It was “, 'a bit naughty' to imply Archie 'couldn't be a prince because of the possible colour of his skin' when it was due to strict rules,...”

[RickiTarr]

Hugo Vickers made me laugh with his phrasing. So British to say “a bit naughty”.

Also, seriously high lights how many people don’t understand the rules or can’t explain the rules well, and no American has a hope of grasping our quaint & complicated rules and institutions, really.

Sorry, it’s the Daily Fail, but funny.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9340545/Why-Meghan-Markle-bit-naughty-referring-Archies-skin-colour-prince-discussion.html

Sorry I forgot to add

And at the end of the day this is a family dispute/falling out played out on the world stage. Something lots of us will have experienced but obviously not in public.

Mummy195 they haven’t changed the rules, only hinted at it presumably. I suspect Charles will have to leave it up to H & M to decide now even though they aren’t even working royals or he will be accused of racism. Charles doesn’t want to end up like his mum, in her 90s and still having to deal with entitled Prince and princesses. Looks like he will now have at least 5 to deal with in his 90s.

It’s valuing people for who they are & I think the RF missed a trick.

But the job that MM wants (and appears to be pursuing outside the Royal Family) isn't available within the Royal Family. She correctly observed that she married a prince and lost her voice. That is the nature of being a member of the UK Royal Family.

ImAncient. What sad about this is that there is clearly no love from the Sussex's for the RF, and I would include the Queen in that, despite their protestations. Invading other people's privacy is not an act of affection, and neither was the parading of dirty laundry on a public stage.
Given their intense dislike of the Firm, I'm surprised they want to remain associated with the Royal Family in case they taint their brand. I am waiting for the repudiation of Harry' and their children's place in the succession and their Duke and Duchess titles.

The slimmed down monarchy would have included Harry and whoever he chose as a bride but not their kids. Otherwise it perpetuates what they are trying to slim down. So Charles children titled prince/princess, but only the DC of the next in line to the throne titled and so on. Prince George's kids will have prince/princess titles, but Charlotte and Louis' DC won't. If they did, when they start to have their own DC we could end up with a situation of 15+ princes and princesses when William is king, far more than there are now.

Princess Ann and Prince Edward's DC aren't princes and princesses, and they're the DC of the Queen herself.

For a couple who said they didn't care about the titles they're making an awfully big fuss about it. I'd say its a good thing if they name their DD Diana. Princess Diana is one hell of a name for this baby to live up to, she deserves to be her authentic self not have to fit into someone else's massive profile her whole life.

ImAncient
We have several mixed relationships in our family

Ditto, same here, and that means we (me and DH) are learning all the time and I really like that we are.

As far as MM and all that's gone on... I wonder if her being American can-do hit the ground running attitude has caused more of a problem. I can imagine (I don't know) that what the RF does moves at a snails pace and someone coming in and saying 'OK you've always done it like this doesn't mean you always have to do it like this' .... might not go down well with the courtiers or whatever.

What sad about this is that there is clearly no love from the Sussex's for the RF, and I would include the Queen in that, despite their protestations

You missed what Harry said about his grandmother then. I know you will dismiss it saying ... oh but why wash your dirty linen in public and you obviously don't mean what you said or you wouldn't have done that'
Maybe their position was intolerable. And the respect and love he showed he had for his Grandmother was genuine.

It's not clear to me why people are banging on about privacy. If the RF were not insidiously leaking stories, we would not be eat this point.

Ok, so H&M left and tbh, their statement was not too revealing. The palace then leaking all sorts of briefings, to make a big deal of their leaving and carrying on bashing them, when they should have left them alone, probably pushed them to the edge. They thought they could get away and be left alone, no hounding. That did not happen.

The same people who have been going on about holding H&M accountable because they are taxpayers, suddenly want privacy in this matter. You can't pick and choose remember, that is what you told H&M.

I didn't miss what Harry said about his grandmother - "despite their protestations". It's just all fluff.

Yes, they all go on tv and say how much they respect the Queen. Sarah Ferguson was the same. I can't remember if Diana said anything about her . but I recall that she did used to ask for help and it was all brushed under the carpet. She was clearly struggling a lot and ignored.

Harry had a great relationship with her. Maybe she could have advised him a lot more?
Maybe he should have gone to her with this alleged racist conversations and told her how he felt about it all? I would imagine he didn't.
He should have sorted a lot of this out long before all this happened. Sad really

respect and love he showed he had for his Grandmother was genuine if there was any genuine respect for his grandmother, (as his grandmother and as his monarch who he swore an oath to) he would not have done the hatchet job on his family & country chat show at all.

Well, the daily mail have gone on the attack over much of what was said and unsaid today. Debunking a lot of the issues raised.
This will not go away anytime soon

I don't understand why she contacted HR etc when she was feeling so low. Surely she'd talk to her DH first, before anyone else, and he'd organise help. or if it was as bad as claimed he would notice all was not well without her even needing to tell him?

It's very ironic that modernising the royal family seems to look a lot like continuing the tradition of creating titles like Prince Michael of Kent and Princess Alexandra. They may have many good qualities, but most British people would need google to explain their link to the Head of State and few would recognise them in a line up.

So many questions... sonPrincess Anne chose not to give her children titles, did that mean they didn’t get protection? Prince Andrew wanted his daughters to have titles so they got them. Not sure what the situation is with Prince Edward but don’t think his children have titles.

If there were strict rules brought into place in the meantime whereby only the direct heir’s children get titles then why wasn’t Harry made aware of this before he had any children? If the new rule was brought in only once Meghan was pregnant then that’s quite rightly appalling and quite possibly racist.

redspecial that's exactly what I posted would be said.

Very good article in the Times today by Trevor Phillips . Do read , despite the title in the link he is pretty even handed and most of all thoughtful .

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/meghan-and-harry-blew-the-chance-for-royal-renewal-xdhl3prs7

rouss sorry I didn't see your post. what did you say? was it a pre-emptive rubbishing

Megan’s whole argument of ‘the only reason’ she wanted Archie to be a Prince was so that he would have automatic security.. this has been proved time and time again to be incorrect.

The modernising of the Royal family is to save tax payer money, I can remember the press pulling apart all the ‘hangers on’ who didn’t really bring anything to the royal family on a national level.

I don't understand why she contacted HR etc when she was feeling so low.

I agree that it seems very odd that she didn't just call a doctor, particularly given everything that had been said about 'Heads Together'.

However, if just 10% of what you read about the Royal Family/see on the Crown is true, they are very odd. They seem to need to make appointments to see each other, and also use servants and secretaries to do very basic things. I can believe that doing something simple like making an appointment with a doctor would seem very difficult.

Just leaving the house seems fraught with all sorts of barriers. It's not difficult to understand how it would seem overwhelming. Remember the Duchess of Cambridge broke up with William at one point.

Tianatiers.1917 letters of patent. hardly a new thing. It's clear on allocation of title of prince/princess. What the Queen did in 2012 approx was equalise the children in the direct line so that a female child would not be ineligible for a title despite being the first born. There have clearly been moves to treat male and female children equally. eg prior to that, Princess Anne's children were not entitled to be Prince/Princess, despite being the grandchildren of the monarch because she was female.

red yep! I forecast what people would say in reply to me, and I was right!

However, if just 10% of what you read about the Royal Family/see on the Crown is true, they are very odd

Oh so true! And I haven't even watched The Crown!

I can't help feeling a lot of this is jealousy.
Harry wanted what his brother has got. A wife and family.
So much resentment there. I don't think that therapy did help Harry at all.
I feel that the conversation that had the word concern in it was before they got married. Why didn't he act then? Call people out over their prejudices?
Harry may have been aware that the protocol might change , but if it was only brought in when she became pregnant then that is something that would hurt and cause you to feel there was an ulterior motive.

'I don't understand why she contacted HR etc when she was feeling so low.'

Yes they have royal doctors to consult with privately. I doubt she contacted HR when her waters broke for example.

Maybe HR and the press comms could have influenced the media to go easy?