What were Harry and Meghan hoping to achieve?

[HumousWhereTheHeartIs]

This is an honest question not a chance to bash anyone. I'm curious about why Harry and Meghan would do this and what the consequences could be. They must have realised the massive fall-out this would cause. This could be the end of Harry's relationship with his family. But for what? Sympathy? Increased profiles? Honesty?

[quote Topmum66]@Cokie3 please stop this drivel that we can’t call a fellow female out or give out opinion on her without being misogynists.[/quote]
When women all but come out and suggest a woman is controlling a man and she is manipulative and the man is an 'easily mislead mere male', then NO, you bet I won't stop calling out internalised mysogyny for what it is; internalised misogyny.

Sorrynotsorry.

[quote Coronateachingagain]@Cokie3 are you on the payroll? (sorry I wondered)[/quote]
Are you on Kate or William's payroll?

(sorry, I just wondered)

@redspecial

within Justice Warby's recent ruling in favour of Meghan, was her claim that all emails and texts are deleted after 30 days due to palace protocol, so she couldn't comply with a request to supply evidence. This was at the heart of the case, because it would have shown if others had drafted the letter to her father.

this week Janina Gavankar (a friend of M) says there are "many emails and texts" which prove the RF knew M was struggling.

So which is it? are all emails deleted as claimed to a high court judge, or are they not?

The Scobie friend of M's said something about emails in the daily mail too over 'tight gate' rows before their wedding.

@ExtraordinaryQuince I agree. He is currently be used as a pawn in a very public family war.

Actually I agree with@Cokie3 on that point - Harry shouldn't be let off the hook in that way, he's equally responsible for their terrible behaviour.

@redspecial

within Justice Warby's recent ruling in favour of Meghan, was her claim that all emails and texts are deleted after 30 days due to palace protocol, so she couldn't comply with a request to supply evidence. This was at the heart of the case, because it would have shown if others had drafted the letter to her father.

this week Janina Gavankar (a friend of M) says there are "many emails and texts" which prove the RF knew M was struggling.

So which is it? are all emails deleted as claimed to a high court judge, or are they not?

Well thank goodness that the friends do not fall under the palace protocol.

@Cokie3 - when people accuse men of being abusive, controlling and manipulative - how do you view that?

Are you saying women cannot be abusive and controlling because they are female?

@ExtraordinaryQuince

Interestingly, although H&M think they are giving Archie a great life - hiking and on the back of his Dad's bike, that may not be Archie's overriding memory when he's old enough to have memories of his childhood. He may remember tension, arguments with the royal family etc, feeling worried that it is public that his skin colour was discussed. Harry is being very obtuse.

Also - what about Prince Charles's mental health - his father is very ill and has been in hospital for nearly a month. What about the Queen's, or K&W's - don't they count if we are paying so much attention to empathy?

I believe them, but I believe the royal family too - the two sides are not mutually exclusive.

Let's just wait till he is 18 and over and he will let us know, shall we?

He said ' I want to be able to go out with my son' as if he hadn't done anything at all with his parents. Obviously the palace gardens and what not and the photos of Harry on bikes was all fabricated then?

I used to work in Windsor when Harry was probably about 10 years old. He would be seen out having lunch in a local tea shop fairly regularly. He was with William and I presume his Nanny. The locals just let them get on with it and to be honest they blended in pretty well so most tourists didn't notice. It looked fun, normal and relaxed to me. Recollections are clearly varying a lot about a lot of things.

indeed @Impatiens. I doubt the MoJ would do anything. the press will probably let rip, if it turns out that she lied to a high court judge to win a ruling against them.

Why this stuff about lies? She may have kept a few emails. And the rest were deleted.

Hardly inconsistent. Unless you are predisposed to disbelieve her

My DH has been involved with the Princes Trust mentoring scheme.As far as he's concerned and those who are also part of the PT Charles has a huge interest and respect for other faith's and cultures.That's I need to know rather than he once fancied Sheila Ferguson.

That’s where we are at though with discussing race. We have arrived at the point where it doesn’t matter what you put about Charles ie. the people he was/is friends with (SF) and the work he has undertaken over the years for minority groups etc (PT) it’s met with ‘well that doesn’t mean you can’t be racist’.

You can only speak as you see/find, by people’s actions and the company they keep.

You can’t try and justify one persons evidently racist behaviour/actions (PH) as not racist or racist but but but... [insert excuse] but then the positive behaviours/actions/friendships of another person (PC) are met with ‘well it doesn’t mean they aren’t racist’ line, that’s just playing to suit the narrative.

How else then does a person show/prove they aren’t racist? The answer is they can’t so is it then to assume that without that proof to the contrary all white people by default are racist?

We are taking a massive step backwards if this can’t be discussed and discussion is shut down with the same one liner every time.

We are heading on back to the days of the 1970s otherwise.

@Cokie3 by that token and reasoning then you have been sexist by calling another woman sexist and misogynistic because she has an opinion contrary to yours.

@StormzyinaTCup yes

I am not predisposed to believe or disbelieve anyone. I'm not making this up to prove a point either way, I'm just pointing out something that Meghan has said to a judge, then contradicted (according to her friend).

@redspecial

I am not predisposed to believe or disbelieve anyone. I'm not making this up to prove a point either way, I'm just pointing out something that Meghan has said to a judge, then contradicted (according to her friend).

MM and her ‘friend’ are two different people entitled to two different views?

Again, MM may have a few emails she shared early on and lots that got deleted. What’s the contradiction?

My DH has been involved with the Princes Trust mentoring scheme.As far as he's concerned and those who are also part of the PT Charles has a huge interest and respect for other faith's and cultures.

He's been banging on about the positive aspects of multiculturalism for decades - perhaps more than any other public figure in the UK.

Ok I'll give it to him, as a youngster he wouldn't really have had pals from round the corner knocking the door 'Is Harry coming out to play?'
But then I'm sure he'll have had plenty of playdates and opportunities to play with other children, both privately and at school especially when he went to boarding school.

But to try and say he was deprived of thinks like bikes is just nonsense.

@StormzyinaTCup

Having a 'thing' about a black woman certainly doesn't prove you're not a racist!

Well it certainly appears, if we are looking at past behaviour, less likely Charles than his son who was partying around in a Nazi uniform for lols and calling someone a r.. head.

Harry went to Eton and would have mixed there.
Maybe not across wealth divides, but certainly culture and ethnicities.

Oh come on, the mixing would have been extremely limited.

Well, potentially so would uni.

It's not like you mix with hundreds of people really.

Sure there might be 200 students in a lecture hall. But honestly, you're going to mix with your house mates/dorm mates/team mates. Not making friends with all and sundry.

• MM and her ‘friend’ are two different people entitled to two different views?

Again, MM may have a few emails she shared early on and lots that got deleted. What’s the contradiction?*

Emails and texts aren't views or opinions, though the content might be.

Meghan via her lawyer has stated that palace emails are deleted after 30 days. Some communications were between Meghan and palace staff were relevant to her court case. She didn't say they didn't exist, she said they had to be deleted due to protocol which meant they couldn't be used in discovery. The lack of them influenced a judges ruling. Had it gone to trial, the staff would have been questioned about the content of the emails under oath but it didn't go that far.

But now, according to her friend, she has "lots of emails and texts" to prove the palace knew she was struggling. Either the 'friend' has made that up out of thin air, or Meghan has just thrown it out there that she has palace emails, or Meghan really does have palace emails thus contradicting what she told a judge that ALL emails and texts are deleted after 30 days.

I admit my concentration was slipping by that point, but I thought the bike ride comment referred to A being able to play freely on a beach with his parents in the way any ordinary family could, but would be hard for a UK royal prince.

I seem to recall lots of photos of Princess Di doing "normal" things with her two boys which were held up as examples of what a lovely hands-on down to earth mummy she was, as opposed to their father's hunting, fishing and shooting life style.

If so, that would belie PD's attempt to prove what a normal mum she was, since the photos would have been deliberate photo ops rather than them being caught out in a family moment by a pap.

Also doesn't sit with M and H's current massive exposure which will surely make it even more difficult for them to have private family time.

Why Harry would lie about his childhood when he knows there’s photo evidences?

Anyway, dating someone outside of your race doesn’t mean a thing to me. I mean, even Thomas Jefferson had a thing for Sally who he enslaved and he enslaved all their children too . But he didn’t fight for her and their children to be free. So I am not interested what PC’s *ick is interested in.

Lovely candid pictures in the press today of Prince Charles towing one of the princes in a bike trailer and also cycling with Prince William and Harry in a
child seat . Sad that Harry seems to have forgotten these . Also the a royal family are often at the beach in Norfolk, they have their own private beach hut in the dunes, may not be as warm or glamorous as California but it’s still the beach .

Why Harry would lie about his childhood when he knows there’s photo evidences?

It does seem like he's created quite a grievance narrative. Maybe he just doesn't remember the positive, normal things that clearly happened?

@redspecial

indeed *@Impatiens*. I doubt the MoJ would do anything. the press will probably let rip, if it turns out that she lied to a high court judge to win a ruling against them.

MoS, who brought the case, would have a stronger case for an appeal I expect?