The Handmaid's Tale Series 4 - finale coming up, no spoilers please.

[Clawdy]

New thread, looking forward to finale, but wishing it really was the last episode, with all storylines and characters ending satisfactorily.

Speaking of the last supper- we never got to see what the last supper dinner with all the aunts was about. It didn’t go anywhere.

@BattyOrange

Not sure why people who clearly don't enjoy it come on this thread and slag it off

Me neither. Who does that?

This thread is to discuss the Handmaids Tale . That's what we are doing, talking about what we liked and what we didn't like about the most recent episode.

I love the show, I really do but this season and last nights episode in particular has not been of the usual standard. Too many gaping plot holes, what feels like hours spent in close up focus on June's face and then last night the execution squad bused in from Canada to hunt down Fred in the conveniently near by and never before mentioned no-man's land.

This is a discussion thread not an echo chamber of fangirling delight.

Seeing them beating him to death made me feel sick. I didn't have any feelings of victory for June.

I agree too but maybe that was the point.

It wasn't my idea of a good revenge because I am not that sort of person. However, could I be pushed into being that sort of person by the ordeals she has gone through...? It's a sobering thought really.

I predict:

Janine becomes a trainee aunt. Something happens (bomb?) to the majority of aunts, bumping her up the hierarchy. June somehow finishes up as a handmaid again (completely implausible that she wouldn’t be executed but we’ve been there before!) and Janine gets her a placement with Nick, possibly somewhere near Hannah.

Massive tension between June and Nick’s wife. He actually finds himself torn between loyalty to June and discomfort with her behaviour towards his wife.

Aunt Lydia survives but is incapacitated. Recovers in time to throw massive spanner in the works. Or Janine somehow keeps her weak and helpless while pretending to help her.

Esther helps Janine/June build up Mayday while pretending to be an obedient handmaid.

Lawrence starts quietly working on getting Hannah out.

Serena somehow negotiates a release of some sort - possibly electronically tagged or similar. The baby is removed at birth - much trauma and screaming - and she has limited contact during care proceedings. She becomes involved with an underground pro-Gilead movement in Canada but is only using them for her own ends. Echoes of how the handmaids had to operate in secret and with tight restrictions. They finish up snatching the baby and smuggling him back into Giles’s much to her horror.

Fred’s death is spun in Gilead as the fault of Canada. He becomes a martyr symbol and is used in some way by some faction within the commander hierarchy.

Probably none of the above!

Oh and Luke and Moira have to go into hiding with Nicole due to the threat from the pro-Gilead group.

They have been repeatedly dehumanised, in part by being made to kill in this exact manner. Fred is reaping exactly what he has sown. His gilead punishment may well have been a beating to death by handmaids for raping June. The circle with their torches is just them carrying out the particicution circle as we have seen in previous series so I don't think that was far fetched. It was, after all, entirely premeditated and deliberate. They have been trained for this.

As well as a 'hello Nick' I think the kiss with Nick was designed to taunt Fred and his immense swaggering ego. He'd managed to delude himself that he had something special going on with 'offred' and this was quite the blow. A final statement that June is not and never was his possession.

@blessedbethechocolate

I found that last episode to be a bit crap. She would never have been allowed to be alone with Fred in that room. Plus the whole No man's land bit just seems implausible even though did anyone notice it was at the same place June and Hannah were captured? He fell by where they hid.

I just feel like this series is going to go the same way as all of these kind of shows where they drag them out to the point they are so ridiculous they end up being cancelled.

It's reminding me of the way The Affair went.

I’m trying to imagine the discussion between all those women, presumably led by June, to arrange the killing of Fred.

“So, ladies, thanks for meeting with me tonight at the library at such short notice. An opportunity has arisen that I think might interest some of you…”

I think the kiss was to show Fred how deluded he was- and what an actual passion between people looks like.

I suspect Serena shagged tuello as a way of trying to have some power over him. Didn't it work with Fred pre gilead? In the same way lady macbeth seems to use it with macbeth?
But I think it backfired for Serena, when she said she was going to play happy families with Fred.

I think tuello and Serena both thought they had the upper hand, but as always, the men win.

Yes, who knows what we would do if we had been dealt June's hand in life?

But, I have always maintained that if someone had done something truly awful to me or to one of my children and I had lost it and wanted my own revenge, that someone, either society or someone who loved me, would stop me, for my sake.

Nick went down in my estimations. Luke came out the stronger here. He couldn't fathom being with this version of June. It's too far.

Yes, I can see Joseph letting it happen and enjoying watching it play out. He would get a kick out of watching June turning into a blood lust killer. He enjoys watching the games. He seems to have an empathy bypass a lot of the time. (His wife excepted)

But, Nick? I would have preferred if he either stopped June and helped her see the madness in what she was doing. He didn't protect her from herself. He's a soldier in war. If it was to happen, then better he took Fred away and shot him. To save June doing it and how that would affect her for the rest of her life.

This didn't feel like it gave any of the women power. Quite the opposite. They are vulnerable people who have been through trauma of the worst kind. They don't need to be encouraged or given freedom to go through or relive more trauma.

As an aside, I know Moira was at the window when June left so I presumed she wasn't part of it. But we did see some of her anger when she was saying that June should go to Geneva. When we saw the women walking back through the woods was Moira there? Anyone who has watched it again see her?

My thought is that June will throw all her energies into finding and “rescuing” Hannah and somehow the plot will lead to June, Hannah and Nick all getting to Canada. By that point Luke will refuse to hand Nicole over, saying that he and Moira are the only parents she knows and June will realise that she’s put Nicole in the same position that Hannah was in - non biological parents who love and care for her (although in a free country). It would be an interesting plot point anyway. She’s not going to have a happy ending with Nick or Luke - there’s too much pain between them all.

@Breathmiller @OverByYer

Completely agree about the kiss. Definitely seemed like June and Nick were getting off on the thought of torture.

I would have much preferred if the handmaids had all given him a good kicking and then sent him back to face trial in Gilead. If he needed to be torn apart by handmaids then fine, but don't make June part of it. I know that they are trying to make things "realistic" but at the end of the day it's a TV show and I want to be rooting for the protagonist.

I get why they did this scene but it just made me feel really uneasy.

@MrsRobbieHart

I’m trying to imagine the discussion between all those women, presumably led by June, to arrange the killing of Fred.

“So, ladies, thanks for meeting with me tonight at the library at such short notice. An opportunity has arisen that I think might interest some of you…”

😂

@StrongCoffeAvalanche

Well I loved the episode. I hope there's another season to see the downfall of Serena

I think Serena is going to rise!

We already saw that there was a groundswell of Gilead/Waterford support after Fred’s speech about how successful Gilead was with birthrate figures (glossing over how of course). .Serena is an excellent communicator, vey manipulative , highly intelligent, very personable and will have public sympathy because of the manner of Fred’s death, which will probably be enough to win her freedom from Posh People’s Prison. I think she will become the acceptable face of Gilead Lite in Canada, it already looks as though she is getting fan mail that doesn’t include fingers, she has access to the internet and is building up contacts.

I think she has something to prove to herself, she knows a lot of Fred’s success was piggybacked on her initial work for Gilead before the Commanders corrupted it. She is now having a child, which is something she never thought she could do , so in her mind she can do anything.

What can go wrong? Tragic Selena, abused and mutilated by Fred but still strong and beautiful, raising her son in faith by going back to the initial concepts that formed Gilead. She will be the figurehead of a growing Gilead Canada cult before Tuello realises it.

@iamreally

I think there's more to come with Tuello and Serena. My theory is that the baby is his, given his reaction when Serena says that she and Fred are going to live together on his return from Geneva. In retaliation, Tuello hands Fred over to Gilead, knowing he'll be executed

Yes, I think the baby is Tuello's, too.

I think Fred being dead makes Serena's return to Gileadess likely - they know she won't be allowed to be a single parent there.

I agree Serena will rise out of this. She is a deadly package - super intelligent, cunning and ruthless are wrapped up in a pretty, media friendly package.

Wonder what her new book is about? Could Serena architect a second revolution in Canada, built on the bones of the first but with a group of elite females (like her) at the helm in place of the Gilead patriarchy?

Was that really Fred's body on the wall or is he going to turn up again? There's a reason they made the corpse headless and wearing a different coat 🤔

While I agree that it isn’t true to ‘life’ as we know it, I do think the characters are fantastic and each displaying different sides of the same thing. For Moira, the revenge she so seeks would have been going to Geneva. She’s angry too but she still has trust and belief in the ‘system.’

For me, it all comes back to the patriarchy and how women across the world are controlled by it. Luke represents the ‘every man’ in that he’s nice but largely ineffective. He cares for the women in his life but will turn his face when the ugliness of what men can do impacts on his life (when June comes back and knows she has to leave.)

Tuello represents the ‘system’ obviously, who will punish the patriarchy only when it benefits them but will take bigger gains over fully and wholly realising the trauma that belongs to women.

Nick… tbh, I think nick is just an every man like Luke, just further down the line. He’s worse than Luke in many ways because he actually facilitates the machine designed to destroy the women but will step outside that for his own interests (June) and I find that quite off putting.

I don’t feel like THT is about seeing June win anymore, or even liking her. I feel like it is an exaggeration of the state of the world today.

Could Serena architect a second revolution in Canada, built on the bones of the first but with a group of elite females (like her) at the helm in place of the Gilead patriarchy?

Totally this! That is exactly what I would expect serena to do. She built it before, she learned from it, she knows the mistakes in her previous regime, she will be able to design it to give herself the power. She has the support, she has no husband she has to defer to or make a show of respect to. She’ll find something in the bible that says a woman in her situation has a duty to God to raise her child alone in this new world.

@Crinkle77 " Oh honestly this is absurd."
My sentiment too.

I watched the finale some weeks back - In Ireland it was shown before Channel4.
I've been waiting patiently for the comments on the finale on this thread.

Disappointed that the show sank into melodrama.

No man's land has definitely been mentioned before.

@MrsRobbieHart

Could Serena architect a second revolution in Canada, built on the bones of the first but with a group of elite females (like her) at the helm in place of the Gilead patriarchy?

Totally this! That is exactly what I would expect serena to do. She built it before, she learned from it, she knows the mistakes in her previous regime, she will be able to design it to give herself the power. She has the support, she has no husband she has to defer to or make a show of respect to. She’ll find something in the bible that says a woman in her situation has a duty to God to raise her child alone in this new world.

Love this theory ! Serena is totally capable of this

@AuntLydiasNewHairdo

No man's land has definitely been mentioned before.

Yep. There are a few different maps that show it

Does Serena even feel that passionately about Gilead? She's seen the rot and there have been a few places where she seemed uncertain. I think she's motivated purely by a need to survive at all costs and by a need to be respected and worshipped to an extent. I suspect she's going the chat show route, rather than developing a new state.