Here we go … Andrew to leave Royal Lodge and lose title

[Flixon]

Headlined in The Times just now …. About bloody time …

Agree. The lengths that some people will go to. Andrew was a 40 year old man. Virginias brother was a child, but somehow it’s Virginias brothers fault and not the grown man’s. FFS. I hope these people with this attitude don’t have children themselves.

In the 80s many , if not most, of my workmates would rather have had Andrew as the next monarch than Charles. Especially the male ones. Randy Andy ? Good luck to him! Was a pilot in the Falklands War. Great stuff.

Sic transit gloria mundi I suppose.

Sometimes I read a MN post that leaves me utterly lost for words and not in a good way.

This is one of them.

Looks like Russell Kane would get on with some of us 😂.

Precisely and Beatrice is out there at the moment at some trade fair.
They’re going to have to carefully watch their steps from here on in, mud sticks.

who swan around the country followed by ridiculous royalist "well wishers"

I don't know why that made me laugh bit it did!

"Well wishers"! They don't need well wishes from the great unwashed! When you are swimming around in unbelievable wealth what do you need from us. Nothing. I find people who try and catch a glimpse of them really odd

It may be 2025, but there still remain so many people, men and women, who just can't or won't understand that it doesn't have to happen by surprise or with sheer brute force while the victim kicks and screams (loud enough to be heard by three men in the next village or whatever) for it to be non consensual.

Exactly. The amount of posts over the last few days about how Virginia was only "allegedly" a victim have been shocking. One even tried to suggest that she willingly slept with Andrew but had the ick afterwards and so tried to destroy him to make herself feel better. Now none of that crap is washing they're going after her siblings.

Even if she'd been grabbed off the street it's be "well her top/dress/skirt was a bit short/low cut" or "what did she expect walking alone at night".

2025. What a great time to be a woman.

One of the ways Epstein manipulated Virginia was by letting her know that he knew where her younger brother went to school. She was frightened her younger brother would be harmed.

This sort of thinking - blaming everyone but the predator - is obscene.

If 100 people work in a factory and the old man walks through it, i.e.the factory manager, do the employees behave with a certain amount of deference?

My brain's having a little debate about 'deference'.

I think that's respect rather than deference. To me the letter contains a bit of subservience, maybe?

The BBC news channel is about to do a Q&A on the whole Andrew situation shortly. If anyone is interested.

Yes absolutely. They don't have to be shackled in a basement to be trafficked

A big part is coercion and manipulation. Maxwell did that part extraordinarily well. She served up vulnerable young girls on a plate to Epstein

I find them odd too.

I am not talking about the articulate people on here who favour constitutional monarchy because they are unconvinced by the alternatives and genuinely feel it’s for the best. Or those who believe that there’s a financial benefit or a soft diplomacy upside.

I mean the people who drive for an hour to watch them walk from A to B. The people who arrive at places in the early hours with sleeping bags. The people who give the children selection boxes as if they’re family friends. They remind me of that woman who was caught using Taylor Swift’s shower. No harmful intent, I’m sure, and they’re not hurting anyone. Just a bit eccentric. And they tend to loathe Meghan and get so cross about any criticism of William or Kate.

On god I remember that, and was watching a documentary on Andrew yesterday. In one interview he starts making suggestive jokes to the female presenter and leans into being called Randy Andy and the crowd of mostly old women, find it hilarious and clap. And in another, there's a group of women on stage demonstrating a typical 80s workout in leotard and Andre is in the front seat of the audience clearly ogling. This is all good. Everyone loves him.

It really slammed home just how casual misogyny and sexual harassment was in the 80s. Ugh. I had forgotten.

Masculinity was really linked to perceived sexual prowess and brawn over brain. Charles was seen as a boring fuddy duddy intellectual, totally unexciting in comparison to Andrew.

@Flixon - new thread, please :)

@lunarlights1 not alleged at all, he was convicted.

So one standard for a Prince and another for a president?

Is it a hierarchy thing, Trump trumps Andrew? Abuse of power should apply to everyone. Totally double standards.

I felt physically sick watching Kate + William never mind KC and Camilla fawning over that salivating pedophile on his UK visit.

I feel sorry for all the victims of sexual abuse by men in the position of power. What message does that send to them when our own royal family and government pick and choose, who is shunned and punished and who is lauded over?

They catelogue all gifts received when on royal tours by people in the crowds - you can sometimes find them listed on the RF website.

It’d bizarre what some people give them - they get a lot of framed photos of themselves from previous visits but also things like handbags, clothes, pens etc,

How would you know that there's not a proposed alternative that "enough people agree on" unless of course there's a vote? Whilst I understand your point on ensuring that change is managed properly I don't see Brexit as a good parallel at all (one is an economic trading group whilst the other is an economic parasite). I'm talking about discussions around finding an alternative for the replacement of the monarchy and then voting on whether people want change or not, rather than voting on a crock of lies from a former conservative government. I would be interested to know what potential alternatives you have seen and why they are not suitable. The system of monarchy in this country is pathetic, archaic and broken. All I am saying is that having a system of hereditary power at the top of our political, military and religious institutions really does require some serious analysis, debate and change.

I do think this is a likely scenario. It also means that Beatrice and Eugenie would lose their HRH/princely titles as would Louise and James (who don't use them so no real loss there.)

This raises an interesting question: what titles might Bea and Eug have. If the York dukedom is removed officially by Parliament, then they are not entitled to Lady as daughters of a duke. Of course, William as King could give them the right to use those titles. Or he could exempt them altogether from the downsizing and they could continue to be princesses.

I can't belive that you are blaming VG's younger brother while claiming that Andrew was exploited and groomed.

Sky Roberts is also the name of VG's father, and her book says that he abused her.

If you believe other things that are in Andrew Lownie's book about Andrew, you may also believe he was abused from the age of 8 at school, and taken to a sex worker at 11. Most people would consider that to fall into exploiting/grooming or worse.

The Irish presidential system. There you go - there’s the alternative. Not difficult at all.

I see Princess Anne fairly often because she is patron of a charity near where I live (and by all accounts an excellent and involved one) but I don't think they particularly advertise when she's about so there are never any people hanging around hoping to spot her and I usually pass by her convoy. But once or twice we have exchanged waves my claim to fame!

The people who hang around Sandringham on Christmas morning utterly baffle me. Just why would you want to hang around for hours in the cold when you could be indoors eating chocolate.

Oops sorry quoted the wrong poster 😄