Beyond Adolescence - part 4

[SpanielsGalore]

Didn't realise we were that close to the end of part 3. 😂

Thank you @YorkshireFelix , that looks great! I'll order one straight away!
How is Vinny? I'm assuming he's turned two recently, because I think him & Bill weren't very much younger than Brie...

You could maybe have DP on loan @TheHungryHungryLandsharks but I would need him back, otherwise I'd have a house a bit like something off one of those hoarding programmes 😬He also bakes a pretty decent loaf, so he's fairly useful. And, more amazingly, it was him that found us this puppy 😁So he's in the good books at the moment.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Yes he turned 2 at the start of June!! Time has flown. He’s doing really well. We started working with a new trainer and he’s done amazing. I had pretty much stopped walking him off lead because he would just piss off and not listen to me and every walk felt sooo stressful, and now I’ve got him entirely off lead again and he will recall from anything no questions asked. I just walked him on the field here and there was loads of rabbits and he watched from afar and just stayed closed to me. He did take chase to a random one which was in the middle of the field but I whistle recalled him and he came straight away. A few months ago he’d have hoofed it across the field and be in the bushes going mad 🤣

Does little pup have a name yet?

It's great to hear that Vinny is doing so well @YorkshireFelix and that you've found a good trainer. It's an amazing feeling when the walks start being enjoyable rather than frustrating and stressful.

Puppy does have a name and it's another French one... I'll tell you it when I post a photo after we get him. Just because I think the name and the face are a really good fit with this little chap.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Oh there's been many a time that I have rewarded a very delayed recall, whilst calling the culprit a little shit in a sing song voice.
I tried to do a stop at a distance with K last night. Instead it was the fastest recall of her life. She looked so happy and pleased with herself racing towards me, I didn't have the heart not to give her a treat. I did tell her she was supposed to stand still though, so she'll know for next time. My gundog trainer would not have approved.

The dogs are not in the slightest bit helpful with gardening. I have a decent sized garden. Yet they have to dig/eat/sniff right where I am mowing or digging.

The hole digging is a bit depressing. It's becoming impossible to push the mower over parts of the grass. And there's been a few occasions where I have twisted my ankle, stepping into one.
Day one of freedom saw at least 8 new holes appear. It's not a stress thing. I think she just likes eating the roots. Then she comes inside with muddy paws and leaves prints all over the carpet. I've just had the dining room one replaced with the same as is in the kitchen. You wouldn't know they are the same. They are totally different colours.

@YorkshireFelix What is the secret to recalling away from chasing a rabbit? Asking for a friend.....

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Is new puppy related to Brie at all?

Lovely to have you back @CoubousAndTourmaIetSorry you’ve had such a hard summer! Like everyone else I’m so excited to see your new addition.

@TheHungryHungryLandsharksglad you’re having a lovely holiday. You would have thought a dog friendly holiday home would supply a decent hoover.

Speaking of vacuums.. I have a Shark pet one and honestly it’s amazing. I have never ‘loved’ a domestic appliance before, but I do love my Shark.

@YorkshireFelix recall off a rabbit is so impressive. Merry’s is a bit hit and miss still. I have recalled her from squirrels and ducks a couple of times, but sometimes she’s too far gone, so to speak.

@VanGoSunflowers Pablo is so handsome 😍

Not related to Brie, no @SpanielsGalore but he is coming from the same breeder that one of our previous girls was from 25+ years ago! So it's nice to reconnect with an old friend in the breed.

Thanks @Struckbylightning , it's nice to see you over here. You were still on puppy thread when I wandered off. I hope Merry is doing well.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet You can never have too many puppy photos!

@TheHungryHungryLandsharks Dog seems fine now. Was possibly a little quieter yesterday, but maybe I was overthinking it, and looking for symptoms!

@Struckbylightning i think you have been struck by lighting, if you profess to love a hoover!

@SpanielsGalore Could you reframe the holes as preparing your garden to put crocus bulbs in? Crocuses look lovely in Spring on a lawn. (Are crocuses bulbs safe with dogs?)

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Another French name? It’s a ‘he’ so I’m guessing Claude.

Recall of rabbit. Impressive! Not sure Dog has ever seen a rabbit.

Funnily enough @Silverbirchleaf , I used to have a cat named Claude, so no, it's not that.

I'm glad your boy seems better today.

7:30am today. A couple of fellow dog walkers were horrified on my behalf. I just fell about, I couldn't stop laughing. The absolute little horror. Look how pleased with himself he is!

Ahhh, classic Bill. That's made my day ❤

(Though I'm glad I didn't have to clean him up...😁)

@Bupster he kept his head nice and clean!

Nothing revolutionary re recall from rabbits etc. Just lots (and I mean LOTS) of boring recall repetitions using a flexi lead for weeks on end, and not allowing him to practice unwanted behaviour. We started very basic and worked our way up in more exciting environments. Honestly it sounds so simple but it really has worked. And I cannot tell you how much of a high prey drive/how much of a self employed shit he generally is! Our trainer looked at his pedigree and said no wonder we were struggling with him 🥲

One thing I am having trouble with is the stop whistle. 90% of the time he returns to me and sits rather than sits where he is. Apparently the way to fix it is with placeboard training but I honestly cba with it. We only have a small yard and I don’t want to lug a placeboard out somewhere to train with it.

@Bupster I bet he LOVED that. V did the same in a stinky bog up on the moors a few weeks ago and it was grim. It was the thickest mud I’ve ever seen. There’s a young cocker x lab I see being walked sometimes and she is the spitting image of Bill. I wonder if her personality is the same too 🤣

Instead of a place board, can’t you just use a small towel or mat?

Had agility today. Dog decided to stick his head in my bag and eat my post-training ginger biscuits I have in there. Must admit, the gingery crumbs on his snout afterwards did look cute.

@YorkshireFelix It's taken me ages to get any distance into a stop whistle. We can still only manage 15 metres or so. I chanced my arm the other night with a long distance one and got the best recall ever. 😂

Once K knew the long whistle meant 'sit', I was told to put her in a sit and walk away a short distance. Recall her. Then almost as soon as she starts moving, blow the stop whistle. The trainer said it's easier for them to stop before they have built up momentum. If she stopped, I had to throw a treat
to her, so she didn't think she had to come to me for food. If she didn't stop, I had to walk towards her and use a stern voice to tell her to sit where she was when I blew the whistle.
(This is where the language barrier came in. He actually said I had to 'give her a growl' and I thought he was a twat. It was only when I read a thread on MN, that I found out it was Scottish for speak sternly. 😂)
K's is still a work in progress. She can do it if she's pottering and within a shortish distance. Running towards me takes a few yards to stop. And if she's far away or running after a scent, forget it.

Well done for having the patience to work on the recall. I honestly couldn't be arsed with long lines and flexi leads for weeks on end, even though I know it's the right thing to do. All the books say never let them chase in the first place.
My dog trainer friend has working cockers. Her youngest was on a long line until he was 2 years old. And they never went to the woods, as she didn't want to set him up to fail. And that's why her dogs are well behaved and mine is racing 100 yards across the golf course after a seagull.

@Silverbirchleaf Haven't had a ginger biscuit in years. I fancy one or three now.

@Bupster Bless Bill. 😂 Does dirt drop off him when he's dry? Or was that a hose down in the garden job?

That’s the good thing about labs. Unless they get caked, mud drops off fairly easily,

@Silverbirchleaf that is an extremely obvious solution that I’ve never even thought of!!

@SpanielsGalore Yes I always say if I got another pup I would do things 100% differently. Honestly I think I would do a very good job of it now, knowing what I know. It’s so much harder to unpick the bad habits rather than not letting them do it in the first place. Although I say about not letting them rehearse unwanted behaviour - I’m currently letting him hump a blanket because someone is setting fireworks off and it’s keeping him distracted…

I’ll try your method with the stop whistle and give him a growl 🤣 I really want to nail it as my next thing I want to teach him is stopping to movement. He flushed a pheasant up on the moor last month and recalled like a champ but I’d love it if he sat as soon as the bird moved. I would feel like I’ve achieved something amazing with him.

@YorkshireFelix Glad to be of help!

It’s lovely when training goes well. Had agility this morning and it was a fun and productive lesson. My trainer is brilliant in unpicking a move, and pointing out how to improve, but in a constructive way. It’s amazing how stepping one foot back, or sideward, or not dropping your arm can make a difference.

Can’t remember who it was now, but how’s our flyball competitor doing?

Jeez @YorkshireFelix honest truth... We're about to get Pyrenean #9 and every single time I tell myself I'll do things 100% differently. You always have to think you can do it better and tell yourself "this time I'll get it right".

@SpanielsGalore Sad but true. I probably would have been the twat in that case and embarrassed myself by actually growling had the trainer said that to me 😳

@Silverbirchleaf My DP jokes to people that our dogs are Teflon coated because the mud never sticks.

@YorkshireFelix K flushed a rabbit a few weeks ago and didn't chase it. That's when I knew for sure there was something wrong with her. 😂

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I'm only on puppy number 4, so perhaps there is still some hope for me. I always think it would be nice to have a properly trained dog, but I'm just not dedicated enough. I like to have a relaxing wander through the woods, rather than have to be constantly on top of the dogs.
Mine have good recall around people and other dogs. Not so great around prey. They are friendly and sociable. K has a semblance of a stop to a whistle. And she will walk to heel off lead. They all walk fairly well on lead. That's enough for me.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I am sure I’ll be eating humble pie in a year or two when we decide to get another!! I forget how awful V was as a puppy and teenager 💀

If they give you what you need from them @SpanielsGalore that's all that matters. I'm not beating myself myself up over not doing enough training, but I know I messed up on the early socialisation with Brie and that's where I'll be putting the work in with the boy. That's what I mean by doing better. I know I'll never in a million years have an obedient dog with a reliable recall, but that's the nature of the beast when you choose a LGD. But as long as they can walk with a loose lead and have good manners at home, that's enough.

Help! I'm down the dog food rabbit hole yet again 😱

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Exactly! My dogs are well behaved enough for me. Maybe my bar is set low. After managing a reactive dog for 14 years, I'm just happy to have sociable dogs I can take out in public places without stressing.

I never left the dog food rabbit hole. 😂

P had pancreatitis again, so is back on the low fat Green Pantry food you found for me. As it's extortionately priced, it's mixed in with Wainwright's Plant and Insect based food to bring costs down.
K was on the same combo, but became lethargic. Google suggested it could be caused by a low fat diet, so I switched her to raw food. After two vet visits and £350, they diagnosed a phantom pregnancy. So once the raw food has all gone, she'll go back on the same food as P.
When N arrived in foster, I started her on James Wellbeloved. The rescue gave me a bag of Wainwright's for her. And last time we ran out, I couldn't be bothered to drive 20 miles to buy more, so I got her a bag of Harringtons from Tesco. She's been absolutely fine on all of them. No change in energy or coat. If anything, her poos are better on the cheapest one.

So I am going to try to stop stressing over it. I spent hours choosing Country Kibble for the cockers and, with hindsight, I don't think it suited either of them.

Was that any help? 😂

I agree I think you set your own expectations and what you’re happy with, and if that works for you then screw everyone else.

V needs a LOT of brain work to stay happy, he gets very destructive if he’s not ‘worked’ so he needs a level of training/breed-specific activity to keep us all from going insane. We’ve been so busy between work/restaurant/dd that his training slipped for a couple of weeks and he started scratching the living room walls out of frustration 😵‍💫 I do think he would definitely be better off in a proper working home but I am too attached to him now so I will live with the consequences of my actions 🤣

Yes, it was of help @SpanielsGalore because I've also gone around and around looking for "the best" food and learning that the best isn't always what it seems.

Tizwozliz got me started on Essential foods and it was great, until they changed the recipe, added turkey, upping the protein levels in the process (as well as a massive price hike), so the formula no longer suits Brie.
Millies Wolfheart is way too high in calcium for a giant and made her do horse size amounts of poo.
Almost all the other grain free foods are high in pea protein.

So she's still on Calibra Life Large Breed. On paper it's not the highest in meat, has no fancy veggies but for a LGD it's a balanced food with the correct ratios of protein and calcium and a decent size kibble piece for a bigger dog.
So that's where we ended up after trying umpteen "superfoods", she's on a basic lamb & rice not too dissimilar to the James Wellbeloved that we fed our trio of Pyries on 25 years ago.

Edited to add that new pup is being started on Royal Canin Giant Puppy and I'll keep him on that for the first few months then wean him over to the Calibra Life Junior. Or at least that's the plan at the moment...