to be this poor boy triumphing over upper class git but he behaves just as badly as Rupert in many ways and you are rooting for Rupert in that final with his dislocated shoulder. As a story, it's completely amoral. Even Helen, the real victim, isn't particularly likeable and we are meant to laugh at her pomposity. It's a weird book. I much prefer Rivals.

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