To wonder if the allegations Harry has made against his brother might be true?

[pearlearringgirl]

We put the royal family on a pedestal, however they are a family with potential issues and dysfunction like a lot of families have.

I just find myself wondering if these allegations might have some truth behind them and what that might mean for the future of the royal family.

I also wonder what Dianna would think of this feud between her two boys. I expect she would be very sad…

Stop baiting. I didn't say anything of the sort.

Pardon?

I am not baiting. I am answering a post

You said..
"I also find it insulting and hurtful when families as a group are serially condemned as toxic"

I said I would never condemn the family unit but not everyone has it so easy. Also your post of 12.29 says this. Families are easy i.e. really not hard (your words)

Not for everyone. That is the only point I am making

I'm referring to the assertion...it's a common part of life, families are hard.

They're not by and large.

End of. Not complicated however much you attempt to make it.

My observation is that both H & M had seemingly longterm solid, respectful and loving relationships with each of their families before they got together (except maybe for MM half siblings?) - but that their relationship for whatever reason shifted dynamics in both families that didn’t adapt and eroded what was there before (except Doria).

I do hope that they can find their way back to each other - as it’s such a shame that their own children will miss out on cousins, aunts and grandparents.

@GloriousD Yes, meghan got on well with her parents and niece and harry got on well with his family, even Camilla, judging by his own words. I just can't fathom why it all went so horribly wrong when they met each other?

Lots of brothers fall out. It's hardly news. Harry likes to make a big thing about everything. I don't think.he ever got over losing his Mum. It's made him angry and bitter with everything in life.

I'm lost now. Are we now saying there's an abuser in the RF who is striking fear into Harry? Who is it?
That surprises me to be honest because Harry said that he really misses those big family get togethers with his relatives. So he didn't sound scared...

I think @Iwantcakeeveryday was talking about personal experience.

how sad that Harry misses family get togethers. Maybe he needs to throw down an olive branch (or even a whole olive tree) swallow his pride and go see his family rather than flying in and out immediately.

You replied to my post which talks about my family. You said 'family's aren't hard' which is obviously NOT true for everyone. I did not assert most families are toxic, but many are. You are the one trying to assert that all families are good and few people experience bad ones, its not true. Many people I know have difficult families too. I also did not say families as a group are toxic, you are twisting words and being insensitive to people who experienced a really hard childhood. My family I have made for myself is amazing, why the hell would I say or imply all famiy's are toxic. You should apologise for your insensitive remark.

The seeds for a rift between the princes were present long before M came on the scene. It's been quite complex. M just complicated things because H was so obsessed with her suffering the same fate as his mother with the press.

@Idontpostmuch What evidence do you have that the relationship between the brothers was poor before harry met Meghan. And I don't mean Spare as it's an unreliable source as harry himself says.

I'm lost now. Are we now saying there's an abuser in the RF who is striking fear into Harry? Who is it?
That surprises me to be honest because Harry said that he really misses those big family get togethers with his relatives. So he didn't sound scared...

No. That was a poster sharing something very sad and personal.

Do you mean Harry’s jealousy?

Presumably Harry’s jealousy didn’t just suddenly appear.
he’s probably been angry for a long time.
his temper is well known

the press office did a great job of promoting a solid relationship.

remember the interview the four did when Kate was pregnant? Harry couldn’t wait to jump in when they were asked about disagreements with “oh yes” said very dramatically.

After all the interviews/books etc and the discussions on these boards I still struggle understanding how a financially solvent adult with incredible contacts couldn't make his own way in life if he was so abused by his family and hated his life so much... until his wife came along and then actually the initial plan was to still be part of it all on a part time basis

Oh and now still turns up to family/firm events and insists everyone is still clear they are very much part of the family including annexing his children to the same family/institution

I am sorry to hear of posters situations with their own families but how given that do they explain this beyond he needs to make (more) money for a lifestyle that is hardly necessary or even logical given it keeps him in the same place he has stated was so miserable for him (public eye/media speculation)

As ever I have no time for the periphery things (I don't care about the bike little Archie got or if Harry missed the court due to his daughters birthday - we don't really know nor does it really matter) but intrinsically they things they have said and done vs the points they claim to be making just require extraordinary mental gymnastics

I don't think Harry's temper is well known, isn;t it William that has a temper? he always looks in a mood to me. As parents I think we can all understand that siblings fight and even just don't get along, and it can have nothing to do with jealousy. I do not think Harry is jealous of William at all, I don't think many people would be.

@TrashyPanda But the Fab Four 🤢 interview was after h and m were married. The assertion is they were fighting before he met Meghan which I don't believe was the case

No, it’s Harry.

scuffling on way out of nightclubs and having to be restrained, spurring on his polo pony till it’s sides were lacerated and bleeding.

Harrys own classification of himself as “spare and references to him having the smaller bedroom, William losing his resemblance to Diana etc show his jealousy very clearly.

As harry was the one who physically attacked a photographer I think it's fair to say he has a proven bad temper. Nothing concrete re William except Harry's word.

the one I am thinking of had a pregnant Kate, so it was definitely before the wedding. I think she had Louis a month or so before the wedding? She certainly got her figure back very quickly, cos she looked fabulous at the wedding.

It was the first I’d heard Harry speak like that. Almost gleeful. That’s why I remember it. Before when the three of them did engagements together, they always seem very comfortable in each others company, but there the atmosphere was markedly different.

Harrys own classification of himself as “spare and references to him having the smaller bedroom, William losing his resemblance to Diana etc show his jealousy very clearly.

No, I don't think so. He didn't;classify himself as the spare, others did. He's just telling you about his life. Being treated so incredibly differently to your only sibling would be criticised on Musmnet in any other situation, and the child treated as 'less than' doesn't have to be jealous to point out the unfair way they were treated. I have a friend who is the younger sister of two girls and we all saw growing up and even now, the older one is favoured in most things. The two of them are to this day exceptionally close, but my friend has pointed out the differences to her parents too.

These things show Harry’s clear jealousy, otherwise he wouldn’t be brining them up as a grown adult man approaching his forties. Very petty and childish

@clyspa Yes none of it makes sense. You are not happy in an institution that means constant intrusion into your privacy and relationships. Quite understandable. William has come to terms with it, has a wife and family and can negotiate a middle road.

So harry meets a woman he falls in love with and wants to leave the RF three ring circus. Again understandable. He wants privacy for himself and his family.

So they go to live in California and spend 2 years exposing everything possible about his private life. Not understandable

Ultimately he wanted one thing and his wife wanted something different. She wants the wealth and fame she'd been seeking all her adult life. That's it in a nutshell. Trying to square the circle and harry is the one who seems most unhappy while Meghan looks thrilled with the outcome.

@TrashyPanda I think as responding to this from idontpostmuch

The seeds for a rift between the princes were present long before M came on the scene. It's been quite complex. M just complicated things because H was so obsessed with her suffering the same fate as his mother with the press

Just saying there is no evidence there were problems pre Meghan. Could well have been jealousy but no actual evidence. The book was written after Meghan so inevitably there would be a spin.

An interview with William in 2004, here he also says they have disagreements:

""We're a very close family," William says. "There are disagreements, obviously, as all families do, and when there are, there are big disagreements, but when there's happy times, we have a really good time. It's just difficult getting all three of us in the same house at one time."

There's lots of interviews with little digs at Harry, like this:Have you been impressed by the start Prince Harry has made with his charity work?He's pinched all [the best ideas] of mine!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4026131.stm