What about Beatrice & Eugenie?

[olderandnonthewiser]

I’m not sure what to think tbh. On one hand they must be so so mortified; on the other they enjoy all the perks of Royalty and their position in the RF despite their revolting father.

How do you see it?

I’ve a great deal of sympathy for them, fancy having Andrew as a father, any royal perks will be outweighed by his immorality. Hopefully they are as well grounded as they can be and leading fulfilling lives.

Obviously not! Given for instance Beatrice only yesterday was seen going to Royal Lodge obviously to support her parents. They are properly like the rest of the royals thinking he hasn't done much wrong and feeling sorry for him
I have no sympathy whatsoever

Now, of course, they have had what I assume is a sheltered upbringing but they have been to school university and are in the workplace. , you can't tell me, that they are so clueless as to not know what is going on in the world. They know what their father has been accused of, one of them was instrumental in organising the car crash interview.

I agree with this. What I am not so sure of is that, while they know what he has been accused of, as you say, I am not sure what they themselves believe. I am happy to accept that daughters may take longer than others to absorb and accept allegations - and they are his daughters, and, for all some others feel they could not love him, they will. Maybe not forever, let's wait and see where this goes.

But for now, I hardly see them as the people who need to be under the spotlight as they go through what they must be going through. I still care deeply about trafficked girls and see them as victims.

It’s up to them if they associate, cut off or continue with their parents, they have been dealt a bad lot being bought up by their parents and muddling through how they see fit. It must be hard to see the wood for the trees when your role models are so awful.

And that may be true.

Or it may not. She wasn't "obviously" going to support her parents.

It must be hard to see the wood for the trees when your role models are so awful.

We all struggle to believe the worst of those we have trusted. And perhaps in a way, we should up to a point.

No you’re right, she probably drove from the Cotswolds to borrow a cup of sugar.

Or to try to get the truth.

They haven’t been dealt a bad lot, they’ve benefited hugely from their parents’ scheming and dealing.

Well if they've had an easy run of things, I must staggeringly privileged in my lot then, because I would hate to have been dealt their lot.

ETA and what you are really saying underneath that statement is this a jealousy-driven attack.

Just wanted to share the thread I’ve started for anyone reading Virginia Guiffre’s memoir. I couldn’t see another one this morning, but no one seems to have found mine- I think my mistake was putting it in the “what we’re reading” area.

It is here for anyone interested: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/what_were_reading/5430914-thread-for-those-reading-nobodys-girl-by-virginia-giuffre?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share

But these are all things they’ve been in on from day one. Truth of what, they’ve been privy to all of the allegations up to now, it’s only us plebs that have had to wait for the Mail to tell us. They knew about the financial situation as they allegedly were benefiting, and they knew when they landed in New York to celebrate JE’s release from hellacious prison. The royal family is built on optics, only a moron in the family would not realise that turning up to the house after the weekend’s revelations looks like support. Why would B not support them? She’s a princess and a millionaire thanks to their dodgy deals and her grandparents trust fund.

I wouldn’t want their lives either. I believe you when you say that you don’t, but re B&E they benefit financially from all of this and they turn a blind eye. I would be disgusted if this were my parents, it doesn’t appear that they are mortified or sad about their lot, as they spend lots of time with them and accept the massive financial handouts and mix with their grubby friends.

I wouldn't want their lives because I wouldn't want parents like they have got but it's surely can't be all that bad.

They have rich husbands and can easily fly under the radar if they want

Can you get it moved over to the RF section?

Thank you for starting it and putting the link to the support organisations in. I was going to buy it but honestly didn't know if I could cope with reading the entire thing. Getting the details second hand is about the most I think I could manage. I think many women with abusive histories may potentially find it triggering.

Given for instance Beatrice only yesterday was seen going to Royal Lodge

That seemed like a complete dick move to me.

However given that his mum never stopped supporting him & seemingly his brother has only just started to act because he really has to, is it a surprise that his daughter hasn't cut contact with him?

THANKYOU for setting this up. I was struck by the fact that she took her own life 6 months after finishing the book. I suspect writing it was incredibly re-traumatising and she didn’t have significant professional emotional support in place to alleviate that. I think writing it would be a very different experience to her campaigning which was outward facing and productive to the extent she didn’t have to look too closely at her own wounds as she was in fight mode. I suspect writing the book from her perspective now as a mother of children that age must have been horrific. I am desperately sad that she was seemingly not supported in her re-trauma with devastating effects. I also wonder if there were people around her on her gravy train with their own self interest above her MH and ultimately life.

I think it was a very poor decision by Beatrice to visit her parents yesterday, which could only ever be construed as supportive of them. Maybe she's so privileged and shielded from reality that she can't believe her parents have done anything wrong. She's either stupid or she doesn't give a damn how her actions are interpreted (or both!).

Surely they could either get into that enormous house without anyone seeing, or given support over the phone? It was a very public gesture of support. She didnt look 'grim' or 'serious' at all. She was very relaxed and smiling away. They couldnt care less. I

Exactly! She could have been in the back of a 'delivery van' or a car with blacked out windows. Instead, she's up front and centre of her flashy Range Rover.

I do think everything the royals do are giving out a message and this was just another one.

Perhaps they are telling us to release them from the yoke of royalty by going full pro-republic?

That's my only rational interpretation of her (and their) actions.

Another totally irrational interpretation would be: 'I don't give a F about what you plebs think, I'm (we're) royal and we are going to carry on as usual.' Irrational because in the latter interpretation A doesn't connect to B, since our apathy will pretty much be the end of them and this sort of thing makes constitutional supporters like myself feel inclined to support the first interpretation.

It's all very transferral of energy and energy can neither be created or destroyed, but only transferred into another state or action.

I agree with you entirely.

Also just for the purposes of doubt in case it seems I'm singling B&E out unfairly, I judge anyone who continued to associate with Epstein after his conviction. Be they Trump, Peter Mandleson or the 9th and 10th in line to the throne.

There’s an article out now about how much B&E knew and why they have chosen to stand by their father.

These questions won’t go away. I’m afraid Andrew is taking his daughters down with him.

https://archive.ph/7f89j

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-15212433/AMANDA-PLATELL-awkward-questions-Beatrice-Eugenie-Andrew-saga.html

‘But King Charles and Prince William need a reality check: they must now go further and ban the princesses, as every time Beatrice and Eugenie appear in public they will again shine the spotlight on their family’s disgraceful legacy – and remind us that their father, still eighth in line to the throne, befriended a paedophile and then repeatedly lied about it.
And, though the King and William might disagree, it is unthinkable to me that the princesses should be invited to the royal Christmas at Sandringham and the traditional walkabout after attending the Church of St Mary Magdalene.
Harsh it may be, but I feel little sympathy for Beatrice and Eugenie, however innocent they may be. They should be self-aware enough to know that their presence at any royal event would be a disastrous distraction – and serves no one but themselves.
If, unlike their parents, they have a shred of decency and indeed care for the future of the Royal family, they could completely disappear from royal life and get on with their happy married lives and children and their successful businesses.
That would be the appropriate way to show respect for the enduring pain suffered by Epstein’s young victims.’

Slightly off topic but connectd because it is about royalty and what I see as the deeply bizarre relationship that much of the media and some of public have with the Windors. Our local news had a feature about Anne yesterday. The level of syrupy sychophancy was enough to induce toothache. She went to see a residential community for retired retail workers and it was reported as if Elvis and Jesus had both turned up with shots of "thrilled" and "overcome" people clapping, becuase they had seen "real life royalty" in their midst for what, all of a few hours at most. They interviewed one woman who the viewers were informed had been lucky enough to exchange a few words with Anne who told us she was "still shaking". It is bonkers, I do not understand it, I do not see the point of it, I think it infantilises us as a nation and has the capacity to deeply corrupt the likes of Andew and his ex wife.