Help! Pony rearing in horse box.

[Spero]

hello, non-horsey mother of horse mad child here. You were all very helpful a few years back when my daughter started off on her adventures by loaning a pony - we have now got to the stage where she has her own pony and I have a 3.5 tonne van to transport him.

we got him a few weeks ago and have taken him out a few times and its been fine. he was a bit tricky to load on one occasion but perfectly fine once we got him in.

however today we tried to load him to go to a show and once he was in he started rearing up and got his front legs over the bar and then his hoof stuck in a hay net which was frankly terrifying. We gave up on the show idea but tried again this afternoon but he did it again. He calmed down as soon as we went in the back with him; it seems to be the prospect of us leaving him alone in the back that started him off.

My daughter is now in floods of tears saying that if a pony is like this, there is no cure, they will never be able to travel, there is nothing that can be done etc. I have done a bit of googling and read frankly scarey things about hobbling which I don't think I want to try and sound dangerous in themselves.

so I just thought I would ask if anyone had any tips or suggestions. Part of the problem may be that he is just so new, we don't know his quirks yet. I have messaged his previous owner and asked if she has any tips but I don't think she ever travelled with him on his own.

Is pony in a paddock? My learning was always to leave box open with hay/feed in there, if that's doable in your paddock.

String up haynets on outside initially and small steps from there.

Good luck. It's very scarey, and with a new pony its hard to know what's gone on, apart from the being left alone being fallout from having been boxed to you and now not happy at realisation its previous owners gone

I would be quiet around pony for a while just let him/her get settled for a few weeks before trying again

And therein lies your problem. He probably hasn't done it before.

Go back to basics. If you are able to, leave the ramp open and his food inside and encourage him to go in without taking him anywhere to start with.

Does he have a companion he can go with?

You need to make the experience fun and/ or normal for him so regularly feeding him in it is the first step.

As he has had a bad experience you might need to get someone in who can help you, someone who trains horses in intelligent horsemanship/ Monty Roberts if you find it difficult to deal with on your own.

Get professional help asap and before refusing to load becomes an issue for him.

Good luck.

I had a problem with one of my horses a long time ago, maybe 15-16 years now. She went from loading travelling like a dream to rearing on the ramp, backing off, generally pissing about.

I knew her really well and I couldn’t solve it. I ignored the sweep her on, lunge lines, etc., etc., brigade and paid for this man to visit.

Solved in a couple of hours with kindness, good man. If whatever you try doesn’t work I would recommend him.

How old is your daughter?

But he has done it before - that's the weird thing. He's been out three times with us - bit tricky to load on one occasion but otherwise fine.

I dont understand why he has suddenly decided its such a terrifying experience?

His old owner says travel him forwards so his legs have nowhere to go which sounds like a good suggestion but if he's scared i assume he will still be kicking out and risking hurting himself.

We are in a livery so can't leave the horse box open unfortunately. I work full time so can only really get there at weekends otherwise I would suggest to my daughter we just try loading him on and off every day.

She is adamant that 'nothing can be done' but I thought there must be some help we can get - so I could try and find someone to 'train' him?

We can't get a companion either unfortunately.

thanks the box, I may have to call him!

She is 14 at the end of January but pretty tall for her age - same height as me (5 6). He is 14 2 so upper end of pony size.

Take out partition and breast bar. Tie pony to baler twine on metal ring once inside. They do get used to it eventually. The problem is any hint of we'll take you out if you kick up a fuss and they milk it. Can't somebody at the yard help?

Oversimplification Miranda. Many horses like the security of a partition. The horse I had the problem with would have (and did) snapped the weak link, reversed off the box and pissed off down the lane in dense fog before you could get the back up.

Ok, assuming you have full livery, as dd1 is 14, you aren't horsey and can't get there often you must be somewhere with a lot of supervision and help, so ask the yard owner for help with referral to a local person who can help

We had the same issue with one of ours. We tie up with Shires webbing breakaway trailer ties - one each side so is cross tied and thus cannot lift head high enough to get legs up, we also move the partition more squarely (it's herringbone) so there is room to move but not room to kick legs out far enough to get up and over bar - but still thumped the wall at times. Can you move the breast bar further back to accomodate the pony more snugly?

We had no companion to try travelling with, so instead I bought some mirror fablon and stuck a panel of this to the wall of the lorry. (I cover it up when not in use as the sun shines in where it is parked, worried with the summer sun it'd set light to the lorry!)
We also take out in the lorry a couple of times a week (suggest join both Pony Club and Riding Club and take advantage of (less exciting) training sessions rather than continually going to shows, take out to ride in some else's arena and also go out in lorry to hack home).

Horse still greets 'lorry mate' with a cheery call on getting in the lorry, travels fine and is no bother now.

Also buy a hay bag rather than hay net for travelling. Choose one with webbing across the hole, eg LeMieux, or with a small hole like a Wetherbeeta one, it's less likely to get a hoof caught. Smaller hole = less mess too.
www.equinesuperstore.co.uk/hay-bag-grey-plaid.html

As you can't get boz near paddock, take pony to be groomed tied to outside, each visit, then feed on the ramp and so on.

Thanks for all advice and comment - yes we have one of those bag thingies for hay and will not be using the haynet again.

She is in the local pony club - the first three trips were to pony club type events at a local Equestrian Centre so she certainly is not just dashing off to show after show - I couldn't afford that time or money wise!

But she does want to do some shows so I need to get this sorted if I can - the facilities at the yard aren't great so we do need the option of being able to travel.

The partition is a bar that you fix in place - there are a variety of holes to fix it but it would just get more diagonal if you see what i mean.

his previous owner is also talking about cross ties so i am going to get my daughter to speak to her tonight as she will probably have more of a clue about what is going on.

Is there a local horse-box mechanic/servicing firm that could fix an anti-weave grille into your box? I have an Equitrek trailer with a fixed front bar that the partition fastens to. It would be horribly easy for a rearer to get stuck over the bar, which is fixed. I had two custom-built anti-weaving grilles put in when I bought it. Wasn't expensive and removed the worry of a rearer getting stuck over the bar!

Just to add that the ones in my trailer are solid with just the gap for the head, so not even the worry of them getting a foot stuck in an open-bar one like in the picture above.

Hes only been with you a few weeks, and in that time he's not only had a complete move to acclimatise to, but also hes been boxed off to various events. I think he should have been time for his hooves to hit the ground before the pressure of all these trips, and more coming. You need to slow down or you are gonna end up with a very stroppy/upset daughter and a frazzled pony!

Do some local stuff for a while. There's nothing worse than pressure in these situations and your dd really had a strong reaction! Everything needs to stabilise...he's not a little machine, and needs some time to trust his new owners.
If he had minor issues boxing already you can bet that strangers trying to push stuff on him is going to only amplify issues, until he can trust you well, and become very familiar.

Firstly, don't despair. Behavioural problems of all kinds are common with horses and can be overcome with good training.
Secondly, get help. Reward and repetition tend to solve many loading problems but as you are not used to horses and cannot read the situation it is best to get a professional in to help. I would go with someone who uses positive methods as the pony sounds scared.

I think this is really the time to accept your limits and get someone in to help (whether your YO or your DD's instructor or a professional specialising in behavioural issues). These things are usually eminently fixable with training, usually through something like gradual exposure, pressure/release or reward based/clicker training, but it takes a lot of skill and experience, knowing the exact time (to the second!) to apply pressure and when to remove it/reassure/reward, and also advising on the set up of the box/trailer that will work best for the individual horse. I am not at all saying you are incompetent but with the best will in the world, non horsey mum + catastrophising teenage DD + frightened large animal confined in a small space is a recipe for stress at best and serious injury/damage at worst so for everyone's sake I'd seek some help asap.

As to why he was fine before and panicking now, hard to say. Horses are funny things, there may have been something on your last outing that worried him (perhaps he lost his balance on the drive home or perhaps something happened at the venue?) without him showing it (some horses like some people do mask stress very effectively until it all gets too much and it bubbles over) or possibly something small in the box has changed - (even down to the quality of the light changing so he can't see as well?) or perhaps he is picking up on some excitement/stress in you or your DD, if you were even slightly worried or nervous about the competition he may have picked up on it, if he's a sensitive soul? Any number of things it could be really and horses are flight animals so it doesn't tend to take too much to get them very worried about being trapped in a confined space. But don't worry, I am sure if he was previously a good loader he will be again if dealt with promptly and sympathetically...

thank you for the comments - I think some professional help would be best, I am certainly aware of my limitations.

We have taken him out three times to venues about 20 minutes away so I don't think he has been unduly traumatised by that.

But there is clearly something we need to address before he or my daughter gets hurt.

I like the idea of the grilles RatherbeRiding - I think I will try a combination of that and getting some professional guidance. I would assume that stopping the rearing is only half the problem as he will still be scared, so we need to try and stop him getting his legs stuck and work on whatever it is that is freaking him out once he is in - the loading doesn't seem to be the problem, its once he is in and we shut the doors that he goes crazy.

Its totally not about how many, but that you are strangers to him, that he needs to get to know and trust. Literally not saying that 20 mins x 3 is traumatising, but for a strange horse in a strange box and to events, I am saying he needed time to settle.

As he boxes fine, I would say try feeding him in the box each time. Then gradually introduce pulling up the ramp.

Another here agreeing that he needs time to build his trust and relationship with you.

Everything's new to him, all the thing's that gave him confidence and peace of mind have been taken from him and he has to find these things again and work everything out.

I'm sure with small steps he'll come good but you really do have to give him that time to adjust.

I understand it's hard with daughters, new pony, pony club to get to but put the work in slowly and patiently, it's worth the time and investment.

Also well done to you, for a non horsey Mum you sound as though you're doing great!

Can I just say I had issues with a couple of ponies loading - and used rob leese to sort them out , fantastic, non-force , they were. Just taking the piss.

He's animal not a bicycle and its sounds like your dd might be treating him like a bike and if he doesn't function to expectations having a breakdown about it.

that is a really offensive and unhelpful comment Shriek.

thanks to the helpful people on this board, my daughter had a year with a loan pony who was 9 hands high and kept trying to kill her. She treated that horrible animal with patience and affection, mucked it out, groomed it etc and therefore proved herself to me over time. She then had a second loan over a year and was just as diligent.

so I was quite sure of her knowledge and her aptitude and agreed to buy her a pony.

I have two dogs, a cat and four guinea pigs. I am well aware that animals are living beings and need to be treated with kindness and respect and cared for well.

I am sorry that you felt that was a useful addition to what has otherwise been a very helpful thread.

I am going to contact the 'horse whisperer' recommended by boxofdelights today and my daughter is getting in touch with the physio that visited her other pony. Hopefully we will be able to sort the problem