Student 'can only do' 8.30-3.30

[SpringisSpringing]

I'm fairly new to teaching so I really don't know what to do. I don't want to be responsible for failing someone.

It's just not enough time. I don't get the chance to talk to her properly.

She's okay. Not great- but if I actually had time to mentor her she might get better!

Ah. Primary? Not sure how that works then!

When I did my PGCE, some students were picked up by university minibus. They would have had to leave on time. I don't think you can organise meetings out of school hours, but I would expect a student to be flexible if at all possible.

I had a flick through her placement guidelines but cannot remember seeing anything about the timetabling of mentor meetings.

Your meeting time should be timetabled during the school day.

For a primary teacher, when would you suggest that is?

Before school: setting up. In lessons: teaching (we don't have free periods). Breaktime: Duty. At lunchtime: running clubs, setting up afternoon lessons, meetings e.g. with SENCo, often doing catch-up or access activities with specific children. End of day: it's 3.30 by the time that the children are gone.

I'm not seeing this 'free time' when i could meet with a student, especially as a primary class cannot be left unattended.

So basically you can’t be a teacher if you’re not a martyr. No wonder there is a retention crisis!

Just to be clear: I am a mentor and at my school we actively encourage a healthy work-life balance from the start. The unis we work with appreciate that approach and would not tolerate a student being failed for leaving at 3.30!

Yes, short staffed primary!

I think I might be a lone voice in the wilderness here (apart from copy). Why is this a bad thing?

After school meetings are (supposed to) be limited to one per week max for your common or garden teacher. Neither of you should be imposing more.

A fair few of you are sounding like you'd be the types who would tut at anyone who chose to work what would be considered by most to be proper working hours! You aren't exhibiting good leadership, really...

Completely agree with icopy ... I’m not sure if she would be even fulfilling basic directed hours which we all know are a complete joke. Does she honestly think she’ll be able to hold down a teaching role on these hours?

I absolutely hate presenteeism. I work in school 7-4 because I work better there, but if it suits others better to do their planning / marking at home then that's fair enough. Also, not all schools expect all teachers to set and do their own after school detentions - in fact none of the four I've worked in expected that. My current school has teachers do their own lunchtime detentions and after school ones get passed up to the HoD.

Deliberately setting someone up to fail just because they stick to directed time and get remaining work done at home is bloody awful.

Has this student only just come to you? where were they before? At the start of working with any student I hand them the calendar so they know what's expected in terms of meetings. If she's not staying past 3.30 and not attending meetings then she's not meeting professional standards so cannot pass.

The thing is, 8.30 - 3.30 are child contact hours (primary PPA is timetables 1x per week, for an afternoon usually, and that wouldn't be often enough to met with a student).

They cannot be 'double used' for a meeting with a student (as either you, or the student, has to be in front of the class at all times).

That's not to say I don't sympathise/ empathise with your busy schedule but is that not resolved by you not agreeing to be a mentor, perhaps? You should be given time for mentoring and, if you aren't, you should not be doing it.

I remember one placement where the university had arranged transport to quite a remote school. My journey took over 2 hrs each way and included a taxi, minibus and then a coach back to the uni town.

I had to walk into school at 8.30 and leave at about 3.45.. IT WAS HELL and there were lots of tears at home from that placement as I just felt really out of control. I suspect I passed partly down to goodwill but luckily it was only one placement of many (4yr degree). I don't know how she expects to cope.

I feel I need time with her to discuss

• what she taught that day, what went well, what could have been better
• individuals who need extra support etc
• planning for the next few days.

I'm not expecting her to be there until 6!

Are you her actual mentor?

Piggy, I think you are confusing 'mentor' with 'class teacher'.

I have a student in my class at the momentI I do the vast majoprity of their feedback, coaching, passing on information about curriculum / discussing specific children etc, but the mentor is someone else. the mentor oversees all students in the school, not just mine, and does have time for that overall role.

amazing that's just nonsense really. Students are encouraged to attend meetings - such as department meetings and so on. But, not staying beyond 3.30 on a normal day is not anything to do with professional standards! Honestly, what are we all doing to ourselves?

I think I might be using mentor wrongly. I'm the class teacher. My responsibility is to observe, fill in a mid-way report and a final report after a visit from a university tutor.

Piggy,

In a primary, can you suggest how a student gets feedback and discusses plans with their paired class teacher, if one of them has to be in front of the class at all times except for 90 minutes PPA 1x per week?

There isn't a miraculous 'other' who will teach the class while class teacher and student meet to discuss the lesson they just taught - so that necessarily has to be in non contact hours.

When I was doing my school placement we were told quite firmly at college that we get to school by 8.30 and don’t leave till the other teachers do. Normally about 4.15 or later.
Have a word with whoever is supervising her.

That is the job of the mentor in secondary. If you do all that, what does the mentor do?

No, I'm not but I work in a large school. In theory there is someone in charge of all the students. Then , each one, has a mentor, who should have protected free for meetings. This bit does not always come to pass in practice these days but I can't imagine anyone I work with thinking someone should 'have' to be at school beyond the end of the school day, even though lots of them do, by choice, stay behind.

And the student needs that conversation that day, after that lesson, so they can change the next one that they teach - not store up all feedback till the next timetabled non-contact, which might be 6 days away...

Your trainees must meet the teachers of their other classes too though Piggy. Outside of timetabled mentor time.

Piggy, in your school, who does the student discuss an observed lesson with - or even informally discusses it in a 'that went well, did you notice X was stuck - put them on your table tomorrow' way?

In a primary, that is ALWAYS the class teacher except for certain formal observations.