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Riders - Jilly Cooper Book Club

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JillyCooperBookClub · 14/03/2016 09:53

It was a perfect spring day. Thickening crimson buds fretted a love-in-the-mist blue sky. The banks were draped with crocuses of the same Lenten purple as the altar cloth. A host of golden daffodils, retarded by the bitter winter, had just reached their prime and nodded their pale heads in approval.

Thus Helen falls for Rupert, and I fell for Jilly Cooper: against our upbringing and our better judgement, and despite every single red flag.

Riders wasn't my first Jilly Cooper, but the first I sought out, after a few stolen pages of another under dappled sun on Guide Camp as a teenager.

It starts deceptively happily, with gymkhanas and very proper sexless dates. But we mustn't be fooled: at every point every character is being judged by every other, and found wanting. Character flaws, damaging childhoods, trauma and tragedy: frankly it's a wonder any one of them made it to adulthood.

Rupert's friendship with Billy predates the neglect and misery of his childhood, so unsurprisingly it is the only healthy and unconditional human relationship he has.

There couldn't be much wrong with Rupert if he inspired friendship like this.

Rupert shivered, suddenly reminded of the desolation of Sunday nights at school, summoned by bells to Evensong, followed by cold ham and bread and marge for supper, and everyone else coming back feeling homesick from days out with their parents. Rupert had never really had a proper home to feel sick about.

And indeed it will be some years before he finds one.

We discussed on the general thread that Rupert is a bit, well, rapey. In Riders he has precisely zero respect for any woman's body autonomy (the very first time he and Helen meet he thrusts his hand into her jumper) and once he has any declared rights over a woman he takes absolute possession of her body.

With a colossal feeling of triumph he pushed her back on to the bed and began to move downwards, kissing her ribs, then her belly.

"No," she gasped, grabbing his head.

Firmly he removed her hands. "Shut up. You're mine now, to do exactly what I like with."

The foursome in Kenya is deeply, deeply troubling. Billy doesn't seem to realise how unwilling Helen is until he has raped her; Rupert is more concerned with how his friends will perceive them, and his response to finding her as dry as a marathon runner's throat is to declare her "useless"; Janey is so turned on by Rupert she doesn't stop to think about it. All three of them assault her together, until she escapes.

Any minute she expected an enraged Rupert to appear and drag her back to the torture chamber.

But the others were enjoying themselves. [...] Playing games of their own, they carried on till morning.

Days later, she falls for Jake: physically and romantically the exact opposite of Rupert. It was inevitable, surely, and as little as I like her I have the greatest sympathy. But I'll never forgive Jake as long as I live.

When I first read Riders I identified strongly with Tory. Poor unloved Tory - considered a fat failure, whilst in truth neither fat nor failing. Jilly is horribly judgemental about an ounce of spare fat on anyone, but she shows us that however miserable Tory might be, she is beautiful and perfect:

She was tallish and big boned, with a huge bust that bounced up and down as she walked. However she stood on the scales, she weighed eleven stone.

(Note: at 5'8", "tallish", that's a BMI of 23.4, and she promptly loses nine pounds when she falls in love, taking her to 22.5)

Actually she was much less far without her clothes on; rather splendid, in fact.

Tory is capable and loyal and loving and stoic and all the characteristics of a balanced human being. She doesn't expect Jake to love her; it's enough that she loves him.

"She loved you," said Fen bitterly. "Isa, Darklis, me, the horses, Wolf, were only extensions of how much she loved you. She knew you didn't love her, but she felt you needed her. That made life easier, that was enough."

"Oh, Christ," Jake groaned, putting his head in his hands. "I only realised in LA how much I loved her. [...] She always seemed so strong that she could cope with anything. I didn't realise I meant so much to her."

[...]

Frantic, he took her in his arms, trying to warm some life into the frail body.

"Don't die," he pleaded for the thousandth time. "Please don't die."

"Jake," came the faintest, faintest whisper.

I was going to talk about snobbery and class, and the animals, and the culture of celebrity, and the freedom of wealth, and Billy, and Malise, and political marriages, and fidelity, but I can't, because tears are streaming down my face yet again and my nose is running. So to cheer myself up, and to evidence Jilly's brilliance, I'll leave you with my favourite exchange:

"Will it be very fancy tonight?"
"Not particularly."
"Shall I wear pants?
Rupert's eyes gleamed. That was getting somewhere. "Certainly not," he said.
[...]
"Chicken, you are wearing pants. What's this?" he pinged the elastic."
"Panties," said Helen quickly. "You thought I'd go to a party without panties?"

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ChessieFL · 03/04/2016 15:12

Are we having a separate Rivals thread or just continuing this one?

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JillyCooperBookClub · 03/04/2016 16:17

I'll start a Rivals thread on 18 April (the idea was to space the books fairly evenly until the new one comes out, to give us all a chance to be up to speed given Real Life commitments etc).

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ChessieFL · 03/04/2016 16:25

Thanks Jilly

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LittleBearPad · 03/04/2016 19:03

Yeah. Rivals is my favourite.

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Trills · 03/04/2016 19:22

Rivals has the most Rupert-not-being-a-shit...

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TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 03/04/2016 21:23

We sort of see Fen and Dino having sex - him saying wow as he eases himself out of her, anyway.

The weight thing is funny - as a thin short teenager, I thought anything over 9 stone was fat. I had no concept that people who were over 5 foot 2 might be thin but heavier than that. I am now older, fatter and wiser, but I think that's where Jilly was coming from.

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BeautifulMaudOHara · 03/04/2016 23:13

I've finished Rivals too!

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LittleBearPad · 04/04/2016 08:58

I read Rivals first several times. Then I read Riders. I was Shock at Rupert and read Rivals again to make myself feel better Grin

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Thurlow · 04/04/2016 09:26

as a thin short teenager, I thought anything over 9 stone was fat.

That's so true. I was a huge shortarse and only 7 stone when I started reading Jilly so yes, 11 stone sounded massive Blush (Obviously I know much better now!)

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BalloonSlayer · 04/04/2016 09:54

I am still three quarters of the way through Riders so I am hoping to have finished it by the 18th April deadline!

It has occurred to me that we started this thread because we love Jilly Cooper books yet it has been full of criticism (me being one of the major culprits!). So I wondered, can we say WHY we love Jilly, in particular.

I'd say the reasons I always like Jilly books were:

  1. Being English through-and-through! In the late 70s - early 80s the alternatives were Jackie Collins and Shirley Conran whose - although they were both English - books/characters/plots were very American. (I'm sure there were others but those were the ones I read) Jilly seemed like a breath of fresh air as a comparison. And I would say that the things we have criticised upthread (group sex that is actually rape, sexism, fat-shaming, condoning of adultery etc) are a lot more prevalent in the books of JC and SC than in Jilly's. I remember a Jackie Collins character's attractiveness being summarised as "men didn't know whether to rape her or protect her." Shock


  1. A very down-to-earth approach to matters such as sex, food, housework, grooming. I liked that Jilly characters worry that they need to have a bath or haven't washed their hair or the house looks a mess.


  1. Funny dialogue. Not laugh-out-loud jokes but the sort of funny conversation that real people make.


  1. She tries to explain how her characters tick, I think that's why the later books don't work as she doesn't take the time to do that.


I am sure there's more

Tentative 5. Wanting desperately to buy into the idea that you can transform your whole self in 10 days by going on a diet and having your hair cut. (Fen, who says she hasn't lost the stone and a half Rupert estimated she needed to, but who presumably this means she has lost something near that. AND the diet got rid of her spots FOREVER. Yeah. ) Actually I realise that one has come out as a bit of a criticism. But, you know, whenever I have been feeling down my go-to solution is always to have my hair cut and go on a diet!
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Thurlow · 04/04/2016 10:06

very down-to-earth

YY. Her characters don't live in a world where everything is perfect. They can look bad, they can get their clothes wrong (that silver jumpsuit Grin), they need to use the loo and they fart, they serve food that goes wrong, they have housework that needs doing, they can forget to post important letters. There's an awful lot on real, everyday life in Jilly's books.

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EnglishFern · 04/04/2016 10:19

I love them because to me they are quintessentially English. I don't live in the uk anymore and they evoke something for me that I've lost from my life - the rolling countryside, the wild garlic, the villages, the very English humour and turns of phrases. Winter is always deep snowdrifts and apple logs on the fire, and fish pie for supper. Summer is always warm sunshine, nettles, hay in the field, corn stubble, tennis parties and Pimms.

Even though it's probably not an England which many of us know/knew exactly, it's one which we can all recognise.

Plus the characters are so real, as someone else said. Not perfect by any means but their imperfections make them sympathetic and relatable to.

When I was a teen I wanted to be Fen, or Perdita. Brave enough to walk out of an exam and go to the polo. When I was in my 20s I wanted to be Taggie, in my 40s I want to be Lizzie or Maud.

And I was a teen when I read them, which makes them very nostalgic for me. It was a time when I actually thought life might turn out a bit like this before reality hit

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GertrudeBadger · 04/04/2016 10:48

I think she's great at writing characters and descriptions of the countryside and also her books exude late 70s/80s English glamour for me - plus they do romp along in a nothing is really serious sort of a way, they always cheer me up. I believe my minor obsession with cashmere as the height of luxury can probably be dated to my reading of JC's books...

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MrsMarigold · 04/04/2016 10:57

I wonder whether Mumsnet would arrange a chat with Jilly Cooper so we could ask her a few questions - and find out a bit more about some of the more disturbing scenes as well as some of the best ones.

I love Jilly but I loved The Common Years - the description of the seasons and dog walking on Putney/Barnes Common are wonderful and Turn Right at the Spotted Dog.

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TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 04/04/2016 11:02

Yes, I was a teenager too and I thought of course I would wind up like Fen or Perdita, having a hugely jet-set lifestyle and being brilliant at some sport even though I didn't do any sport. I read Appasionata first and then Polo, then Riders and eventually found Rivals some time later. TMWMHJ was much later.

I love the reality of the characters - they all swear properly, they all feel like unattractive frumps from time to time, they lose their tempers and shout, they eat all the cheese out of the fridge or cut their hair with the kitchen scissors and get bacon fat in it...

I love Rupert. Even if he is an utter cad when you re-read it - he's so funny and flip and insouciant, and he is actually very kind at times when he's not sexually harassing underage schoolgirls . He's lovely to Fen after Billy goes back to Janey. And I adore the LA Olympics when Rocky takes a giant leap into the history books.

I am just horsy enough to appreciate all the horse bits, too - I was a pony-mad little girl who loved Pullein-Thompson books and I had a stubborn Shetland who looked like a Thelwell pony. Never did any gymkhanas or anything like that, though! But the horse characters ring very true to me too.

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TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 04/04/2016 11:09

Oh, and the clothes! She's really good at describing clothes - yes, they date (particularly Prudence or Octavia's outfits, or Abby's orange bomber jacket and drainpipes teamed with a black bra), but somehow you always believe in their beauty. I do wonder if it's a class thing too - she's very very good at describing the floral calf-length skirts and open-toed sandals of ladies of a certain age and type, and equally good at doing things like the difference between Sharon in Polo at the beginning and later on, once she's been gentrified. I'm not making my point very well - I mean that she has a great eye for how people dress depending on their age, class and style.

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CallMeMousie · 04/04/2016 13:26

Oh yes! Cords tucked into sawn-off boots is still the height of glamour to me. She's great on detail, you can just picture what they're wearing and the beautiful countryside, it evokes such strong emotions and takes me back to reading the books when I was younger, as a teen or lying on the grass in Brook Green on my lunch break for my first office job in my early 20s. I think the reading and re-reading makes the books a part of your personal mythology almost!

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Cel982 · 04/04/2016 13:47

I'm reading Riders for the first time. Read Polo years ago in college, and enjoyed the raciness of it (though even then I remember groaning at all the terrible puns). With Riders, though, I'm just kind of appalled at how much of a misogynist JC is. The unchallenged rapey vibe is horrifying; even knowing how different sexual mores were at the time, it's really depressing to see a female writer produce such a woman-hating story.

Of course I'm still reading, because it's such a page-turner Blush But it's grim.

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MrsHathaway · 04/04/2016 14:33

I love Jilly because somehow she manages to be real and aspirational at the same time. It makes the aspirational lifestyle that bit more achievable if you see that they're actually ordinary.

There's a bit where Kevin is about to poach Janey, where she is resentful about being expected to do all the (what we would call) wifework as well as being a journalist and writer in her own right. She fails to remember to do washing up or laundry or her greasy roots, and she forgets to submit Billy's paperwork on time so he turns up at events without a valid entry.

It's a kind of voyeurism into what famous people's lives must be: we get a glimpse into what it's like to be Rich and Famous and bugger me if it isn't a lot of hard work and misery.

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EnglishFern · 04/04/2016 15:42

It's the details isn't it, TooExtra?

The characters are brought to life not just by describing their personalities or what they do or say, but the scent they wear, the undies, the outfits. And you can map a changing character by how these subtle things also change. But because it's so carefully done, the scent used, the shoes etc are exactly evocative of "that sort" of person, whatever "sort" JC is describing.

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Thurlow · 04/04/2016 15:50

They are very fully formed characters. They have good sides, but also flaws. And very specific tastes that they don't vary from.

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Trills · 04/04/2016 20:52

The personalities definitely follow the writerly instruction of "show,don't tell"
We are not just TOLD that someone is shy or selfish or insecure, we see them behave in that way.

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Jermajesty · 04/04/2016 21:11

I stole my Mum's copy of Riders when I was about 14 (I'm now 39). I've been hooked on JC ever since. I have all her books and periodically go on a massive Jilly-fest....heaven!
Oh and I took up horse riding because of JC!!!!

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JillyCooperBookClub · 13/04/2016 10:51

Just a reminder that I'll be starting a Rivals thread on Monday (18th) if you will want to join in.

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Thurlow · 13/04/2016 10:59

Yay!

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