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The royal family

Courtiers the release !

814 replies

jeffgoldblum · 05/10/2022 09:46

In preparation for the books release , and with permission from randompenguin , I thought it would be good to start this thread now !

OP posts:
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23
Coucous · 12/10/2022 06:28

@RandomPenguinHouse Please stop mentioning me - you seem to want to drive me and others from these boards. I have avoided you since you accused me of borderline racism on another post. Haranguing other people on different posts then crying victim is not for me. Your style of communication is not for me, that's why I have not mentioned you in my posts.

How have I allowed people to bully you? I am not MNHQ - I told you before I will not engage. Kindly stop mentioning me. Every single thread there's some sort huge argument over nothing. I don't want to be involved - do not drag me in. I don't know you, I am not interested.

Coucous · 12/10/2022 06:33

To accuse someone of racism because they said Meghan is doing well creating a platform for women to discuss these issues. Then boom - this is borderline racism and a good telling off for it. I mean - something isn't right here. I wish there was an ignore button. If you wanted people who post positively about Meghan driven off then you have succeeded. I have never seen such bullying of other women on a forum meant for women.

Please don't include me in your fights.

ShamedBySiri · 12/10/2022 06:35

Cloud9isnowclosed · 12/10/2022 06:06

This thread has taken a disturbing turn with bullying and feelings of suicide ideation- please delete it and speak to some of the posters off the bosrds

Why should the thread be closed? Isn't it better to delete certain posts.
It's so boring when these threads get derailed time after time and eventually deleted. I can only assume that is exactly the goal for some posters.

Serenster · 12/10/2022 06:38

It’s a shame the podcasts thread was deleted, though given it’s tone I am not remotely surprised to hear it was full of sock puppets.

Anyway, for the last couple of days I had been enjoying the posters all nodding along with Meghan on how awful it is to apply the label “crazy” and “hysterical” to denigrate women. While still on the very same thread talking about people who disagree with their opinions as “unhinged” to go along with the “frothing” and “obsessive” descriptors they favour. The irony, and obliviousness was very amusing. 🤣🤣

MrsMaxDeWinter · 12/10/2022 06:48

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

ShamedBySiri · 12/10/2022 06:55

I don't want to have a back and forth with anyone feeling fragile, but I really must push back on these absurd and unfair accusations.

Isn't it better to report such posts to MNHQ whilst ignoring such posts on the thread? Then others can continue to enjoy the thread without it getting derailed and eventually deleted.

debbrianna · 12/10/2022 07:04

Serenster · 12/10/2022 06:38

It’s a shame the podcasts thread was deleted, though given it’s tone I am not remotely surprised to hear it was full of sock puppets.

Anyway, for the last couple of days I had been enjoying the posters all nodding along with Meghan on how awful it is to apply the label “crazy” and “hysterical” to denigrate women. While still on the very same thread talking about people who disagree with their opinions as “unhinged” to go along with the “frothing” and “obsessive” descriptors they favour. The irony, and obliviousness was very amusing. 🤣🤣

I don't think someone like me is oblivious to why I like Meghan. I knew I would find out why the thread was deleted here. It's a shame, but I guess there is only one type of threads for Meghan allowed to stand. Have fun.

GlorianaCervixia · 12/10/2022 07:15

BACK ON TOPIC, there is a good interview with Valentine Low that discusses the content of the book including the blurred lines between courtier and friend and how the Newsnight interview with Andrew came about. Here:

I do think he tries to take a balanced approach here and in his book. He says he believes Harry and Meghan both behaved like bullies towards staff but perhaps in the end she did him a great kindness in showing him he could find a life outside the royal family because he was very unhappy.

LondonWolf · 12/10/2022 07:18

I don't think someone like me is oblivious to why I like Meghan. I knew I would find out why the thread was deleted here. It's a shame, but I guess there is only one type of threads for Meghan allowed to stand. Have fun.

Well the ones without sock puppetry for a start 🤷🏼‍♀️

MrsMaxDeWinter · 12/10/2022 07:24

Don't worry @debbrianna, once the dust is settled, I will start a new thread. I am more motivated than ever that those who want to do so should be able to talk on Mumsnet about what they like about Meghan without being hounded. I am not giving up.

Ohnonevermind · 12/10/2022 07:39

@MrsMaxDeWinter

I’d suggest perhaps make the new thread title narrow as other posters thought you wanted to discuss the archetypes podcast in your previous thread which wasn’t the case.

The topic raised in the latest podcast is too important, and it would be unforgivable to gaslight people opinions based on whether they like Meghan as a person and find she honest and trustworthy or not.

MrsMaxDeWinter · 12/10/2022 07:47

The thread was narrow enough @Ohnonevermind, as it said in the title and OP, it was for those who are enjoying the podcast.

It surprised me that people who say her voice irritates them, it is too syrupy, they can barely listen for two minutes etc wanted to participate because clearly, they were not enjoying the podcast, so why post?

The thread had many people, including me, who criticised aspects of the podcast while saying what they liked. A critical but fair discussion is not the same as posters saying they find her voice irritating, can barely listen, then wanting to post anyway just to get the boot in.

Kim Kardashian has a new podcast. I won't listen to it because she is a person I can't take seriously, and I also find true crime stories harrowing. What I won't do is to hunt down threads discussing Kim and her podcast and go on about why I am not a fan of hers.

Ohnonevermind · 12/10/2022 07:56

@MrsMaxDeWinter

Some posters decided on the deleted thread that people were not there ‘ in good faith’ and their contributions were to be ignored no matter how insightful they were , that came across as a mixture of bullying and gaslighting. I hope that wasn’t your intention, but it seemed to hurt other podcasters.

Again to allow posters on a important topic a voice based on whether they like Meghan seems exclusionary, and I don’t believe you’re that type of person

MrsMaxDeWinter · 12/10/2022 08:05

My basic position is that there are so many threads by people who don't like her, Why not have a space for those who do. Doesn't mean people can't be critical, but I have honestly been dismayed by the relentless negativity.

That said, I will definitely think on what you have said and mull over how best to phrase the new thread without excluding people who are fair minded, and who post in good faith.

I don't want to derail the thread further, as that interview looks interesting.

StormzyinaTCup · 12/10/2022 08:11

Don't worry @debbrianna, once the dust is settled, I will start a new thread. I am more motivated than ever that those who want to do so should be able to talk on Mumsnet about what they like about Meghan without being hounded. I am not giving up.

Ive been lurking on this thread as work has got in the way in recent days.

That’s fair enough but they are a couple who divide opinion so if you start a thread about the positives then you will get opinion on the negatives and vice versa and and any opinion can be challenged, it’s a discussion board. It’s not possible to police a public forum in such a way so as to have a lovely, snuggly echo chamber of likeminded people (and it makes for a pretty uninteresting thread). What is pretty bad form though is to decide that people aren’t playing with your toy thread in the way you had intended and you decide to try and take your toy thread away so no one can play. If you think anything breaks MN talk guidelines then report. There were some very interesting posts on the now deleted thread which gave a lot of food for thought and it was a shame that in the end it was was sockpuppeted to such an extent that MNHQ had to take it down.

debbrianna · 12/10/2022 08:16

Not, liking Meghan means we don't want to listen to constant rinse and recycle bile about Meghan but actually talk about the topics brought up in the podcast. Also, challenge some misunderstandings people may have or come up with regarding the issues. That's been virtually impossible. The thread just deleted has been the third one I have been on where posters have made sure it got deleted. The diva thread was vile too.

HaveYouSeenNancy · 12/10/2022 08:27

"But actually talk about the topics brought up in the podcast."

That's what RandomPenguinHouse attempted to do, and as a woman of Asian heritage (who I think had lived in America) then surely her opinion of that podcast was quite relevant.

If the thread is only for people to say Meghan and her podcasts are wonderful then it should probably say in the thread title that no criticism of either Meghan or any of her work will be tolerated.

MaulPerton · 12/10/2022 08:36

I think it's more than possible Charles will bail them out although a second scandal-avoiding payout of millions on behalf of deeply unpopular non-workings is unlikely to play well with the peasants

It's an interesting supposition if this is what has happened or will happen. In doing so, it's not only the peasants taxpayers whose opinion will be sidelined in favour of keeping H & M onside - the rest of the RF, and especially Kate, will be publicly revealed to be less important than H & M, as well as all the citizens of the Commonwealth who value the RF. That's quite a lot of people to annoy just to appease two individuals, family or not.

queenofarles · 12/10/2022 09:08

Why delete this thread? It was interesting till a couple of posters have migrated here.

LondonWolf · 12/10/2022 09:25

MaulPerton · 12/10/2022 08:36

I think it's more than possible Charles will bail them out although a second scandal-avoiding payout of millions on behalf of deeply unpopular non-workings is unlikely to play well with the peasants

It's an interesting supposition if this is what has happened or will happen. In doing so, it's not only the peasants taxpayers whose opinion will be sidelined in favour of keeping H & M onside - the rest of the RF, and especially Kate, will be publicly revealed to be less important than H & M, as well as all the citizens of the Commonwealth who value the RF. That's quite a lot of people to annoy just to appease two individuals, family or not.

As much as I dislike M&H I do think that if this happens then there is something the BRF really don't want to come out. As much as I want to support the BRF I do have have a sneaky suspicion that something is being covered up. Nothing criminal but something potentially extremely damaging. I think the silence and pandering shows M&H's moaning has been small beans up till now and KC et al know they have something up his sleeve that they want him to keep there. I really do want to be wrong though.

Dinoteeth · 12/10/2022 09:43

Actually the more I think about it, the less it think KC will have offered cash to stop the book.

It would be far too easy for H&M to spin a cash offer as 'the Monarch tried to bribe us'.
I'm thinking it's more been a quiet word, if you release this book then they'll be no way back either personally or professionally.

KC must be hurting at the way H&M have behaved, must be awful not to be able to trust your own kid.
Harry must be hurting that he's being lumped beside his Uncle, and once close relationships, with cousins have been destroyed.

The RF could with time rework the H&M image and have them back working. M would take more work than H.

MarshaMelrose · 12/10/2022 09:47

My basic position is that there are so many threads by people who don't like her, Why not have a space for those who do. Doesn't mean people can't be critical, but I have honestly been dismayed by the relentless negativity.

I understand when you like someone and others are critical, it makes you want to stand up for them more. I'm like that with Tom Cruise. I'm not keen on his scientology behaviour, but I'll overlook it if anyone is (to me, needessly) nasty about him. There's seems to be so many hardline critics and fans that those who think some positive and some negative things, get aggro from both sides. Personally, am supportive of some of their charity work, and them speaking at the UN, etc, but I did receive criticism when I looked into One Young World and was bemused by what the purpose of such a "charity" was other than to be a cash cow. It was taken as an attack on Meghan. (Even though it's now being looked at by the charity commission.)
I've said before that if people want a thread where they're just going to say positive things about Meghan, then posters with more negative takes should leave the thread alone. But equally, if there's a thread where you know people are going to be more critical, why do people who are offended by that keep posting on it, having a go at people? What do they hope to achieve? A change of mindset? Is that likely?

I've seen on here people posting both critical and positive things and the general attitude of the thread has been middle of the road. When posters then start to come on berating people for not supporting Meghan because she's a woman, the thread starts to veer off topic and, just Iike me and TC, it just raises the stakes as people take entrenched positions. Which is surely the opposite of what Meghan's admirers want?

Readinginthesun · 12/10/2022 10:08

Given that Harry doesn’t like Camilla and Meghan doesn’t like Catherine , I suspect that there will be unpleasant stuff about them and Charles and William would be very unhappy . however if Harry has had the reported huge advance , I cannot see the publishers being willing to scrap it .

Dinoteeth · 12/10/2022 10:17

If what he has written isn't good enough. And he wants to water it down further then that's the publishers risk of paying the advance.
It must happen all the time they pay money and then decide actually its shit and won't sell so we're aren't going to invest more money into it.

What are the other 3 books meant to be about? If they are all just about him I just can't work out how he'd fill them.

Croque · 12/10/2022 10:36

I'm really sorry to see Random leave the thread. She was probably the most interesting contributor on this thread. I completely agree with her regarding the covert bullying, lying and domineering.
Wrt sockpuppet accounts, some posters are probably better at escaping detection than others (which is why you may still see them posting on this thread). One could set one's watch by the chorus of fawning over every random comment -truly comical!
If you are well acquainted with a few writers and/or publishers then you can spot a rogue from a mile away especially when they start dishing out inaccurate 'advice'.

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