The Yorks 2 !

[jeffgoldblum]

Sorry missed end of thread !
had a slight hiccup.
anyway thread 2 ready for tomorrows new article. 😁

Normal is a relative term here. William, his wife and children are living much more as an upper middle class family than either Charles or the late Queen did. They’re much more involved with their children, for a start. I’m sure he thinks that’s a healthier route to a well-adjusted life than the home tutors, narrow social life and remote parenting which previous royals have experienced.

Great post I agree with pretty much everything you said. And the marry-ins? The moment they step out of line, it’s open season. Just look at Anne Boleyn.

What also galls me is the infantilisation of the public, with the media pumping out fawning, nonsensical narratives about an über-privileged family who quite literally lord themselves over us.

And whilst Andrew and Sarah are off the scale of bad truly shameless we get occasional glimpses and flashes of behaviour from others that betray the same arrogance, the same untouchable fury, like it’s hardwired into them.
To the palace born, as it were.

And all this while the country struggles economically food banks up, wages stagnant, public services on their knees yet the royals are receiving more money than ever. No sign of “cutting their cloth.”
They kick things off with a £100 million coronation, then it's endless holidays, helicopters everywhere, and zero accountability.

There are far more intelligent and necessary debates to be had about democracy, about being active, participatory citizens, and about how we build a society that truly works and thrives for everyone, not just for those born into castles.
And as I learned today, our elected representatives are by tradition not even permitted to criticise the monarchy in the House of Commons. What kind of democracy silences its own Parliament when it comes to questioning inherited power?

BTW Andrew Lownie is going on Republic's You Tube channel in September to be interviewed by Graham Smith !

I wonder if Andrew's behaviour over money fed into the decision to deny Harry and Megan half in half out?

I don't think it did.

The fact his antics have been sealed for his protection until everyone currently interested have had their upcomings with the grim reaper suggests that.

We also have undeniable parallels with Anne's offspring being given free reign to line up their own morally questionable deals passing unquestioned.

I think a more pertinent question might be why Harold as a similarly falling star wasn't permitted the same licence.

He broke the rule of omertà - the Mafia doen't like a grass - particuraly if they smoke it as well.

I think a more pertinent question might be why Harold as a similarly falling star wasn't permitted the same licence.

Yes. I wonder whether any of this would have happened if TLQ has said Harry and Meghan would be in the same position as Anne's kids? They are cousins after all. No titles, but allowed to make their own money and still turn up to Royal events etc. Whats the difference? At least they would have had some control over them.

The press wouldn’t have held back about PA having affairs early in his marriage.

Unless you believe that the palace operates a system with the press where, in order to get access to royal events you shut up about what they want you to shut up about.

Which I do.

2 * review in the Telegraph.

https://archive.ph/nidA7

I believe he’ll trade some of the properties and money for a more low-key version of monarchy

I would put money on that not happening

I think a lot of people imagined Charles would do the same.

Ain't gonna happen. Charles didn't. William won't
I would be happy to eat my words. But I think they like it all far too much to make any changes

I bought Lownie's book on Kindle. It arrives August 14th. He was interviewed by Shauna on The Vintage Read about a month ago. I've read his books about Mountbatten and Edward VIII. From the Vintage Read interviews, this new book sounds very interesting.

In my experience, the salacious info is excerpted for the papers in the hopes of driving sales.

The Epstein situation is blowing up here. When he died, lots of conspiracy theories came up about his death. My personal belief is that Maxwell will do anything to reduce her sentence and have a safe cushy time in jail.

I've gone to school and worked with people who are from upper class, wealthy, privileged US families. The sense of entitlement is unbelievable. I've also worked with narcissists. A combo of both can be lethal. Look at RFK Jr. It's not just people in the RF.

And whilst Andrew and Sarah are off the scale of bad truly shameless we get occasional glimpses and flashes of behaviour from others that betray the same arrogance, the same untouchable fury, like it’s hardwired into them

Oh yes. They hide it well but it's there. Not on the scale of Andrew or Sarah but beneath the surface.

One of the things that puzzles me is why these women haven’t sold their stories ? The only woman I can recall talking about her antics with Andrew was Vicky Hodge back in the early 80s ( I think).

Well again , colour me naive but I think re cabbage throwing republicans - there has been sensible discussion on these threads . I usually preface my remarks in that I am largely in favour of a constitutional monarchy unless I can see something much better. To date , I , personally, haven't, but it doesn't mean there aren't reforms and scrutiny I would dearly love to see. But posts from eg @CathyorClaire or @CurlewKate ( not exclusively but as examples) I wouldn't describe as cabbage throwing and I hope they wouldn't categorise me as a rabid monarchist.

I have read by Andrew Lownie , The Traitor King (Edward VIII) , The Mountbattens , his book on Guy Burgess & he doesn't pull his punches when it comes to "The Establishment" & his footnotes as backup could make a slim volume in themselves. So based on that I trust him to have written a trustworthy book. Every who reads it must make up their own mind, as will I. I do think though that 3 excerpts "adapted for the DM" won't give a true flavour of the book and will concentrate on the more salacious and gossipy bits. It's a trailer & he wants to sell his books , obviously. But I'm OK with that - it's his living and if it gets some of the egregious behaviour more widely known - great. I suspect the book won't be as titillating and I expect more serious. But I've preordered it and am happy to report back when I've read it.

This seems to be a review of the Daily Mail articles, masquerading as a book review.

The Lownie book isn’t published yet and the Telegraph journalist doesn’t indicate that they have seen a copy.

What an odd piece.

I’d love to see some actual evidence of change CoffeeCantata. KC has very much maintained the status quo. He has been ill admittedly, but he had plenty of time to think about making significant changes as PoW and has the staff to carry them through. What has changed exactly since TLQ’s death?

Andrew learnt this behaviour from somewhere. He’s too thick to have be an innovator.

We’ve had it explained very clearly by Vera99. The top civil servants of what was then UKTI when PA was trade envoy, did not quick up a fuss, and low and behold received a shiny bong at the end of their tenure. And in turn, the Monarch’s influence is felt and wishes carried out. A nice mutual “I’ll scratch your back, if you scratch mine”.

MPs are discouraged from making any objections in Parliament. And many of them end up with a seat in the House of Lords,

This is how privilege is embedded at the heart of our society. A nice little earner it turns out to be too, None of them are sitting waiting to hear whether they qualify for a winter heating allowance I’ll bet!

Yes! I don’t understand that either! Many posters will disagree but I am beginning to think that Harold was quite right when he described the RF as toxic.

The poor naive sod, like a naughty child, made a calculated risk that one of them would actually care if he threatened to leave, and again when he actually left, but not one of them did.

It seems they do care very much though about maintaining the status quo, attendant trappings and separate fiefdoms.

Correction to post at 02.58 : kick up a fuss

Well, he flitted off to my country, expects us to pay his security, wants his titles used, has a visa under a cloud of suspicion, etc. If anyone wants privilege, it's him. He has more bathrooms in the Montecito Mansion than William has rooms in his house in Windsor.

Well now we all know where he learnt his behaviour!

Obviously Andrew and Fergie.

They’d have to have a back bone made of steel to face the fallout from it. Just why would you line yourself up to have this said about you by millions
“ well she was obviously a gold digger/trollop etc etc etc from the very start and she’s just proved it by selling her story/getting involved with him in the first place”

No woman who’s had any kind of relationship with Andrew is ever going to be considered anything but a ………. And who only have to look at Virginia to see that even when we knew what had happened to her she still was in the minds of millions a ……….

In my experience, the salacious info is excerpted for the papers in the hopes of driving sales

I agree. The heavy stuff will be in the book.

If people think it’s only the royal family who behave with entitlement ive got a bridge to sell you.

”The top civil servants of what was then UKTI when PA was trade envoy, did not quick up a fuss, and lo and behold received a shiny bong at the end of their tenure. And in turn, the Monarch’s influence is felt and wishes carried out. A nice mutual “I’ll scratch your back, if you scratch mine”.

I don’t want to lower the tone, but considering some of the dramatis personae, this has to be one of my favorite autocorrects ever!🤣

Should that be corrected to say "he has more bathrooms in his ONE Montecito mansion than William has rooms in his one of many houses he has"

William of course also has a Georgian mansion in Norfolk with 40 rooms, a 20 room Kensington Palace apartment, his Windsor house and of course there's talk of Fort Belvedere which none of us even knew existed and is actually a Castle with 59 acres and three cottages.

Comparisons are futile. We pay for William. Harry we dont.

Hear Hear

Gravy trains are all around us and one only has to look at the wealth British PM’s (and their families) have accumulated even in my living memory to know that a republican utopia is only a figment of many an imagination.

Tony Blair’s son first became a ‘self made’ millionaire at what age? Wasn’t it in his early 20’s and not long out of uni. I’m pretty sure I read that at the time.

Then there’s this

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/mar/14/tony-cherie-blair-property-empire-worth-estimated-27m-pounds

And I only mention the Blair’s because it was their antics that made me sit up and take notice.