Adolescent Dog Survival Thread - welcome to the teenage wasteland

[Bupster]

Buckled (under instruction 😄)

@LandSharksAnonymous Mine would have run through the middle and tripped everyone over. 😂

I've met quite a few GR round here and this was the first one that wasn't friendly. There was no lasting harm done. P is ridiculously submissive, so instantly squirmed on the ground and K squealed a bit and scrambled out of the way. But I called them away, changed direction and they were back to following scents.

@Bupster It's always nice to see someone else's dog is as bad as yours. 😂

Oh god it's so reassuring. I had a long chat to a colleague the other day and it turns out she has a lifetime's experience training and rescuing her chosen breed, but her current dog (that she's had from a puppy) is so insane that Bill sounded sensible, reasonable, and lovely by comparison. Which, in fairness, he does give a great impression of, right up until he doesn't.

Sounds like my experience of human offspring. Just when you think you've got it sussed, the demon child comes along. 😂

@SpanielsGalore I'm a bit envious that your pups are so resilient! Whenever twatdog has a bad experience it's day before he's back to his usual self. He does the 'freeze' thing, so too often people think he's okay when he's terrified!

We know a Spaniel that sounds a bit like P - rolls around on her back whenever she see's my group. But then she's often back to her feet seconds later, and barking happily and playing chase. I wonder if it's a small dog thing? They roll around and do the 'submissive' pose whilst twatdog can't because he's simply too big?

@LandSharksAnonymous That sounds like P, except for the barking.😂 She's the only one of mine who has done it. She's been incredibly good with communicating with other dogs from a very young age. The dogs I knew that didn't want to mix only had to look at her and she'd keep away. Shy, nervous dogs she will sit and look the other way and allow them to creep out from behind their owner's legs and sniff her whilst never looking at them. Then all the rest, she'll approach, sit or lie at a distance from them and then crawl towards on her stomach. Then once they've said hello, she's off again.
It's been a great help with socialising K, as if it was an unknown dog, I could send P in first to suss them out.

I got K from the same breeder, hoping for another like P. She isn't. 😂 She's very confident and not phased by anything. But she's a little lacking in social graces. Doesn't help that the other two have allowed her to walk all over them - literally and metaphorically.

Don't know if it's a size thing. I met a man a few weeks ago whose dog lay down at a distance like P and I thought it was being polite. But then he told me his dog was part collie and he was stalking her. 😂

Bill had spotless manners until he hit adolescence - his default was 'here's my belly, now can we play?'. He still has quite the way with the older lady - Pepe Le Pew here can persuade 11 year old half-blind pugs to do play bows and frolic. But when it comes to dogs his own size, especially males, his bollocks are in charge. He is by far the most socially competitive of any of his friends and by far the most easily aroused, to the highest level of nobhead - and he's awful with puppies; which I think is partly my fault, as he basically grew up with a handful of dogs his own age who were just as boisterous as him. He's also very resilient, recovers pretty much instantly from everything, even being nipped by a Daschund, or whacked on the nose by a cat.

He can still make lovely polite friendship overtures to ancient old boys, so there's that. I need to take him to some kind of OAP home for dogs. He'll be in heaven.

It's not just size. Brie is very passive. She lies on her belly and crawls to greet smaller dogs and sometimes rolls over for bigger ones.

Our PMD have always fitted the breed standard description "quietly confident" but none of them has ever shown dominance towards other dogs - even the two big boys. It's more indifference, certainly when they are adult. Brie is definitely more introverted like Sylvie & Finn. The others were all a bit more outgoing with people and dogs. None of them have ever barked away from home turf, which is quite weird I guess.

I actually quite like having a dog that's a bit aloof/indifferent - probably it's how I am. As long as I can trust them not to show aggression (which, thankfully, they never have) I don't think they necessarily need to love everybody or make friends with every dog. They do have a strong recognition of dogs they've met before and people they know. Algy recognised and enthusiastically greeted his breeder at a show when he was aged 2, and he hadn't seen her since he was 9 weeks old.

@Bupster Puppies are a whole different ball game though and unless you know people with dogs younger than yours, you can't really socialise/train for them. I know quite a few of the dogs on my walks are fine with other adults, but don't like annoying, OTT puppies. So K was kept away from them and was only allowed to greet dogs whose owners said were alright with puppies. She still got bollocked twice for being in their faces, but they were controlled telling offs that she deserved.

@CoubousAndTourmalet PMDs sound lovely. I wouldn't mind an aloof dog. One of my cocker spaniels used to be like that. Someone went to stroke him as he walked past once, and he did a big body swerve to avoid him. The pair I have now are too friendly in a way. They'd go off with anyone who called and offered them a biscuit.

They are lovely @SpanielsGalore but probably too big to be practical for most people.
For me the best thing is how calm they are around the house; as a highly anxious person I need that. I find them easy to live with.

We had a nice quiet, hour-long walk this evening. Just the usual circular route, but few people out.

@SpanielsGalore But she's a little lacking in social graces

😂I love how diplomatically you put it!

@CoubousAndTourmalet definitely a bit big for me (sadly), but I do love their personality, as you say I imagine it's very calming but I guess as a LGD they need to be calm and aloof. Whereas Spaniels and Goldies were bred to be a bit energetic.

I woke up this morning to find not only had twatdog had snuck his way into the whelping pen in the middle of the night but two of the pups had confused him for Pen. Bless him, I've never seen a dog look so terrified and yet so happy at the same time.

They are pretty low energy @LandSharksAnonymous and I daresay most of you with high energy gundogs might find a Pyrie a bit boring. But for me, as person with both physical and mental health conditions to deal with, they are perfect. They've always been able to do long walks when I'm able, but shorter walks when I'm not and they're content either way. I'm always here with them because the neuro/spinal stuff makes travel difficult, and for a PMD, home and family is everything, so it works well.

That is so sweet and funny about twatdog being an unintentional substitute mother. I presume that means Pen is okay about him being around the pups now.
What stage are they at, if you don't mind me asking - are they getting more mobile? And do you have any inkling yet as to which of the girls you might keep?

@CoubousAndTourmalet do they get SA? Or are they robust (for lack of a better word) enough that actually having a human around all day is just what they need and it doesn't impact behavioural issues? They do sound like the perfect dog for you though!

She seemed okay this morning! She's been allowing him a bit closer each day so I'm not surprised he chanced his luck (he's such a mother's boy). I think Pen's probably more relaxed now that the puppies can see and hear and are a bit mobile.

Most of them can walk (or toddle) along for a few steps or more now. But by this weekend it'll be a nightmare trying to wrangle them into submission - they develop really quickly once they can start walking! This week the 'real' work begins in the sense of encouraging them to come to me when I'm in the whelping pen, introducing them to new things (and people) and if I think they're ready...potentially beginning weening them onto puppy food later this week/early next week.

No idea yet which girl I'll keep! Their personalities haven't really developed yet. Right now they're walking, seeing, hearing, balls of fluff 😄

@LandSharksAnonymous Laughing at poor Twatdog, missing his Mummy and sneaking into the pen. Bless him. He sounds like a real character and just my kind of dog. 💖 I do love a dog with personality. 😂

How big is your whelping pen? I was imagining a little box like I see cocker spaniels in, but yours must be huge to fit two adults, 11 puppies and a human.

@LandSharksAnonymous ahh bless twatdog! That’s pretty cute! Which stage of puppy rearing do you find the most rewarding? Or is all of if hard/rewarding? I wouldn’t even know where to begin!

@CoubousAndTourmalet i love how well suited Brie is to you. PMDs sound absolutely made for you ❤️

Hope all are ok this morning! We’ve just come back from another little morning walk. I have been carrying a tube of puppy chicken paste in my
left hand to coax him in to walking nicely! He gets a tiny little lick whenever he is being good. Then it goes out of the window when he spots a human/dog/pigeon/empty bottles 😂
We go to an enclosed field about a 5 min walk away and you were all right, I didn’t need a training lead. In fact, I spend most of it trying not to let him trip me up 😂

Here’s the cheeky chap

Awww, thank you for the puppy update @LandSharksAnonymous Sounds as if the coming weeks will be exciting and exhausting.

In some ways I would have loved to have bred a litter or two. Rosie's breeder had actually given us consent and we were preparing to have her hip and elbow scored, but in the end we decided not to. My people skills are lacking, so finding homes and vetting people would have been a struggle. My partner was convinced that we'd have ended up living in our tiny terraced house with 11 or 12 PMD 😆

Pyreneans are notorious for SA, yes. Because the family becomes the flock and is under their protection. At the same time, they are very independent; they'll happily sleep in their own room from the first night, will very often choose to lie in a separate room or be outside. So they aren't a velcro dog in the same way as Bill is with @Bupster As long as you're somewhere around, nearby, they're fine - they like to know where you are but not be constantly with you. They don't like being left for long periods though and tend not to do well in boarding kennels etc because all LGD breeds are naturally wary of strangers and take time to develop trust.

It's all just the nature of the beast. I'm very bad about leaving them; past dogs would either go with us or stay at my parents house. Our emergency back up now is my cousins who live an hour away. As I said on the other thread, I couldn't leave Brie with a stranger, but that is, in part, because so few people can confidently handle a dog with this much power. That's not a brag - if you saw how tiny I am you'd understand that. It's about 90% technique with the giants and that only comes from experience and familiarity. They need firm but confident handling - you'll know that anyway from your larger Goldies, because even those are in a different league from a smaller dog when it comes to overall strength and power. But with LGD you also have the wariness of strangers to factor in, so it's just too risky to leave them with a person who doesn't know the dog or understand that.

@SpanielsGalore Oh I'm not in the pen! I sleep outside on my mattress 😁But it is big. It's about 8x8ft altogether - which is much bigger than recommend, but my DH (in his one useful act of carpentry) built it himself so I can section it off whilst the pups are small and then open up more of it as they grow. This morning was a bit of a tight fit - which is probably how twatdog ended up 'mothering' two of the pups. Sigh.

Oh twatdog is a lovely. All my girls are so independent and then he came along and just latched onto me. Makes my heart melt and I think 'oh you are perfect' and then he does something on a walk (as he did yesterday) and I just think 'Oh, why?' But I agree! Personality makes the dog. I would still love him without his quirks, but his quirks make him the dog I love (if that makes sense?)

@VanGoSunflowers All of it is hard tbh. But the most rewarding bit is honestly watching them grow in confidence. There's something really lovely about watching them run towards the 'new owners' when they first come to greet the puppies and thinking 'yes, I did well here.' So much effort goes into building their confidence and then seeing it in action is just lovely 😊

@CoubousAndTourmalet that's really interesting that they get SA but it's also different! My people skills are also very lacking and 'vetting' is the part I struggle with most as I often think I am totally unreasonable in my expectations, but then I really want them to go to the best home possible so it cancels out those feelings a bit. I know what you mean about leaving them though. I could probably leave my girls with a stranger...but not twatdog - but that is simply because of the power behind him!

@LandSharksAnonymous Oh I know you aren't sleeping in the whelping box. 😂 But you said you get in it and call them to you, which made me imagine it to be the size of a small room. Which to be fair, it is. 😁 Saw a house for sale once and the smallest bedroom was six foot square.
And it makes perfect sense about Twatdog. 💖
K was sold to me as the calm one of the litter. And to be fair, she was the one quietly playing with a toy, whilst the others clambered about. That calmness lasted for the car journey home and the first half an hour of being here. Then she turned into an absolute nutter, who rules the roost but makes me laugh every single day.

@SpanielsGalore Oops! You can tell who is sleep deprived. But yes, it is quite big - it's the biggest room in the house. So you can tell where my priorities are...

I bet you wouldn't change K for the world though! There's something oddly perfect about a dog who is equal parts nightmare and equal parts adorable goof-ball.❤

@LandSharksAnonymous Absolutely! I feel incredibly lucky to have been entrusted with her and I feel the breeder picked the perfect dog for me.
She's no trouble really, but a large part of that is probably because she has two other dogs to play with. If she was an only dog, I imagine she would be very high maintenance.
I say she lacks manners (because she does), but she fits in well here. She adapts her play style to suit the energy levels of my other dogs. With the four year old, it's full on wrestling. With the 10 year old, they both lie on the floor and play bitey face games. So she does have some acumen.

Won't retrieve for toffee, but you can't have everything in life. 😂

@VanGoSunflowers
Somebody has just started a new puppy thread.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/the_doghouse/5369191-summer-25-pups

But I hope you won't abandon us completely x

@VanGoSunflowers

This was 2 years ago for me, unfortunately pup doesn't walk so nicely on a lead now 😔

www.instagram.com/p/CuRgwiBtvLh/?igsh=cHgxa2E3dHBzZ3J1

Amazing.
Just gave you a few likes for your stunning photos.

@CoubousAndTourmalet thank you, I hadn’t seen that! I have just joined it ☺️ I do feel bad about derailing this thread so much, I just end up getting all excited about ‘firsts’ etc and need to let them - Im sure most of my friends are bored with puppy spam at this point 😂

@tizwozliz I love your pictures! Adorable and professional looking. Part of me thinks when he is walking nicely ‘is there much point in classing this as a win’ as it’ll probably all go out of the window when he gets more independent but I may as well start somewhere 😂