Why We Eat (Too Much) Thread 3

[TooExtraImmatureCheddar]

We’ve chatted as much as we (used to) eat! New shiny thread for more support.

General principles:

No sugar
No wheat
No processed foods
Honourable mention to tipping the balance of omega 3 and 6, but that’s mostly achieved by doing the above.

Everything else is fair game!

I think unless you are an athlete ir have health conditions just cutting out UPFs is enough. And not even completely, 80/90% is a lot more achievable than 100%, it allows for the squirt of brown sauce on your eggs, the odd desert so you don't feel too deprived and say fuck it or the family celebration.

I certainly don't feel I am on a diet tho interestingly I say 'oh no thank you, I'm on a diet' which is completely, socially acceptable. If I said 'oh no thank you I don't eat wheat/sugar/veg oil' I then have to explain and get quizzed 'what you eat cheese and potatoes and rice and cream but not this 'healthy' portion of pasta, or ham salad sarnie on brown or even a slice of toast?'. And then it gets complicated.

Not sure what I will have for lunch, probably eggs in some form. Then tea will be jacket potato and cheese and tuna because ds is kayaking until 8pm. I think its a sign I have accepted this way of eating that I just sling veg, fish, salad etc into the trolley and don't meticulously plan every meal. As long as I have whole foods in I can always cobble something together. Oh and I picked up some red lentil 'pasta' yesterday. It's 100% red lentils so kinda acceptable tho obviously processed. Will let you know what it's like when I get round to using it.

My big fear is diabetes. I have developed a bit of an obsession with the idea that I might be (or was?) prediabetic, despite having no symptoms aside from a handful of skin tags, most of which have been there for years.

I did have the risk factors though - overweight, waist too large for height, eating too many carbs.

The thing I worry about now is whether the things I am eating are still spiking my blood sugar and I'll still end up diabetic, even though my weight is now healthy, my waist is within the correct ratio, I'm exercising enough and I've reduced carbs way down.

Spector was banging on about how oats and things still spiked him, and how eating fats to compensate could be a problem if you're not tolerant to fats, so you need to measure triglycerides etc. etc. It just goes on and on and I'm mentally exhausted with it all. It's like doing bloody homework again (not that I ever did my homework back then).

I like the way I'm eating now, I don't want to restrict further or go ultra low carb, so I fear hooking myself up to monitors and what have you.

Also, what's the point? So we can all live forever and watch the world burn? My Nanna is still alive at 98, despite a lifetime of processed white bread, but she's in full time care and with her Alzheimer's she no longer speaks and hasn't recognised any of us for years.

I'm feeling a bit disgruntled, if anyone hadn't noticed.

I agree with @HighlandCowbag in that I think the biggest culprit is UPFs and anything we can do to reduce how much of those we are eating is a good thing. Anything additional to that may give added benefits, but we probably don't need to get too hung up on the details.

For example, some people cutting out wheat will give additional benefit while others may be fine with small amounts of wheat.

For me my personal experience is that I know that since starting this WoE I have:

• lost weight (over 2 stones now meaning I have just dipped into the healthy BMI range)
• more energy
• less joint pain
• felt healthier (I know this is very subjective, but I just feel better in myself)

But most importantly I feel like I can keep this WoE up long-term. Any previous diet I've been on has left me feeling deprived and resentful meaning it was only a matter of time before I gave up. With this WoE I look forward to my meals, don't feel hungry between meals and LOVE the fact I don't have to count or weigh anything I'm eating. It is so much easier than previous diets I've done.

Interesting take on the opinions of different 'experts'
This WOE makes sense to me because it isn't complicated.
I'm a TA in a busy primary school and I have 2 children with ASCs (as well as a husband who'd be diagnosed if he was a child today....)
I can make this WOE work in our family without having to change what we eat too much. My kids both have massive issues with food caused by anxiety and sensory issues. With this WOE I can serve foods they will eat and just avoid the 'nopes' myself.

(Although yesterday was a disaster - I've broken my ankle so am doing very little cooking. DH decided that the meal from the freezer wasn't what his mouth wanted to eat so ordered in and my will power wandered off.......)

I am combining this WOE with some Paul Mckenna hypnosis to tackle my portion sizes and help myself stop when I'm full.

And now I must away and collect DS's GCSE results. It's been a long road navigating him through school but he's worked hard so fingers crossed!

I know what you mean @TheLeadbetterLife, but the way I think of it is like putting money into savings. I save money each month and pay into my pension in order to be prepared for retirement. I know it is possible I could walk out my front door tomorrow morning and get hit by a bus, but even though there is that risk I'm still going to save.

With healthy eating, exercise, not smoking, looking after my mental health insert all manner of health fads here I'm doing what I'm doing so that I can be in the best shape possible for the future. I know I could fall ill despite these measures (my mum died of cancer in her early 60s, I know the same could happen to me) but I'm still taking the steps I am in order to give me a better chance of having a healthy life in the future.

It's a matter of balance. I'm not going to the extremes that some people (looking at you Gwyneth) might go to as I don't want that level of impact on my normal life (eg I still want to have birthday cake when my kids are celebrating), but I'm making the changes that fit in with my life that are going to have a positive impact on my well-being without becoming so demanding I resent them.

So I'm not going to the level of getting my poo analysed or my triglycerides checked, but I am going to cut down on UPFs as that balance works for me. Everyone will have a different balance, but taking some steps to improve health will be better than none.

As a person who has a natural tendency to go to extremes, I try very hard to achieve balance. It's taken decades and I don't always succeed.

Anything in excess is probably a bad thing, one way or another, as well as unsustainable.

What's become clear to me, is that nutritional science is clearly evolving, and the latest concept that what's good for one person may not suit another is interesting - beyond the basics of reducing UPF and sugar, etc that is.

I am slightly leery of a free for all on all forms of fat - not least because I love it and have a tendency to eat beyond satiation point (greed, love of food, and habit.) I don't replace it with low fat things, but I am attempting to apply the breaks. Sometimes.

I also eat far too much red meat according to current thinking. Tackling this, too and eating more oily fish. Yes it's farmed, but not letting best be the enemy of good.

Anyhoo, another light salad for lunch here. Just a few leaves. 😂

On health fears more generally, I am really worried about dementia. Father died with it ( albeit at 98) and mother is declining with Alzheimer's. She was diagnosed at 86 and is 90 now.

Since menopause and the build up, my memory has been really shocking. I know this happens, but it's hard to know what is normal decline and what is not. No I am not putting my purse in the fridge or metal plates in the microwave, but my memory, especially at work, is terrible. Names especially.

Word brain fog goes hand in hand with the menopause. You are very active with your dog walking and that will help enormously to prevent dementia. I know it must be worrying.
Regarding conflicting diet advice - I've just finished The Obesity Code and it's the best book I've read. Dr Fung says quite rightly that most diets, or ways of eating, are fundamentally the same now, with a twist.
Most advocate low carb, high fat, cutting out UPF, reducing sugar and refined grains, eating more plants (and a greater variety of them), reducing meat, not snacking. The blood sugar 800, Atkins, Paleo, Mediterrean and Dr J's are all based on this*. Dr J has added the twist of omega 3:6 ratio, but as he himself stays that's all theory at the moment.
So keep to the basics, I like Tim Spector's WOE with his low carb, low meat eating, nuts, cheese, dark chocolate and red wine because those are foods I enjoy. The only thing Dr Jenkinson wouldn't approve of is the nuts.

• with the exception of fasting and the bizarre carnivore diet

Thanks Sam. I hope with every fibre that you're right. Does it improve, I wonder as time goes by, if it is menopausal and nothing more sinister ?

I was so hungry this afternoon and feeling a bit odd. I wasn't hungry this morning so didn't have my gazpacho and flax seed. Also did a taxing workout. The old flax does make a difference to appetite I think.

Feel sleepy now! Had the other half of my steak from earlier this week with fried potatoes and veg for dinner today. ( this is me cutting down on red meat consumption, you see. )

Words I know it is a big sign of menopause. Have you tried HRT? That's supposed to help. I've just started, other than putting on a couple of kgs I'm not sure it's done a lot for me, but I never suffered from hot flushes day or night and I don't think I have a lot of brain fog although my family might disagree
It's hot here today, so I'm less hungry than usual.
Interesting podcast on Fat this week with the Doctor's Kitchen. Being cold definitely helps with weight loss so turn the heating down in the winter and get outside as much as possible. It aslo talked about a possible link between corticosteroid asthma inhalers and obesity.

Just finished listening to this book, the Omega 3/6 stuff was fascinating. I've made immediate changes to my diet but am going to listen to it again, and incorporate some more changes to become a way of life.

Samthebordercollie I listened to that podcast - it was interesting about brown fat. Tried a cold shower this morning on the back of that
I hadn't heard the link with steroid asthma inhalers before

Is brown fat old fat? There are theories regarding old fat and the way it impacts on the metabolic system in ponies. It's interesting stuff.

Brown fat is a thin layer of fat that is very metabolically active so produces a lot of heat energy. The original thinking was that we have it as babies as they are not able to shiver to keep warm, and as we grow, it disappears. They have discovered that we do still have a small amount, and you can increase its activity and therefore your metabolism by cold exposure and also eating certain foods such as chillis

What is the theory about the brown fat in ponies?

It was a few years ago I read it when I had a pony with a metabolic disorder. It was basically the theory that old fat cells are much worse than new fat cells. So if you have a pony who is overweight (it's a real issue for horse owners) don't just diet them down to an OK weight, take them further to break down the old fat cells, get them underweight then rebuild them to OK. Iirc, it was to do with messages from the old fat cells to hormones and to do with changes in the seasons and laying down fat stores for winter. Possibly similar to Jenkinsons theories re omega 3 and 6. The study re ponies said one of the reasons metabolic issues were becoming more of an issue is better care and management over winter.

When I was a kid it was a struggle to keep weight on ponies over winter. Feed wasn't as good quality (or maybe it was), hay wasn't as good as not as many pesticides etc, it was more common for ponies to live out over winter, and those that had stables were exercised more rather than out to graze for several hours a day. And rugs were either waterproof (ish) or stable rugs to keep them warm at night, non of the fancy technical ones we get now.

And I'm 'only' 43, so massive changes over 30 years really. But metabolic issues are one of the main issues with keeping ponies, especially those native to the UK and colder climates. My 2 are currently on a diet, we've moved yards to enable this and I've gone back to old fashioned ways of feeding and restricted grazing and diet hay. From a field never fertilised. There is a very clear difference between this hay and the normal hay.

The ponies are fuming 😤

Poor ponies . But that is really interesting that the change in agriculture has made a difference to such a wide animal population (I.e not just humans!)

Morning all! Just popping in with a few different comments about various things that have been mentioned recently.

I'm still ploughing my way through the Tim Spector podcast, I only get a short while to listen to it when the kids are settled doing something, otherwise there are too many interruptions!

I am also about halfway through the Michael Pollan book, am finding it really interesting and it certainly resonates with what Jenkinson says.

I don't know much about brown fat and absolutely nothing about ponies but I have read on a number of occasions about brown fat being better for us and getting cold can help it develop. I think that's partly why cold showers are advocated as benefiting health perhaps.

I was really encouraged this morning as my weight has dipped below 11 stones for the first time in many, many months. The last time I weighed less than 11 stones it had taken months of dedicated dieting with really focused calorie counting and monitoring everything I ate.

In the interests of honesty I am exactly 0.25 lbs below 11 stones, but that still meant I had the lovely number 10 flashing up on my scales!

Last thing, I'm still noticing a significant reduction in my appetite and a lower tolerance of sweet things. This morning I met a friend for breakfast and I ordered porridge with sultanas and honey. In the past I have eaten the lot and loved the sweetness of the sultanas and honey. Today I barely added any of them to the porridge and still found it very sweet - I'm adding a photo to show how little of each I had. So different to how I used to eat! I did eat all the porridge though

Omg we had a pony back in the 70s that was retired from farm work and left to roam the farm. He used to get fat and my dad would put him on a diet. I used to sneak him sugar. He loved me. Interestingly he had no artificial feed other than when he was in the stable dieting.

I had a Shetland pony when I was little who used to get laminitis and be incarcerated in the shelter. He was smart as a whip and used to grab the other horse's dish, tip the feed out and hoover it up. He also specialised in breaking out of his field and getting into neighbours' gardens.

Congratulations on being under 11 stone, Tired! Well done! so jealous

I did a Metafit workout this morning and thought I was going to die, it was ridiculously hard!

Lol at naughty shetland. I have a naughty welsh pony and a very well behaved highland pony. She well behaved until she gets too hungry then walks through fences taking the welsh with her. They are both in grazing muzzles atm, for 6 hours grazing. Then have soaked diet hay, the soaking removes some of the sugar to help them lose weight. But it's still important to keep trickling food into them otherwise it causes gut issues. Its a bigger minefield than humans!

Oh well done tired !

I'll get there too .... one day!

I had coffee out today and tried a tiny bite of my friend's lemon drizzle cake. I couldn't eat it- the icing was so incredibly sweet it was horrible. It went in my napkin. This is an interesting development !

Another session of reformer Pilates early this morning. Really enjoyed it. Also had my kefir ( made in the yog maker following the recommendation in the Mosley book.) Very tasty and unusual.

The kimchi, otoh, continues to fester in its special jar.

Omelette and salad for lunch, salmon with raw spinach and herbs, and greens and a couple of cold boiled new potatoes sliced and fried in butter for dinner.

I feel I am over eating. But I am genuinely hungry.

Can I ask about kefir and kimchi (as well as other fermented foods). Do many of you eat them regularly as part of your nutrition and if so what do you have?

I've never tried any fermented foods other than Greek yoghurt, but was contemplating trying to introduce some into my regular eating.

What would you recommend? Do you generally have them as side dishes with a main meal, or on their own as a snack? I don't think I want to start making them, so what can I buy that would be best? I've had a quick Google of Tesco's offerings and they stock kefir, though a lot of them seem to be flavoured which I'm assuming is not as good? They have kimchi as well, but I've never even tasted it, so really don't know what to try it with.

Open to suggestions!!

Sauerkraut is really easy to make - I add mine to salads, sandwich's, egg on toast, soups, and eat in its own. Kimchi is slightly harder to make, but absolutely worth it, adds a kick. Fermented hot sauce is amazing, and you can easily ferment vegetables which I have just started. You basically need decent (ie not going off) veg, some herbs, good quality salt, bowl and knife to start with along with a clip jar.

Shop bought tends to be very pricey (the real stuff) or cheap but pasteurised therefore all the good bugs have been killed.