Dog poo- at my wits end!!!!

[Doyouavocado]

I’m really hoping for some suggestions before I lose my mind.
We have 2 smallish breed dogs, 1 is 5 and the other is 16 months. The 16 month old just cannot get through the night without having the tiniest poo. 7 hours is usually the longest she can go do on days that we have had an early night or of weekends she will most definitely have had a poo.

We have tried everything- changing to Raw (which has helped massively)/feeding last meal earlier/feeding last meal later etc.

Currently she is raw with a big meal in the morning and a small meal at around 5 ( earlier if we are home) she is walked loads. In the day she is crated so never any accidents there. We have tried crating at night but she goes mental at around 4/5am and I just can’t cope with the noise (thin walls and neighbours) god knows how she can tell the difference between nigh and day as in the day she is fine crated.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I would just love more that anything to get up after a little lie in to no poo!! Never any issues with my other dog :( sorry for the long post.

How longs she crated in the day.
What other times does she need to poop - does she hold it longer than 7 hours during the day
Where is she sleeping at night? Does she always go in the same spot?
What breed is she?

Do you think it’s behavioural? Because she should be able to hold it 7 hours overnight by now. Or does she need to see a vet?

Can you change the last meal to much later? Almost right before she goes to bed?
Can you pen her up at night (so crate attached to pen) so she doesn’t want to poo in her own space
Are you using an enzyme cleaner where she goes? - try that if not.
Is she definitely being taken out enough before bed time?

I'd be wary of crating at all, it can create problems for when they are out of the crate. How long is she alone for during the day?

"walked loads"

When are you walking? You're saying she's unable to hold more then 7 hours, but are you counting from the time she went to bed or the time she last had a poo?

"crated during the day"
"god knows how she can tell the difference between nigh and day as in the day she is fine crated"
You make it sound like she's a teapot, packed away out of sight and in the dark when not needed.

Maybe you should explain her average doggy day (week and weekend) with a bit of detail added. We need more to go on.

How much time is your dog in a crate? If they are crated during the day, and at night they must be bored out of their tiny skulls.

Why are they crated in the day. Are they being left alone all day.

A dog that seems to be spending most of its life in a crate is bound to have behavioural problems.

Seems odd to me.

How long are they crated for in a 24h period? It sounds like a lot of time from your OP.

You say you've tried moving feeding times but have you tried taking her for a walk before bed so she has a chance to toilet?

Why are you crating your dog and how long for? Surely she’d be tired enough to come in from all these walks and sleep in her bed rather than needing to go into a crate. If the dog needs to go out at 4/5am, then get up with her and let her out to go to the loo and go back to bed.

I wouldn't listen to the criticism about crating your dog - this is a highly recommended, modern technique and is acceptable for up to 4 hours at a time (and longer during the night ).

Just because she’s said that DDog
Is fine crated for a long period in the day, it doesn’t mean she’s crated every day! 🙄

Presuming the dog is walked/seen to during the day, I’d give it a small breakfast, biggest meal at lunchtime and a light supper, late

I definitely wouldn’t be feeding at around 5pm.

I think moving meals around will probably do the trick tbh, but you need to keep
a diary and move all meals around, but trying each new thing for a period of time. I’d suggest 5 days if you can. It takes time to adjust!

Plus a decent walk in the evening to get lunch ‘moving’

Failing any of this working, woukd you consider a Puppy pad or litter tray and train it to use that?

Good luck, it’s not the end of the world (if
It’s in hard floor),- compared to elderly animals who have issues etc But it’s not a nice way to start the day!

Thank you for all of your responses.

@MasakaBuzz she isn’t crated at night- hence the reason the accidents happen. She is in the kitchen with our other dog.

@DogInATent what I mean by god knows how she can tell the difference is that there is never any issues with crying in the day time but she seems to know when it’s night time as she cry’s- even though it’s the same period of time.

She is alone 4 days out of 7. 2 of them days she is walked by our dog walker half way through the day. The other 2 days she is either alone in the crate for approx 7 hours or I will leave her in the kitchen but on them days she will have approx an hours walk/run beforehand and a walk after her evening meal, we have a dog cam so I can see that they mostly sleep about 5 of them hours. Again.. as she is crated in the day we do not want to crate her at night.

My older dog is not crated during any period, ideally I don’t want to crate at all. It is only because of the accidents.

I will be on maternity in 2 weeks for 9 months so this will change then.

@Nojeansplease
thqbk you for this response, very helpful. She is a French bulldog. The pen is a great idea, we will definitely try this.

I have already took her to the vets about this, they said no issues. It most likely is behavioural :(

We will also try feeding later too.

Some dogs it takes a long time to master toilet training in, our dog was still having the odd accident until she was two. Even now at three she will sometimes (very rarely) have a poo in the house while we’re at work. Are you giving her any treats or bones or anything before you leave her? They can upset my dog’s stomach and make her poo more frequently, she’s often woke us up in the night for a poo after having a ham bone before bed.

Also, how do you react when you discover she’s had a poo in the house? If you give her any attention because of it, positive or negative this could reinforce bad behaviour, it’s best to ignore I’ve found, same as when they wake you in the night, just let her out, clean up mess, no attention then go back to bed. I know it’s a stupid question, but do you have a routine where she goes to bed at a certain time and is let out for a wee and a poo before bed? Our dog is now in the habit or a morning we and poo at 8, wee and poo after work at half 5 and another wee and poo at 10 before bed. Dogs like routine and it can throw them off if it keeps changing.

Oh god, a 16 month old Frenchie left alone in a crate for 7 hours. No wonder the dog gets bored and needs attention during the night. Because attention is most likely what this is about.

It's really not recommended to leave any dog of any age alone for more than max 5 hours a day. They need contact, exercise and cuddles throughout the day.

She's crying because she wants your attention - and it's hardly surprising when you leave her alone in a crate for seven hours a day! Even with a dog walker coming in at times, that's still a long time for such a young dog to be left alone.

You won't solve the problem while you continue to leave her for such long periods of time. Dogs, especially young dogs, want your attention and time. Why did you get a puppy only to leave it at home alone all day?

You are leaving a young dog in a crate for 7 hours?
That’s absolutely disgusting

7 hrs in a crate is excessive, no wonder you’re having issues. When you go on leave, you should work at a good routine and stop with the crating for such long hours.

Poor dog, that's horrific. Dogs hate being left. Whatever their age.

Yep. 7 hours in a crate is cruel.
No wonder she can’t hold it all night. And wants attention too.

Have you tried feeding her evening meal later? (So that she digests it later and can hopefully hold her poo until the morning).

Also, echoing that 7 hours in a crate is far too long. Try a big pen instead or separating where she can be safely left (the kitchen?) with doors or baby gates.

I have a medium size dog flap which opens into our very secure garden. My dog opens the flap if she needs to go when I am not there and once she comes back in it automatically shuts. She hardly ever used it but it is very good at preventing accidents if she is unwell or just caught short.

@SwedishK
@adaline

As I previously said- she is alone for that amount of time maximum twice a week. Most of the time it is actually just once. Also I only started doing this once she reached 1, before this on them 2 days I used to drive home at lunch from work for a quick walk and toilet etc.

Also she doesn’t need attention in the night, it’s silent. I said when I have crated her in the past at night she cried in the night but AGAIN we do not crate at night.

Why did you get a puppy only to leave it at home alone all day-

Does this mean only retired people or people that don’t work can only get dogs ever? What a ridiculous statement. It’s 2 days a week Jesus Christ.

As I previously said- she is alone for that amount of time maximum twice a week. Most of the time it is actually just once. Also I only started doing this once she reached 1, before this on them 2 days I used to drive home at lunch from work for a quick walk and toilet etc.

It's still too long! You can't leave a young dog alone all day whether it's once a week or seven days a week. It's not fair - no wonder you're experiencing behavioural problems.

Does this mean only retired people or people that don’t work can only get dogs ever? What a ridiculous statement. It’s 2 days a week Jesus Christ.

I wouldn't get a puppy if I worked out of the house full-time and didn't have adequate arrangements in place, no. It's cruel.

Twice a week, once a week, once a month it’s still too much.
Makes me wonder what else you are doing wrong, even if it’s not deliberate given that you seem to have no issue with that

It’s too long.
Your dog doesn’t have a consistent routine. You’re not meeting her basic needs.
Get a walker or use daycare.
You can’t expect a dog to hold it all day and all night too.

I’m not a dog owner, so am definitely not an expert, but our neighbours who have a couple
of small dogs are usually out of the house all day, I see them take the dogs out in the morning for 30 mins or so, then the dog walker takes them out for 1.5-2 hours with her during the day at about 11am, then usually one of them arrives home at 4ish and takes them out again. If they’re not going to be back, the dog walker comes back again and takes the dogs out 4-6ish. So they're definitely not left for longer than 3ish hours and have free roam around the downstairs during this time too. I would have thought this is more normal practice and seems a lot better for the dogs than being crated for hours.

It’s 2 days a week Jesus Christ.

That’s loads! Can you yourself imagine being confined for 7 hours twice a week?

It’s easy to change though: get her out of the crate and into a larger, safe area and ask your dog walker to come for the other two days.

Too long op. And no not only people who don't work, but only people who if they do work, have someone else to see to the dog.