Are teachers talking about this (concerned at all?) IRL - children wanting to change gender etc

[Leafstamp]

Disclaimer: I do, or at least have at various points in the past, hung out on the Feminism Board.

But I am genuinely interested to know whether the topic of gender identity in relation to the curriculum, but also children themselves who have gender issues is coming up much in schools.

There seems to be a lot in the news about it (if you follow this sort of thing) and wondered how teachers are finding it.

Not right now as about to start a full day but will. Policy Exchange is a right wing think tank and I'm sure you'd agree that both sides in this debate have a tendency to cherry pick their evidence.
There was a huge increase in referrals for ND at the end of the 20th century. It didn't mean there was a sudden increase in ND people! And the raw numbers show that it is not a huge increase. There is no epidemic.

Great, thanks, I'd like to read up on the evidence that social transition is a beneficial intervention for children as I think that would go against the findings of the Cass Review.

Meanwhile, the data from the You Gov survey and information about the number of children saying they are trans is here Most secondary schools now have trans-identified pupils: Sex Matters’ new survey - Sex Matters (sex-matters.org)

You're right that Policy Exchange is considered right wing but their information was taken from the sending of over 300 Freedom of Information requests, I'm not sure the data would have been any different if a left wing think tank had requested it. Plus Rosie Duffield the Labour MP did write the foreword to the report. I don't think it's helpful to make this a right wing versus left wing issue, this is about child safeguarding and evidence based education.

in a school of around 1500 we have 3 trans pupils and a handful who are questioning. I definitely haven't seen the "epidemic" that is reported at all
One of the things we say to teachers at school who are worried about this is that we are not medical professionals or counsellors. As with anything, we take guidance from parents and from doctors. We wouldn't facilitate any social transition without involving parents, but we always work with pupils to help them have that conversation themselves before we step in.

its interesting that the new NHS guidance has a sentence saying the wishes of the parent are paramount but no similar sentence about the child. Surely the child's wellbeing is the most important thing? Regardless, as a school we always follow the guidance of the professionals who have expertise in this.

‘We wouldn’t facilitate any social transition without involving parents....’

I think schools really need to think about and break down what ‘social transition’ is.

And, to be fair, this should have long been done for schools by Dept for Education.

In the absence of govt guidance, the following has been produced https://sex-matters.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Social-transition-in-schools-is-not-possible.pdf

Here, the outcome of the analysis is that social schools cannot accommodate social transition while fulfilling their statutory obligations. This is because:

• A child must continue to be recorded as their actual sex throughout their school career. This information is on the register and available to teachers and staff.
• A child and their family have personal autonomy when it comes to self-expression, but a school cannot require other children and teachers to pretend that a child has changed sex.
• Where a school has sex-based rules, there should be a good reason for them. If some children can be treated as exceptions (because of trans identification or for some other reason), that suggests the reason was not strong enough to justify sex-based rules in the first place.
• If treating children differently according to sex is justified, that justification does not disappear because a child identifies as trans. The sex-based rules will still apply to them.
• A school, at a single point in time, cannot possibly fully consider the impacts of a decision to socially transition both for that child and for other children across all their school careers. Staff at the school will not be medically trained.
• A school cannot explain to all teachers, other pupils and parents why it allows one child to be treated as the opposite sex and to breach sex-based rules while not allowing another child. Any such attempt at explanation would involve disclosing details of a child’s broader wellbeing, medical history and so on.
• It is unfair to place the responsibility for saying no to the requests of trans-identifying children on individual schools, or even pupils, instead of giving decision-makers in schools the protection of a clear rule which they must follow. There is a real risk that doing so will expose them to bullying.

I will not be using guidance from sex matters. They are hardly neutral on this.

I’d be very interested to know specifically which part of their guidance you disagree with and why.

Also do you manage to dig out that evidence that social transition is beneficial @GrammarTeacher ?

My school have very much kicked this issue into the long grass after I kicked up a fuss about their proposed trans policy which went against Cass and all safeguarding protocols. I think the head is just hoping it will all go away and she doesn't have to address it. She knows I will fight tooth and nail for children not to be taught their bodies might be wrong and for parents never to be kept in the dark about their child. On the other side, there is an Assistant Head who fully favours immediate affirmation and don't tell the parents. She's quite a weak head really and I think she just wants to avoid picking a side. Luckily most of our students are not of the demographic (which seems to be white middle class high achieving girls (like anorexia)) which are iding as trans in large numbers so there aren't any current issues with the students themselves. We had one girl I'd as a boy a few years ago but she is now happy 20something butch lesbian at home in her own skin.

I’m bumping this old thread I started as there’s been a couple of big developments the last few days that I think teachers should be aware of:

1. The WPATH Files leaks, which expose the horrors of the completely unregulated and unaccredited ‘World Professional Association for Transgender Health’
2. The NHS has announced it will no longer prescribe puberty blockers for children.

These are obviously medical matters, but the medical journey invariably starts with social transition at school with teachers affirming a child’s opposite sex identity. Perhaps having already taught them that everyone has a gender identity and that they might like to consider what their gender identity is.

The same scandal that is now being recognised in the medical world will occur as a scandal in the education world in terms of the biased teaching and anti-safeguarding practices. Please, teachers, do not be part of this.

Teach children that they are fine as they are, they do not need to pretend to be the opposite sex.

How are things at your school now @ValancyRedfern ?

And @GrammarTeacher did you ever find the evidence about the benefits of social transition?

I find at my school , all girls 1500 plus, approx about 30 kids I would say who identify as trans) some more in other years. most teachers are not happy with blindly going a long with the wishes of the children changing their genders however we don’t say anything as just like in society for fearing of being hounded out of our jobs. I have 5 trans students in one class- all are friends and happened over a year. I personally see it as a social contagion type thing and heavily skewed to autistic children, who unfortunately if ever questioned can see things in a very black and white way and rather militant. School leadership useless and government guidance is useless so I feel all teachers are treading on egg shells so we don’t get in trouble

Thanks for that insight @wellington77

I’m reassured to hear that most teachers in your school are not happy about going along with it. Although a worry if there are any who are happy about it.

Hopefully we are not too many months away from teachers being given the back up they have long needed from DfE.

Also these things hitting the media on the medical side will surely plant seeds of doubt in those who have either not thought about it or who have been promoting it.

Those who socially transition pupils and then lie to parents about it, do you also require those pupils’ siblings to lie to their parents too? What about their friends? What other lies and secrets do you require from your pupils?