When does a dog become easy?

[Solo2]

Sorry - me again - with Rollo, golden retriever aged 10 months....and yes, a similar question to several past ones too but....

He's lovely. He's gorgeous. He's soppy and - massively demanding. My entire life revolves around his needs and some parts of every single day are just impossible - like from 4pm till 6pm when DCs back from school needing supper/HW support and Rollo needs maximum attention/play and another walk.

Just had to pay his lovely trainer for another 24 hrs respite as I'm still shatteringly tired. Not dog's fault - but my own busy lifestyle (solo mum running f/t business). At w/e, it was SO full on with him! Even after a massive 1.5 hr walk, he only napped for 45 mins and was rearing to go again just as I'd sat down to tea with my DCs.

If I don't attend to him when he's needy/bored/lively, he chews the doors/cupboard handles, snatches anything he can reach off surfaces or rushes round pushing a toy up against me, to 'make' me play with him. If all else fails, he whines v loudly or barks - especially if I confine him to the kitchen so we can eat a meal. If I let him be with us, I effectively have to supervise him ALL the time and can't leave him alone with the DCs.

I end up sititng on the kitchen floor with him, holding a nylabone for him to chew as he rests his lovely but terribly demanding furry self across my lap - or throw a ball for him up and down the room - not ideal, as he slips and slides on the wooden floor.

I walk him on lead from 6.40am till 7.15am but then he has to settle alone whilst i do school run and work till 11am. I play with/feed and toilet him from 11am till 12.00pm and then he again has to settle from 12.00pm till 2.00pm whilst I work. I walk him/run with him from 2.05pm till 2.45pm and then he has to settle again till 4pm when I'm home from school run.

So I can understand why he's really needy from 4pm onwards as he hasn't had hrs and hrs of input (although I know loads of other dogs who get a lot less exercise yet seem much more settled). But this is SUCH a busy time and w/es are even harder as the DCs are around but if he sees/ hears them, he doesn't even then do the settling for naps as he does on one of my working days.

So I'm pulled between dogwalks/play/training/toileting and DCs general needs and when everyone is resting/sitting down, that's my only time to catch up on jobs! I miss meals or eat on the go. I never sleep beyond 4.45am unless Rollo is having a sleepover with his trainer.

I am MASSIVELY relieved when he's not here - but realise it shouldn't be like this at all. At his trainers, he mooches with her other dogs, naps, never jumps up to surfaces or chews anything but nylabones (independently). Basically, she says he's incredibly easy. We've looked at why he's so different there and it may be cos she's got such a relaxed lifestyle and 3 other dogs to keep him company and can also do his main walk earlier in the day. Obviously, she's much more expert with dogs than I am too.

But please does this get any easier - or will it be this way at home till Rollo is an old man?

But things ARE improving! No need to give up on me What people have been saying IS making a difference. The first thing I've needed to change is worrying that I'm not doing nearly enough for Rollo and actually, most of you are saying that doing less and thus being less stressed will help us all, Rollo included - and I'm taking that message on board.

Please bear in mind that since my OP, Rollo has only been back home for 24 hrs - so barely time to put everything into practice! Anyway, right now, he's lying at my feet as i type on my laptop, having just eaten supper with my DCs. Whilst we ate, Rollo calmly lay in the kitchen. I've been less pressured about giving him v long walks today - so he had 25 mins on lead at 6.45am and an off lead run around/play/ chase at 2.15pm till 3pm.

I didn't meant to keep doing, "yes, but..." responses. I was just trying to clarify specific issues that I haven't known how to overcome. Every time I do a response, I find I've cross posted with someone else so then it looks as if I've not responded to a particular message BTW.

Great idea about the dog ramp. Currently, Rollo does the front paws on the boot thing and then I heave his back end up and into the car - thus getting covered in mud.

BTW, I personally LOVE walking Rollo, as i love countryside, nature and getting mucky. Thie issue for me is that I don't have enough time to be able to enjoy the walks and the DCs - who during the week, only do the 30 min evening on lead walk, dislike the walks. But there's loads i could enjoy personally about Rollo. As I said earlier, it's my life that's the problem - not him! But by posting on MN, it's like I get to see this highlighted - the negative aspects - and reflected back in cariacature. This makes it easier to realise I need to do something about this. It's really helpful. Off-loading it all helps too.

I am far from a lost cause! I appreciate everyone's feedback. No one can change overnight and we've only had Rollo back overnight - although I do realise that this isn't the first time I've posted along the same lines! I guess I just need reminding about de-stressing and becoming more chilled around Rollo.

then bit a stick

That really made me laugh!

Squirrels are my dog's weakness. She isn't, generally, a particularly "girly" dog, despite being technically female.

But squirrels reduce her to a squeaking, hysterical mess. She bounces around at the bottom of trees, making the sort of noises more suited to baby chicks. I like to imagine she's going "Oh, come down! Come down and "play"! I won't hurt you! I just want to play! Snapping your spine and making you dead is the absolute LAST thing on my mind! Oh PLEASE come and play!"

She will bound off into the woods and although I can't see her, I can track her progress. She disappears, then 30 seconds later her squeaking starts, then it stops, then starts up about 10 yards from where I heard it last

Scuttlebutter - having read the article you cited I think you may be mis-representing it. The author has not stated dogs are not pack animals - just they belong to a different type of pack (whereby the aim is not dominance) to the American Wolves. He also stresses the relationship between human and dog (and the need to please) which is exactly what we have being advising solo2 to work with. I do not think anyone has accused Rollo of trying to dominate the household. My scientific degree is also from Bristol university!!

I also think is wrong to state an owner that leaves their dog in the car is always irresponsible. With good judgement it is very possible to safely leave your dog in the car. I would never leave the dog when it is hot. Our car has blackened out windows and therefore the dog is not visible from outside as she sleeps in the footwell of the back seats. It also helps that we live in an area that people rarely lock there door (and certainly never lock there car - we do when the dog is in it) and crime levels are extremley low!

Solo2 so glad to hear Rollo was chilling in the kitchen during your meeting - but hope the doors are not too bad :) I think it is good you have xmas coming up - hopefully you can take a break from work (and the responsability) and spend some time just relaxing as a family (including Rollo). I too always wanted a dog as i was growing up - I got my first when i was in my 30s, and yes have like you have learnt over the years. I would not change my dogs for the world - I love them and they bring so much warmth and love to our home.

Best of luck over the next few weeks - breathe and REEEEELLLLLAAAAXXXXX

solo2 so glad things are improving. Hang in there

Yeay Solo I will happily say 'chillchillchillchill' whenever you need reminding (and ask for it right back when I get on my hamster-wheel of stress!).

I also think that using your dog trainer for occasional breaks is great - everyone is happy, it seems. Also, I remember your early posts with Rollo: however stressed you get now its a LOT less than then.

CalamityKate at the squeaking - I once had a dog that had a very silly 'bird bark' reserved for bouncing at the foot of a tree. Perhaps its a girl thang.

Oh my dog's got a "bird bark" too! We've got a long pole thing in the garden that the washing line's attached to, and pigeons sit on it and jeer at her, while she hops up and down at the base, shouting at them to go away. They know she can't get them, so they take no notice. The bark she does is definitely different to any of her other barks.

The shrill "Fourteen Year Old Girl At Take That Concert" squeaking, however, is reserved for squirrels only.

Hang in there Solo. Sounds like a good time to take stock of everything you have going on in your life. One of the things I try to do with Daisy is to really take note and be grateful when things are going well and she is just chilling, and to tell myself that those times are increasing.
A question for the very experienced dog people here. I have taken in a little maxim I think I read here, that there is no dog behaviour that is not improved by adding in more exercise. I suspect this belief is also shaping Solo's day. What I have seen in this thread is that it is possible to over exercise and over stimulate and that dogs need to learn to chill out. I think this is going to change things for me. Is it true that more and more exercise, does not always help?

Saffron, I'm not a very experienced person - only on my third rescue dog - but IME yes, there can be too much exercise. And more accurately perhaps, too much stimulation. There have been times when I've expected Mouse to sleep like a log all day because he's had such a busy morning, and he's hyper - just like my youngest dd at the end of term

OTOH, one day this week I could only manage a shorter walk in the afternoon, and he met none of his friends (rare) and I expected a bouncy pup - I had a chilled, normal one

I have more experience with kids than dogs, but they seem much of a muchness to me!

I again am veyr far from an experienced owner, what I find is most days we have a reasonable amount of excercise, so on the odd day when we have a 30min trot round the park the dogs are still happy.

I am really suprised that despite 5 pages of very helpful advice no one has pointed out that over 2.5hours of walks per day at ten months (and previously younger if this has been going on a while) will absolutely knacker your poor dogs joints! (in addition to all the info on overstimulation) He should be having in the region of 50min... as a guide a little over won't... hurt but 2.5hours for a puppy is ridiculous.....

We have two labs, now 4 and 5months. They get about 25 min together off lead running in the morning and then a poutle on lead around the block later- 5 min for the puppy and about 15min for the adult. As the puppy gets older the morning walk will increase again to approx 45min to 1hr.

This puppy is very chilled out and happy to settle quietly at home. Our first lab was much more hyper and found it really difficult to settle, so i do sympathise. I found that in the evening if i wanted him to chill out i put him on the lead, sat him next to me with a chew and then stood on the end lead so he had to lie down and sit still- couldn't charge around the house making chaos. He was ignored if he got up and tried to go. WHen he sat/lay down quietly he got praise and strokes. It didn't take long for him to work out what was expected. it was pointless to try to cause chaos as he couldn't get anywhere so it was easier to just lie down and be made a fuss off.

*the elder one is 4 years (well in less than a month!) to clarify, just incase anyone was reading it as 4m...

Principality trust me on all the previous threads this has been said again and again!

5 mins exercise per month of age twice a day

I'm sure I read on here a post by a vet (Jooly?) who had been to a seminar by a veterinary orthapedic surgeon who basically said the "5 mins exercise per month of life" thing is rubbish.

Is that 5 mins exercise per month times two effectively then? So our 10.5 month old Rollo should be getting 100 mins roughly per day - which would be about what he gets - ie about 25 to 30 mins in the morning, 45 mins in the afternoon and about 25 to 30 mins in the evening?

Hope I've got that right?

He doesn't get a 1.5 hr middle of the day walk every single day. In my OP, I was just commenting on an extra long w/e walk of 1.5hrs after which he hardly seemed at all tired!

Not sure where the 2.5 hrs walking comes from, unless I was saying this on a previous thread, in which case, I would have been including the time taken to drive to the dog walk areas for off lead walks.

However, I'm also sure that I've seen the following two ideas mooted on MN too - that the 5 mins per month of life isn't proven and that a well exercised dog is less trouble. Taking these two ideas, I've probably then added to my own guilt about not doing enough with Rollo.

However, I reiterate that I'm now able to see that I'm doing too much with Rollo and can relax more and that he'll even be happier than he already is. Day 2 since Rollo returned, after my OP and we're having another more relaxed day.

Well done Solo2 - you have a lot on your plate, but I think if you carry on relaxing a bit more and this reduces Rollos stress - he will be the delightful addition to your family you dreamt of :0)

I've followed all your threads about Rollo, solo and, if I can say this without sounding patronising, I think you've made enormous progress.
The icky tummy aside (and that was a massive challenge for you, which you coped with admirably), the most telling thing is that he's always a dream at the breeder's. That means you've got yourself a fabulous dog there, and you just need to lighten up a bit so you can have a bit of what she's seeing.

Happy Christmas and good luck.

hey Solo - reading this thread and considering a lab/lab cross for our family. I must say that this has scared me to death! how are things going now? I do hope that you are enjoying your dog now. He sounds quite lovely :-) :-)

Update on Rollo for those interested....Have applied lots of what people have recommended and also what trainer has recommended. Am about to change my working day so I can do a long off lead morning walk from 8.15am, rather than a short one at 6.45am - so won't have to get up at 5am every day. Then plan to work from 10am till 2.00pm, do his second walk then for 45 mins and then no further walks.

Can't do this for another couple of weeks but getting there. DCs happy we no longer do a late night walk - just toilet Rollo across the road on a grassy area. Rollo puts himself to bed at 7.45pm often, into his crate and stays there till I wake him at 6am (still having to do this for another 2 weeks). He is SO not a morning person but if I don't walk him then, he doesn't get a walk till 2pm. Hopefully, an 8.15am walk - off lead - will be much more enjoyable for him.

He doesn't bark in his crate but still barks sometimes whilst I'm working before his main afternoon walk and has eaten more of the kitchen door! The morning off lead walk should sort this too, I hope.

He's now becoming what I'd call a regular, normal dog - mooching around us and lying at our feet or resting his head on knees. He's now only on quarter of a tablet once a day (for his tummy problems) and I'm weaning him off these over the next few weeks. I'm also beginning to reduce his lunchtime feed, adding it to the morning and evening one, with a view to feeding him only twice a day (had to persist with lots of small meals cos of his tummy trouble). So far, no further diarrhoea. Happily wears a muzzle when out and about. Great with people and other dogs.

I can see more light at the end of the tunnel and if the work changes are sustainable, think this'll help.

I can no longer recommned to anyone I meet to get a puppy! I still adore puppies but the reality has been so difficult for me that I can now see huge advantages of getting a full grown dog instead. Rollo is almost one year old now (at the end of this month). He looked adorable when we brought him home at 7 months but it's only now that he 'acts' in a way that it makes him easy to adore! It's taken this long for him to mature, get over his stomach problems and start to be manageable (obviously, a lot of the problem has been my lifestyle and not Rollo).

Anyway, wanted to feedback that I think we're really getting there now

I'm so pleased to hear this! I hope the work changes in a couple of weeks make things even better. Well done Solo2!

Glad to hear this!

You brought him home at 7 months?

Good news Solo and well done to you and Rollo. It sounds as if everyone is relaxing a bit more and hpoefully you and your DC's wil start to enjoy him even more.
I am hoping we have turned a corner with Daisy- I cam home from work yesterday and the DC's were playing cricket with her and the neighbours in our drive. All having lots of fun and Daisy was not madly barking or jumping at people - just concentrating on her (very impressive) fielding.

Clam, I meant 7 WEEKS old not 7 months! Sorry

Yay! It all gets so much easier when you can enjoy them :)

Wow! You've been putting in the hours with this dog! Well done, and long may your success continue! It can take a long time to find a way to live with a dog and it sounds as though you are on the right track. Our youngest dog is now 2, and has lived with us for 18 months. It has taken this long to hopefully have a handle on his recall. It makes SUCH A DIFFERENCE!