C4 Dispatches on Duchies of Cornwall and Lancaster

[Babadookinthewardrobe]

I couldn’t find another thread on this. I watched this yesterday. I am so angry. The royal family are grim parasites funding their luxury lifestyle from the sweat of the British people. Via the duchies they are rinsing the NHS and charities for millions. It’s horrific. No IHT, no CGT, no transparency, no consideration for the environment of which they are supposed to be stewards in the duchies.

Their behaviour and greed is absolutely grim
and I am so sick of the lot of them. I’m joining republic, I’m so shocked at what I’ve just seen. The French had the right idea.

Ok, but then let them not stand there and talk to us about homelessness and inequality, in this country, whilst getting incrementally richer, with each passing day. It’s like being advised on how to use the best swimming technique by a person who actually has never learnt to swim, let alone who is never been in water.

Anyone that defends this behavior is either part of the royal family or totally gullible.

The cynical part of me wonders if William etc al knew this was going to come out and the homelessness schtick was hastily brought out first.

We've known the duchy finances have been murky for years but absolute kudos to the journos involved in investigating the extent of this nauseating scandal.

I'm shocked but not surprised to find the royals have found yet more ways to rip off the public purse while maintaining the fiction they cost the public peanuts.

I've said for years the duchies should be absorbed into the Crown Estate and the royals returned to a fixed Civil List debated in Parliament.

It's now provably way past time for this to be implemented.

So only people who have experienced homelessness can do anything about it?

I once got banned from MN without warning for saying that members of the RF should be imprisoned for their financial dealings, and had to beg to have my account restored.

So yeah, not saying much more on this apart from...the selfish venal arrogance has no place in the 21st century and it makes me ashamed to be part of this system.

It's been brought up many times over the years but for some reason hasn't resonated as it should have. TLQ demonstrably put the monarchy and its interests foremost over and over.

I have no idea why she is so revered.

From the Duchy of Cornwall website

*The Duchy of Cornwall estate is not a corporation and therefore not subject to Corporation tax. However, The Prince does pays income tax on the Duchy's surplus. If the Duchy also paid corporation tax, the Prince would effectively be taxed twice on the same income

What the fuck does this mean? Why is it exempt? It’s clearly a business. I run my own business. I pay business tax. If I take my income out of my company I have to pay income tax on it. So us normal people are taxed twice - why the fuck should Willy and his family be exempt? The government needs to legislate against this anomaly. This is ridiculous.

Just like anyone who runs a unincorporated business pays income tax rather than corporation tax.

Are they doing anything illegal? Are they paying the correct taxes?

I don't really see what they're doing wrong.

It’s problematic that Royals have neo capitalists running these enormous estates and swathes of British land. Neither are business brain of Britain and employ huge companies to do this job. The wealth of the BRF is obscene and as individuals they could mend a lot of cracks by making radical changes. As I understand they are only really figureheads for the ‘Crown’ and the although will continue to pass on within this family, hence the complications of inheritance and stewardship of these billions.

They are not doing anything wrong as in illegal.
This is about hypocrisy and not making real changes to support their country.

Although as regards the NHS, I doubt they'd be capable of finding a better deal. Not because it doesn't exist. But because they are useless at managing themselves.

Of course not. You don’t need to experience something directly to actually have empathy, to care for it. And I do recognise that the royal family do a great deal of good charity work. But the royals are getting continually richer, on top of their unearned immense privilege and wealth, whilst the average person in the UK is getting poorer. Being on top of the inequality pyramid, but equally talking about inequality, poverty and homelessness, does not synch somehow.

This! The system ( designed to allow the Monarch funded to live appropriately as Head of State) was devised in the reign of George III. Charles and William do not own the assetts of the Duchies. Nor do they have total discretion on how they are used or run. They are more like trust funds than inheritances.

The. sysyem.of funding the HoS is arguably ripe for reconsideration. But let's not forget all the other landed families (e.g. Duke of Westminster) who also coin it in and get away with paying minimal.taxes through the use of trust funds.

I believe the Duchy estates were created in the 1300s and have been run as a commercial enterprise since? The RF are the custodians

Strange then that at the Public Affairs Committee, the Keeper of the Purse for the Duchies, when questioned...calls them 'private estates'

But of course they change that to suit themselves. Private/Public/State owned... take your pick.

For anyone who has not watched the Dispatches programme, I would urge you to.... meanwhile here is a link of a Times article that covers it well.

I have archived it because it is behind a paywall. Warning, it is long but really really worth reading.

https://archive.ph/k2CGM

Are they doing anything illegal? Are they paying the correct taxes?

No. Their income from the duchies to each of them is £25M plus. Before Charles was King he paid tax on it... but it was 25%, below what us mere mortals pay.
Since he has become King, Charles and William have refused to disclose how much tax they have paid on their Duchy income. It coud be £3.50 for all we know.

Oh... and the Duchies are not paying Capital Gains Tax or Corporation tax.

I also thought the Duchy of Cornwall had passed to William?

I also thought that William now takes nothing from the Royal Purse as he has the Duchy of Cornwall to provide for him which was the same for Charles when he was Prince of Wales?

I find it utterly bizarre the sycophantic revery for a family leaching from the public to fund an obscene lifestyle

So do I. I just find them so so hypocritical. In the Dispatches programme, the hypocrisy is laid bare. Earthshot is brought up within that hypocrisy. You have to watch it to understand why.

Because she seemed to be absolved of more and more things for every year she stayed alive, and by the time she died had been firmly and ridiculously painted jnto 'sweet old lady, the nations granny' territory.

Absolutely despicable.

You’d lose the 45% income tax that Charles and now William pay on the profits it makes annually, in order to pay a lower tax corporation rate and have a whole heap more offsets. Fiscally, that would be a stupid move.

I also thought the Duchy of Cornwall had passed to William?

It has, @Purplebunnie; it's the Duchy of Lancaster which Charles "moved up" to, leaving Cornwall for William as the new Prince of Wales

As the article reminds us crown lands were supposed to have been ceded to the Treasury in return for the Civil List back in 1760, but that the Duchies were somehow missed out. It's said this is because they made so little back then that it was hardly worth considering - which certainly isn't the case any more - and the chances of tthis being revisited now the RF are coining so much from them is probably nil

The overall point though is that the RF will go right on gouging, just as they always have, knowing perfectly well that not enough care about all this for something to be done about it ... today it's all outrage and tomorrow it'll be "Ooooo didn't she look nice" or some other trivia, while they get on with the longer view

Before Charles was King he paid tax on it... but it was 25%, below what us mere mortals pay.

You’ll have to provide a source for that thanks. Because all HMRC has had to say not he topic is that “The arrangements for t[he Monarch and Prince of Wales] providing information and making payments follow normal self assessment rules”.

As a personal discounted tax rate would not follow normal self-assessment rues it would be useful to see why you believe this to be true?

Anyway, my personal view on this is that it is rinse and repeat by one organ of the media in order to whip up controversy sell more papers and generate lots of discussion. All good, as discussion can lead to change, which is presumably what many posting on this thread want? Given the political nature of the country, evolution rather than revolution seems more likely, and from a stability perspective, more desirable too.

Thanks for the clarification @Puzzledandpissedoff