Going round and round trying to figure out best breed for us (family dog)...

[CityDweller]

... and I'm hoping for some advice!

We're hoping to get a dog in the next year. Family of four. DC currently 7 & 5. Live semi-rurally. Plenty of space indoor and out. Someone at home nearly all the time. First-time dog-owners. We also have chickens. DC would also like guinea pigs in the near future.

Every time I think I've found 'the right' breed, I then read something that puts me off or we meet a dog that makes me re-think.

Requirements are:

• loving, gentle and friendly
• will bond with all of us (i.e. not a 'one-person dog),
• not prone to jumping up (or can easily be trained out of it as a pup)
• not too 'mad' or zoomy around the house (beyond the puppy phase)
• characterful and a properly 'doggy' dog (i.e. not a greyhound!)
• medium/large in size
• ideally not too smelly/ sheddy (although will compromise on this if dog fits the bill in all other ways)

These are the breeds on my short list, but they all seem to have various drawbacks that are making me pause:
Irish terrier
Irish setter
Golden retriever
Cocker or Springer spaniel (working)
Standard poodle

I also really love the look and sound of Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retrievers (Tollers), but they seem impossible to find...

Any input on whether any of these breeds might suit us, or others worth considering, would be much appreciated!

I've always had working springers. They are fantastic family dogs, loving, friendly and cuddly but they do tend to bond with one person (in our house it's me) and they are velcro dogs. When I'm at home I often feel like I have ten legs, rather than two, as they follow me everywhere.

On the downside they are bouncy and zoomy, need loads of exercise, and oh boy do they shed!

They can have a strong prey drive - one of our previous ones would've been a disaster with guinea pigs and chickens, I shudder at the thought. They have what's known in gundog circles as 'soft mouths' which means they are bred to have a jaw which cannot bite down hard and doesn't lock, so they won't hurt a child, but a smaller animal could be fair game.

Lovely as they are, I'm not sure a working springer is the dog for you. A show springer might be suitable but I know little about them.

We had a setter growing up. Beautiful dog but a bit crazy and required quite a lot of work.
I rehomed a springer as an adult. She was such a sweet soul but prey drive was very strong and she could run for hours.
We had a lab when the kids were at home. Wonderful dog. Kids adored him and he was great with them. Ours was very bouncy until mature. Lots of hair too.
I've always felt retrievers were very similar to labs, certainly the ones I've met have been very bouncy when young.

Airedales are not a "first dog" bred at all. They need experienced owners as they can be very very naughty, they chew until the day they die, they use their intelligence to thwart any instruction you give them, and are very "bitey" long past puppyhood.
We are currently owned by our second dale - first was an escape artist - double padlocked gates needed in the garden, had absolutely no recall but was a huge character ( if you don't mind glasses, tv remotes, coats, handbags etc being chewed) and an incredible thief!. 2nd is pretty similar not quite such a chewer - only 5 pairs of glasses in 4 years!
You have to absolutely love this breed to have one.

Rough collies are still collies - bred to work all day long and need lots of exercise and grooming. If you wouldn't get a border collie, don't get a rough.

Have you thought about an airedale terrier op? Other than that - standard poodle as you've already got on your list. Brilliant dogs but super intelligent they need to be kept busy.
I can't see why you couldn't have Guinea pigs at the same time as a dog - just keep them apart.

Ok cross posted - forget airedales

Border terriers have a good rep.

Airdales have a reputation for being difficult

Our beautiful dog died suddenly in lockdown but she was a kelpie x lab. Absolutely perfect, very clever , easy to train , never approached other dogs , great off the lead , brilliant with children , even people that didn't like dogs liked her .

Bernese Mountain Dog. Laid back, excellent with kids and daft as a brush. Only issue may be coat length

You need a leonberger. High shedding but worth the extra hassle due to the temperament alone.

They will walk for miles, or not and are happy with a walk to the pub and sleep under the table instead. Calm and gentle, mine are therapy dogs and I’ve never know aggression from any of them. The breed society places temperament at the very top of importance unlike a lot of breeds.

Easy to train as very food motivated and reasonably intelligent but not too quick thinking that they need entertaining constantly. Love everybody and everything, mine have no prey drive whatsoever. One of them accidentally stood on a wild rabbit hiding in the grass last week and just kept walking
Don’t drool like the majority of the giants.
Mine don’t zoom or jump in the house but can zoom for 3 seconds in the garden before it’s time for a nap. They prefer pottering around to high intensity stuff but will chase a ball and swim.

I’ve had lots of dogs and nothing can beat a leo as a pet for all of the family. Downsides are obviously the hair and the constant attention if your not someone who wants to be stopped every time you go for a walk!

IME working gundog breeds, when brought up with chickens leave them alone. So that should not be an issue.

It's just that the working lines need a lot of training and to have their minds kept active. If you're up for that, a working springer might be a good bet.

Thanks so much for the suggestions. It’s so confusing though - cos one person will say one thing about a breed and another person the opposite!

A few quick thoughts. Rough collies were on the list but I’m worried about the level of hair/ fluff! I can be allergic to cats, and while I’ve not been allergic to any dog I’ve met or spent time with, I had read that rough collies are particularly bad for allergies?

Cavaliers - way too small/ lap dog like. Not for us.

Labs - yes I do take on board what you all say. But I just don’t feel it, sorry! I’ve just never been drawn to them and neither have the kids

Golden retriever - of the two dogs DC have spent a lot of time with this is one of the two that won their hearts, so it’s high on the list. I’ll put up the the hair. And the ones we know aren’t bouncy and don’t jump up at all.

Rescue. Yes that would be great, and I would ideally just like a ‘mutt’, but seems impossible given age of kids. Although a friend with similar aged DC just got a pup via a local place that rescues dogs from Greece and they adopt to families with primary-aged kids so I’m exploring that.

But plenty of others here I hadn’t thought of, so off to do some research! Thanks

We have an 18 month old working cocker and she’s lovely and affectionate, always pleased to see family and so playful.
However she’s a nightmare on lead as she wants to dive under every hedge and the sight of a bird sends her loopy. She’s pully (although getting better with training) and she’s strong.
The only place I dare let her off lead is the beach because there I can see her for miles if she takes off after a bird.

She has been known to be a bit growly with my ds. He’s 12 so knows to back off if she’s not in the mood.

She’s gorgeous and full of energy (although quite lazy around the house). She’s our first dog and hasn’t been as easy as I thought she’d be.
Oh and she costs a fortune in daycare as she hated being left alone. That’s improving now though and she can manage an hour or so.

Have you thought about a staffie? They really are the loveliest dogs, and ideal family pets.

• very gentle with children and they tend to love all people, rather than bonding with one
• super snuggly, great for kids to cuddle up with
• smart and food oriented, so pretty easy to train
• calm around the house, happy to potter around and snooze, and save the zoomies for outside
• playful, love tug of war and chasing, and our current staffie is amazing at scent games. But they won't pester you constantly to play if you're not in the mood.
• medium sized
• not smelly
• a bit sheddy, but short haired so you won't end up with clumps of fur everywhere
• will happily walk all day, but not bothered by a lazy day at home
• most staffies would be fine with chickens if brought up around them. My current staffie is very confused by chickens (it's the noise I think) but leaves them alone after a hard stare and a head tilt.

Downsides - selective deafness, especially if they've found something disgusting to eat/roll in. Pully on the lead if you let them. They have a reputation for being aggressive with dogs, but it's usually down to anxious owners and/or not being socialised well as a puppy. My current rescue staffie is a nightmare (we can't stay with my parents now because she tries to attack their collies and has to be crated the whole time we're there) but previous staffies I've got as puppies have lived with other dogs and been fine off lead with strange dogs as well.

Staffies are always being warmly recommended on here. Personally I just couldn't. I know they are said to be gentle but I can't get past that strong jaw and the fact that if they wanted to hurt you they could really hurt you. I couldn't ever have one with children. I know you can't trust any dog 100 per cent, but with children I wouldn't go near a staffie.

A book that may help you is Meet Your Dog by Kim Brophy kindle edition

Not the cheapest book on the market but it discusses dogs by types eg toy breeds, working breeds, bull breeds etc.

It explains the motor patters of the dogs and what you can expect living with each typf of dog.

Of course there will be exceptions but it does discuss the hard wired behaviours and reinforcers of the dogs.

Out of your list I'd say Golden Retriever and just buy the best hoover you can afford.

I can’t help much because we are only a few weeks into our dog journey with a beautiful golden retriever. Kids are already struggling with taking the puppy into the garden because they get anxious about everything that goes into pupsters mouth (rightly so in many instances), and my DS9 worries in particular about the interactions with our cats. DS9 also struggles a little with the biting. I think that our puppy isn’t too bad with biting at the moment but teeth are sharp, and the kids want the puppy to play with them, so they end up encouraging the biting. I think my main point is that with younger kids, you will very much be mediating their interactions, which isn’t necessarily a problem. Oh, and with our cats, guinea pigs and dog - my one regret is the guinea pigs. They poo and wee everywhere. I personally prefer rabbits (had them as a child), but mainly I am looking forward to the day we are back to just cats and the dog (although get a dog before cats if you ever consider them - it is apparently much easier that way round 😊).

Working cocker or springer 100%.
Ours gets an hour sprinting around a field a day and then sleeps and potters the rest of the day.
Weekends we do about 1.5 hours per day.
She's so so calm inside the house as long as she's been walked.
Her breeder breeds cockers and springers and says he doesn't believe in exercising them for hours and hours a day.
She will happily hike for 4 hours with us, but is 100% just as happy with an hour sprinting per day.
She even lies down in the field when she's had enough!

Goldendoodle hits all your points

St Bernard? Gentle dogs, fantastic with children.

I would also be inclined to consider a Leonberger too in your circumstances OP, as Leonberger has pointed out already. Like St Bernards they are lovely and gentle around children. Playful. Don't need oodles of exercise.

Lots of large breeds great with kids. DH also wants a Lab but we have a St Bernard puppy joining us in a few days. Maybe in a few years 😂

Pointer - English or German. We have english pointers and they're everything on your list.

St Bernard - beautiful dogs but the slobber. It will go on the ceilings, the cupboards, the floor, your face everywhere ......

@DramaAlpaca

Staffies are always being warmly recommended on here. Personally I just couldn't. I know they are said to be gentle but I can't get past that strong jaw and the fact that if they wanted to hurt you they could really hurt you. I couldn't ever have one with children. I know you can't trust any dog 100 per cent, but with children I wouldn't go near a staffie.

Yes, sorry, this is my instinct too. I just can’t get over the reputation. Although I do appreciate that they get a lot of love on here