New series on the royals with Dimbleby

[MeNotMyselfAndI]

Anyone watching? Just watched Ep 2 on royal finances - it’s unbelievable. Greedy greedy fuckers! 🤬

Dukes (and other landowners) receive public money through generous subsidies and government policies for farming, forestry and more.
https://whoownsengland.org/2017/05/08/the-dukes-their-tax-breaks-an-8million-annual-subsidy/
The Duke of Westminster was (in)famously in the news recently for avoiding IHT.
Many wealthy families use trust funds to avoid IHT.
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/aug/11/inheritance-tax-why-the-new-duke-of-westminster-will-not-pay-billions

If I ever somehow became a millionaire Duke/land owner then I too could take advantage of these schemes. Plenty of people use trusts for IHT avoidance.

What I wouldn't be able to do is to exempt myself from any other taxes I didn't fancy. Do you see the difference?

The Duke of Westminster is always always thrown in as a way of excusing anything to do with the Monarchy.
It's tedious.

The Duke of Westminster was (in)famously in the news recently for avoiding IHT.

Ditto Jeremy Clarkson who went on record saying he only did his stupid farm to avoid IHT. Ditto James Dyson. He owns more land in the UK than the King personally.
I abhor this type of tax dodging but excusing the taxpayer funded Royals doesn't make it better

Repitition

Of course they do - I said that upthread 🤷‍♀️. And? Rich people avoiding tax isn’t new - doesn’t excuse the royals doing it. I’m baffled by your conclusion.

Exactly. They literally interfere with laws that allow them to pocket more and more money all while hiding it (royal wills are sealed, William doesn’t publish his tax dodging), it’s totally different.

I think the initial intention was to keep them at Balmoral to try and shield them from the blaze of publicity along with the rather odd caterwauling being indulged in by some of the peasantry which seems a reasonable call.

But yes, when she realised the tide of public opinion was turning against her personally she u-turned and had the whole circus trotted back down South.

Yep, absolutely. Incredible that so many people feel this is excusable behaviour 🤷‍♀️.

I for one didn’t realise that the income tax dodging was only introduced by Liz’s dad. 🤬

Dukes (and other landowners) receive public money through generous subsidies and government policies for farming, forestry and more.

They don't have their entire lifestyle subsidised and neither do they have an income propped up by the public purse and guaranteed never to reduce even if their profits fall.

Some may not have known before the Dimbleby piece that even the much vaunted taxpaying - which isn't the ancient thing they like to pretend but started with George VI - is done on a pureply voluntary basis, which is nice work if you can get it

Excellent point, Puzzled

Also worth noting they themselves decide what might qualify as a tax deductible business expense.

I think that was the indeed the original intention, but I can't for the life of me understand why she issued no statement explaining it. She could have defused a lot of the situation if she had, I think (and I think that keeping them in relative peace at Balmoral for as long as possible was a good call). A public statement to that effect might have protected her grandsons better than her efforts to be appearing to say nothing at all

On that occasion she took the "never complain, never explain" mantra too far and it came back to bite them all on the arse.

Balanced news is not going to happen. The Royal family have editing rights over footage used in news broadcasts and can cut out anything they deem unflattering of famiky members or negative about the institution.

Topsey I totally agree. She was initially trying to protect the young Princes but of course the papers were splashing awful headlines on the front of their papers. It was relentless and unpleasant.
If only she had crafted a heartfelt message about her first priority being the boys and protecting them, I'm sure the public would have understood. But then you had self righteous Tony Blair bleating on too. She caved in but she could have done so much better in my opinion.

For years, I have regarded the royals as an enjoyable soap opera at the same time as feeling more and more furious about their wealth and privilege, which is far in excess of anything enjoyed by other European monarchies except, perhaps, Spain. On balance, I would rather have them than not.

The Dimbleby programmes have shifted my thinking in two ways.

First, the preferential financial arrangements (the duchies, no IHT, loose rules about paying tax, exemption from FOI, tampering with any law they fancy, secret wills), are enabled by successive democratically elected governments, which through civil servants have colluded with the representatives of a family to steal from the British public. Instead of going into the public coffers, millions every year are staying with a few individuals so driven by venaluty that they seek additional funds outside the UK. We really should be shouting at the people who allow all this to happen, nt the royals themselves.

Second, suddenly, I see cold and mocking cynicism behind the modus operandi of the institution and its acolytes. The Duchy Originals brand is the prime example - a releatable brand that puts affordable luxury gilded by royal magic within reach of most people who want it, while raking in millions in rental from windfarms tethered in offshore land the Duchy of Cornwall has seized because they fancy it. In doing do, they add to the acres appropriated generations ago from the 'subjects' of their predecessors. The Duchy Originals brand is genius - a shop window disguising the turpitude behind it.

which is far in excess of anything enjoyed by other European monarchies except, perhaps, Spain. On balance, I would rather have them than not

Curious why you say this?

King Felipe VI of Spain has publicly declared a relatively modest personal fortune (around €2.6 million in 2022) from savings and investments, having renounced his inheritance, and relies on a smaller public stipend, making the Spanish royals significantly less wealthy and more transparent about personal finances

King Felipe renounced his inheritance from Juan Carlos because he had behaved appallingly and was exiled. It rocked Spain to its core. He has no property ownership and is thought to be the poorest European monarch. They have use of a Palace in Madrid and Zarzuela. The other homes he visits and stays in are managed by the Spanish National Heritage.

Charles is worth more than a billion so surely there is no comparison....

I think their vast security costs should be offset against the sovereign grant and there should be transparency around how much that all costs.

Did they come down on the Friday for the funeral the next day?

I should have been clearer. My understanding is that the sum spent to maintain the monarchy is similar in the UK and Spain.

Umm, no it isn't!

Spain £9million. UK £147 million (I know it's inflated because of Buck House repairs but it's still over £100M)
Spain receive £7.4M as part of the State budget and that has been frozen since 2018. Other government departments make it up to £9million

It's about time we compared costs with all the other European Royal houses ... the UK is way way more than any other one.

Clearly I have got hold of the wrong end of the stick. The Spain figure provides yet more ammunition that the British Royal family finances need radical reform.

Yes, Ida, and this is recent figures 😊

Britain £132.1 million (2025)
• Netherlands £46 million (2024)
• Norway £24 million (2022)
• Belgium £12.5 million (2021)
• Sweden £11.5 million (2021)
• Denmark £10.8 million (2022)
• Spain £7.4 million (2023)

Interesting to read that the Netherlands voted in 2024 to tax the previously untaxed monarch with 49% !!

Nothing will happen with Charles, let's see if William goes for change.

Great evidence. As well as these high maintenance costs, I want to see focus on other ways in which the Windsors are enriching themselves at our expense. I agree we will have to wait for William. If he doesn't act, the monarchy will be lost.

Yes. She should have done this. Its hardly as if she was out of the country. She was in Scotland! The press were desperately trying to deflect attention from themselves because they were being blamed for the pap car chase ( fairly, as the paps are there because they get paid by the press) and blamed the RF. TLQ could have come down to London and left the boys and Charles in Scotland. But as usual, the survival of the Monarchy has to take precedence over everything else so everyone was dragged down and two grieving children were forced to stand around looking at flowers and deal with strangers wailing and crying at them.

Personally I think nothing will change. Until questions can be tabled in parliament.

A start is the Public Accounts Committee questioning royal rents on Crown estate properties. Interestingly the chair of the Committee is an MP who is a true Royalist so it will be interesting...

Watch this space!

All those billions, and horses, and jewels, the paintings, and trust funds are no good when you're dead though. QE2 is dead, KC3 is next. What's the point of it all I often wonder. Power and influence I suppose. Oh look, there's Andrew hiding in Norfolk.

I suppose we'd all like them to be more philanthropical with the loot they got from us, paying it back if you like. Not bloody likely though! They just want to hoard more and get more.

This is reminiscent of a ponzi scheme. The Royal Family MLM.

The Duchy Originals brand is genius - a shop window disguising the turpitude behind it.

TBF Duchy originals was offloaded by C3 when it stopped turning him a profit. The label is now owned and operated by Waitrose. Some of the profit still goes to Prince's (now King's) Trust but I don't imagine Waitrose are taking on the risk out of the goodness of their heart and the brand presumably turns them a bob or two or they'd ditch it.

It's infuriating to note C is still both inextricably twinned with the brand and widely credited for donating all 'his' profits to charity and even more infuriating to note that he barely acknowledges an outside party running it far more successfully than he ever did.