Danish Royal children of Prince Joaquin stripped of “Prince “ and “Princess titles

[Rainbowqueeen]

www.euronews.com/amp/2022/09/29/shocked-and-confused-denmarks-queen-strips-royal-titles-from-grandchildren

I thought this was interesting given the views that King a Charles has on slimming down the British RF. Wonder if he has discussed it with Daisy??

Before the Queen died Archie was entitled to be either Earl of Dumbarton (his father's secondary title) or simply Lord Archie - as the son of a Duke. Lili is entitled to Lady Lili as the daughter of a Duke.

Opinions seem divided at the moment whether as the grandchildren of the monarch, but born before he became King that they are automatically entitled to be Prince/Princess or whether Charles has to formally confirm it. Either way their parents released a statement after Archie's birth saying they didn't want him to use a title so I assume that stands for both kids now.

I think Charles should issue a new Letters Patent which restricts HRH/Prince/Princess titles to the children of the direct heir line. So only George's children etc etc.

Then children of Charlotte and Louis etc know where they stand from the start, they can still be styled as Lord/Lady etc and if needed step up into more formal roles but not expect to.

I'm not sure if it should be retroactive though - if you do that you'd have to apply it across the board and I don't think anyone wants to be the one to take Princess Anne's title away!

I'm not sure if it should be retroactive though - if you do that you'd have to apply it across the board and I don't think anyone wants to be the one to take Princess Anne's title away!

I doubt this is under serious consideration; I don't think he would want to remove Prince/Princess from children of a monarch, past, present, or future.

Archie and Lilibet are still listed as Master/Miss on the RF website; their style has not been updated as others have. So King Charles does need to clarify where things stand or issue new LPs. I think it most likely that he will restrict the titles to children of the monarch and children of the heir apparent of the monarch. The tricky part will be whether it would be prospective. The people most likely to lose current status are probably Beatrice and Eugenie.

Couldn't he make it clear that any such changes applied only to his own descendants?

Any changes like that won’t be retroactive- same as the fact that Anne is still behind Andrew and Edward in the line of succession since the primogeniture changes.

I don’t think Charles will make changes personally. Atm he has the upper hand - Archie and Lily are entitled to them but if they suddenly start using them then it looks like Harry and Meghan are cashing in on the queen’s death and makes a mockery of their stance about not needing titles or official roles.

If Charles does nothing then he neither wins nor loses face or popularity.
If he removes the titles then there is a risk that at some point he becomes (because we all know that poplarity is a fickle thing) thr king that removed the titles of some of his grandchildren because of their black mother.

Atm the risk is all Harry and Meghan’s.

william can bring his children up watching the changes in Sweden and Denmark and making clear that when he’s King what the expectation for his grandchildren will be.

Yes, he could do that. He could also make it entirely prospective, but ask that Beatrice and Eugenie (and Archie and Lilibet) use lesser titles. There is some precedent for that.

It’s a conundrum for sure that KC has.

Wouldn’t it also apply to Dukes of Gloucester & Kent & their siblings Alexandra & Michael? They are also grandchildren of a monarch. Seems unfair to remove their titles when they have been so supportive of the late Queen.

He’s absolutely not going to remove titles from the Queen’s cousins imo. Not a chance.

Especially when the Duke of Gloucester is still full time working, and the Duke of Kent and Princess Alexandra are still part time working.

I think the royal titles will remain for all who already hold them.

Going forward it's quite possible it will be only DC of a monarch and DGC (and DGGC) in the direct line only

May as well wait 20 years or so, and then, when William is king and his kids are of an age to marry and have children, he can change things up.

It will be interesting to see if Charles changes the rules.
In the case of the Wales', George is heir and Charlotte will be the Princess Royal so will Louis be the only one who loses his Prince status?

Louis is the son of the Princes of Wales so no.

The question is whether Louis' hypothetical future children will be Prince and Princess. Under current rules they would be once William is king, but Charles may change that. Watch this space!

Changes would likely apply to their children, rather than them. They’re both likely to be working royals given the lack of aunts and uncles - their parents and George won’t carry the load solo.

Also given the longevity of women in the royal line it’s not likely Princess Anne will die any time soon so Charlotte won’t be Princess Royal whilst young, if at all.

I doubt anyone who is already titled will have anything taken away so Louis is probably ok. Charles only has 3 grandkids with titles, compared to Margrethe's eight.

It's definitely not a given that Charlotte will be Princess Royal, even after Anne dies, although I think it is likely. Mary, Princess Royal died in 1965, and the Queen did not make Anne Princess Royal until 1987.

Charlotte won't automatically become Princess Royal.

I think a lot will depend on Anne’s longevity and how young/old George is when he marries.

There’s always a grace period between re-issuing a title like that so if George is already married, for example, it may not be reissued, instead saved for his eldest daughter.

Yes, it is quite possible that George will have a daughter by the time the title becomes available again.

The title is based on the practice of the French Royal Court calling the eldest unmarried daughter of the king Madame Royale. Henrietta Maria, wife of Charles I, was a French princess and she imported it. In France when a Madame Royale married, her next unmarried sister became Madame Royale so it was not usually a title for life. But in those days French princesses usually married a king or other foreign royal and acquired another title.

A statement by QM

Charlotte is likely.yl be the next Princess Royal. Usually the oldest daughter of the monarch. Can only be held by 1 currently Anne. By the time Anne has past William will either be on the throne or will be closely after making Charlotte likely to get the Princess Royal title..

Louis may get Duke of York?

Would Louis want Duke of York?

Louis is unlikely to be DoY imo. Andrew is only 62. It won’t be available, barring something unexpected, until Louis is in his 30’s. Far more likely to be kept for George’s children.

Charlotte being Princess Royal will also completely depend on how old she is when Anne dies. Given there’s likely to be a period of grace between one holder dying and granting it again then it may be more likely it’ll be kept for a daughter of George.

It’s one of the oldest titles in the British Royal family - George VI was Duke of York and the late Queen was Princess Elizabeth of York, so it would be nice if it wasn’t shelved due to the awful incumbent. But then again, Dukes of York traditionally haven’t fared too well, so may be it’s jinxed? 😉

Queen Margarethe sending a clear message to her second son and his children, there!

The trouble with dukedoms, unlike ‘prince’ and ‘princess’ titles is (in the UK anyway) they are inherited by sons and so don’t revert back to the crown until the male line is extinct.

And at some point, one would think, would be inheritable by daughters too (a very few are already).

I presume Duke of York is only inheritable in the male line, and so will revert back to the crown on Andrew’s death, but for William certainly if he bestows any dukedoms on Charlotte or Louis, he needs to assume that if they have children that title is ‘lost’ (ie used and passed down) for a very long time.

I would assume that in a translation from Danish? Are the Danes known for being a bit blunt? It's quite a statement from Queen Margarethe.

There's something rotten in the state of Denmark.

(Sorry, been desperate to use that line since this thread started)

I really hope Louis doesn't become Duke of York, maybe he could inherit Cambridge from his dad.